F1 style transmission?
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F1 style transmission? I'm going to be building a new car pretty soon, and I'm pretty sure I'm going to be forced to put a sequential transmission in it. Since it takes the fun out of driving stick anyways, I was thinking, is there any way to convert in into a F1 style tranny, i.e. a manual trans shifted by paddles on the steering wheel and not a gear lever?
I'm going to be using a Motec ECU which has provisions for flat shifting (cutting the ignition to allow clutchless shifting). Since it's a sequential transmission, it almost seems like you could just wire up linear actuators on either side of the stick and have them move the gear selector for you. Is this feasible or are the complexities too great? If so, is there something like this already on the market (excluding autos w/ full manual valve-bodies)?
I'm going to be using a Motec ECU which has provisions for flat shifting (cutting the ignition to allow clutchless shifting). Since it's a sequential transmission, it almost seems like you could just wire up linear actuators on either side of the stick and have them move the gear selector for you. Is this feasible or are the complexities too great? If so, is there something like this already on the market (excluding autos w/ full manual valve-bodies)?
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it has been done on bike engines loads! also alot of high end racing boxes that are already sequential can be converted to "power shift"!!
i think its a great idea! as you said you get flat to the floor changers (great with turbos) and the down charngers sound really good!
all you need to do is convert the boc to a sequential shift (it can be done for stock H patern boxes as there are kits for Porsche and Evo boxes) and then get a power shift kit! this could be the hard part! i know there is a company over here in the UK doing on for bikes (its just a simple solenoid style ram that moves the shifter forward and you can get pneumatic)!
personaly i dont see the need! with a motec and a sequential shift you are going to be nearly as fast a a prue power shift but with a lot less hasstle!
just my thoughts and i will try and get the contacts for that company.
thanks Chris.
i think its a great idea! as you said you get flat to the floor changers (great with turbos) and the down charngers sound really good!
all you need to do is convert the boc to a sequential shift (it can be done for stock H patern boxes as there are kits for Porsche and Evo boxes) and then get a power shift kit! this could be the hard part! i know there is a company over here in the UK doing on for bikes (its just a simple solenoid style ram that moves the shifter forward and you can get pneumatic)!
personaly i dont see the need! with a motec and a sequential shift you are going to be nearly as fast a a prue power shift but with a lot less hasstle!
just my thoughts and i will try and get the contacts for that company.
thanks Chris.
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From: Finland
Theres a aftermarket Paddle-shift kit for alot of automatics out there. But nothing that I know of for manual, the actuators seem to be a good idea if you can get them adjusted perfectly.
Even prior to Sequentials, in Formulas (1s, 3000s, 3s, 4s, Fords and I believe Renaults) you would not clutch, just force it into gear (and this is thanks to Spur gears vs helical street gears). There was no cutting of ignition, no letting off throttle, no clutching...
Edit: One idea, theyre are those "air shifters" for dragsters, maybe that could somehow be modified to work?
Even prior to Sequentials, in Formulas (1s, 3000s, 3s, 4s, Fords and I believe Renaults) you would not clutch, just force it into gear (and this is thanks to Spur gears vs helical street gears). There was no cutting of ignition, no letting off throttle, no clutching...
Edit: One idea, theyre are those "air shifters" for dragsters, maybe that could somehow be modified to work?
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From: England
Originally Posted by NoGamesLS1
The 6l60e that they use in the new vettes are 6 speeds with paddle shifting I believe. Thats something Ive been thinking about too. I really like the idea
A sequential box is a proper manual gearbox (no torque converter well not the same as it has a clutch), also the gears are in line (hence sequential) so you can only go to them in order 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 and so on, and back down 4 - 3 - 2 - 1 where as a regualr manual or auto can jump gears, 4th to 2nd block changes or kickdown with an auto.
It's a nice idea in the Corvette but it is a faux setup as you have no more control or abilty than you would with a regular automatic.
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From: England
Originally Posted by Zeus
I'm going to be building a new car pretty soon, and I'm pretty sure I'm going to be forced to put a sequential transmission in it. Since it takes the fun out of driving stick anyways, I was thinking, is there any way to convert in into a F1 style tranny, i.e. a manual trans shifted by paddles on the steering wheel and not a gear lever?
I'm going to be using a Motec ECU which has provisions for flat shifting (cutting the ignition to allow clutchless shifting). Since it's a sequential transmission, it almost seems like you could just wire up linear actuators on either side of the stick and have them move the gear selector for you. Is this feasible or are the complexities too great? If so, is there something like this already on the market (excluding autos w/ full manual valve-bodies)?
I'm going to be using a Motec ECU which has provisions for flat shifting (cutting the ignition to allow clutchless shifting). Since it's a sequential transmission, it almost seems like you could just wire up linear actuators on either side of the stick and have them move the gear selector for you. Is this feasible or are the complexities too great? If so, is there something like this already on the market (excluding autos w/ full manual valve-bodies)?
Peugeot got the paddle think working well but it did take them over a year to iron out the bugs with it.
Friends of mine are dealers for X-Trac they can get you a sequential transmission.They are not autos but full straight non shynchro boxes.. This trans will cost you about 30 to 35k X Trac's main buisness is F1 stuff...
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its not mate! you can pick up a nice 5 speed sequential box for moderat powered cars for less than $10K over here! these things are def club racing pieces of kit nowadays!
and a convertion kit for a Evo box to sequential (its only the shifter after all!!!!) is about $3k so not soooo exspencive!
Chris.
and a convertion kit for a Evo box to sequential (its only the shifter after all!!!!) is about $3k so not soooo exspencive!
Chris.
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From: Finland
Originally Posted by chuntington101
its not mate! you can pick up a nice 5 speed sequential box for moderat powered cars for less than $10K over here! these things are def club racing pieces of kit nowadays!
and a convertion kit for a Evo box to sequential (its only the shifter after all!!!!) is about $3k so not soooo exspencive!
Chris.
and a convertion kit for a Evo box to sequential (its only the shifter after all!!!!) is about $3k so not soooo exspencive!
Chris.
Yeah but whos wants something that will only handle moderate HP might as well put a 10 bolt in it....I think unless your going to do some hard core road racing the sequential shift is a novelty....look at the G Force GF 5 I think it is... thats a nice trans
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Originally Posted by CTSmechanic
Yeah but whos wants something that will only handle moderate HP might as well put a 10 bolt in it....I think unless your going to do some hard core road racing the sequential shift is a novelty....look at the G Force GF 5 I think it is... thats a nice trans
Unless there are products out there I don't know about, it seems like the only manual gear boxes that can handle that type of power are sequential race types. Actually now that I'm thinking about it, what about the transmissions they use in supras? It seems like 1200 FWHP is basically a joke to them and I'm almost positive there's at least one in the 8's on a stock 6-speed. Would this be worth looking into or would the low end torque of the TT SBC tear it apart?
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well you havr to forget about BHP when talking about any transmitions! its the torque that destroys them.
how much peak torque are the supra guys putting down??? cat be anywhere near what the a twin turbo V8 will be putting out! you could get around this by mapping some of the torque out in the mid range to limit the damge to the box!
what about custom gear sets??? reduce the tooth count and run them as thick and as big as you can! with a dog box you can ditch the syncros and make a little more room (i think).
Chris.
how much peak torque are the supra guys putting down??? cat be anywhere near what the a twin turbo V8 will be putting out! you could get around this by mapping some of the torque out in the mid range to limit the damge to the box!
what about custom gear sets??? reduce the tooth count and run them as thick and as big as you can! with a dog box you can ditch the syncros and make a little more room (i think).
Chris.
My point has nothing to do with a T56 or a shynchro for that matter...G Force makes a trans that is run in a lot of pro stock drag as well as sports car racing that is a 5 speed non shynchro trans with several hundred ratios avalible... a turbo set up would like nice wide splits in the ratios to allow the motor to produce boost the trans can handle 1400 HP and 10,000 RPM's The Supras run a Getrac transmission made in Germany... I belive...
On The Tree
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a t-56 rebuild with g force gears and a trans brace has held 1300rwhp
and as for the actuator astin martin is running a t-56 with paddle shifter in the v12 vanquish. From what I heard ford worked on this setup.
and a ford mustang race car has the same paddle shifter setup making 800 hp.
and as for the actuator astin martin is running a t-56 with paddle shifter in the v12 vanquish. From what I heard ford worked on this setup.
and a ford mustang race car has the same paddle shifter setup making 800 hp.
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From: Atlanta, GA
Originally Posted by blown2kss
and as for the actuator astin martin is running a t-56 rebuild with g force gears and a trans brace has held 1300rwhp
Hell to be honest, the BMW SMG tranny is pretty crappy too*, but since the Aston has been reffered to as being even worse... I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole.
Anyhow, my two cents, YMMV
*PS My M3 is a regular 6-speed I've driven a dozen or more SMG M3's and have hated them all.
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sequential is deff your best bet. you just need to hook up either an air cylinder and run a mini compressor and tank or find a solenoid operated linear actuator, these things are super fast but hard to find in the correct force requirements. air shifting and clutchless shifters are used alot on our FSAE cars.