Menzerna/Porter cable detail phase 1 done, question
10-10-2005, 12:52 PM
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Menzerna/Porter cable detail phase 1 done, question Well yesterday I started to detail the SS, I used the Porter Cable random orbital buffer and the Menzerna Final polish II, and so far the car looks great! I clayed it first of course, and then started at it. I need to get the compound polish they make as my hood has some water spots that didn't come out 
I will be going to phase 2 which is the Menzerna Finishing touch glaze, followed by the FMJ. The car sure looks nice when it's clean and shiny
This is a LOT of work though, takes forever, I can see why people charge so much to fully detail a car.
My question is that I do what they say with the PC, figure 8 motions, etc. But how hard do you push and do you notice that the pad doesn't spin as much as I thought it would, it mostly just vibrates.
Thanks for any tips, so far it looks good, hopefully the Intensive Polish gets the water spots out
I will be going to phase 2 which is the Menzerna Finishing touch glaze, followed by the FMJ. The car sure looks nice when it's clean and shiny
This is a LOT of work though, takes forever, I can see why people charge so much to fully detail a car.
My question is that I do what they say with the PC, figure 8 motions, etc. But how hard do you push and do you notice that the pad doesn't spin as much as I thought it would, it mostly just vibrates.
Thanks for any tips, so far it looks good, hopefully the Intensive Polish gets the water spots out
10-10-2005, 02:02 PM
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Hopefully the 'water' spots you speak of are just that - and not acid rain spots. Because if they are - there's no amount of buffing that will take them out. Only way to get rid of them is to take the panel down & repaint. 
I clayed my Black T/A only the first time. After that, any time I polish I start with the Menzerna Intensive Polish - then go to the Final Polish - then wax.
If you would have used the Intensive Polish 1st, you might find that the marks that won't come out - would have. After using the IP the FP is easy On & easy Off - no need for working it hard as the IP did all the work.
The more pressure you put down on the buffer - the less it will spin - if you leave up on the pressure the pad will spin more. Personally I don't know which is better but I usually don't have much spin during the IP step - much more when doing the FP.
I clayed my Black T/A only the first time. After that, any time I polish I start with the Menzerna Intensive Polish - then go to the Final Polish - then wax.
If you would have used the Intensive Polish 1st, you might find that the marks that won't come out - would have. After using the IP the FP is easy On & easy Off - no need for working it hard as the IP did all the work.
The more pressure you put down on the buffer - the less it will spin - if you leave up on the pressure the pad will spin more. Personally I don't know which is better but I usually don't have much spin during the IP step - much more when doing the FP.
10-10-2005, 02:41 PM
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/me cracks his knuckles...
OK, let's start with the water spots. I am very surprised there are water spots that the claybar did not remove. Are you sure they're water spots and not scratches? Try re-claying those spots first, then hit them with the polish. If the clay doesn't do it, get a more abrasive pad (like an orange) and use that with the Intensive Polish.
Pressure - I don't tend to press really hard when I use my PC. Typically, if there is a stubborn spot, I either turn up the speed or make multiple passes before I start applying more pressure. The best way I can describe what I do is "firm". The pad doesn't spin around so freely that it splatters, but it also doesn't "bind". The PC works because of the pad material (rougher=more cut, obviously), the polish itself, the oscillation, and the heat generated by going over a particular area.
Spinning - While the pad does spin, what you are after is oscillation. Think about the lessons from Mr. Miyagi in The Karate Kid. "Wax on/Wax off" was a circular motion. Daniel-san didn't spin his hands to wax Mr. Miyagi's cars, he made circles. A PC works the same way. It will spin somewhat, especially if it isn't against the surface, but its main function is to oscillate. If you find it spinning a lot, put a little more pressure down.
This stuff takes a little practice, but the ends justify the means.
Now, ****** the pebble from my hand, Grasshopper.
-Mike
OK, let's start with the water spots. I am very surprised there are water spots that the claybar did not remove. Are you sure they're water spots and not scratches? Try re-claying those spots first, then hit them with the polish. If the clay doesn't do it, get a more abrasive pad (like an orange) and use that with the Intensive Polish.
Pressure - I don't tend to press really hard when I use my PC. Typically, if there is a stubborn spot, I either turn up the speed or make multiple passes before I start applying more pressure. The best way I can describe what I do is "firm". The pad doesn't spin around so freely that it splatters, but it also doesn't "bind". The PC works because of the pad material (rougher=more cut, obviously), the polish itself, the oscillation, and the heat generated by going over a particular area.
Spinning - While the pad does spin, what you are after is oscillation. Think about the lessons from Mr. Miyagi in The Karate Kid. "Wax on/Wax off" was a circular motion. Daniel-san didn't spin his hands to wax Mr. Miyagi's cars, he made circles. A PC works the same way. It will spin somewhat, especially if it isn't against the surface, but its main function is to oscillate. If you find it spinning a lot, put a little more pressure down.
This stuff takes a little practice, but the ends justify the means.
Now, ****** the pebble from my hand, Grasshopper.
-Mike
10-10-2005, 03:51 PM
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Great info guys!!! I thought the kit came with the Intensive Polish for the swirls, water spots, etc. But I tried the Final Polish II with the white pad first, the water spots stayed. I then swapped to the Orange pad and hit them again, they are still there. So I hope the Intensive Polish works, it's on the way (I ordered it today), if it doesn't then the hood needs to be wetsanded, etc. Oh well.
So far the rest of the car is looking great, I just neglected the car for a few weeks and it rained, so the water spots are definitely water spots.
I will keep hitting the hood/spots and see if they start to go away. Thanks for the info, so far I really like the look, and I'm sure it will keep getting better with the FMJ, etc treatments.
So far the rest of the car is looking great, I just neglected the car for a few weeks and it rained, so the water spots are definitely water spots.
I will keep hitting the hood/spots and see if they start to go away. Thanks for the info, so far I really like the look, and I'm sure it will keep getting better with the FMJ, etc treatments.
10-10-2005, 06:22 PM
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I got the Menzerna Reference Shine Kit http://www.properautocare.com/reshkit.html from properautocare as the sticky link above told me about them.
I'm using the 3 1/2 speed like the instructions say to. Is that wrong??
I'm using the 3 1/2 speed like the instructions say to. Is that wrong??
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10-10-2005, 06:39 PM
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I use speed 6 for IP and speed 5 for FP. Apply more pressure than the weight of the machine, but don't bog the pad down to the point it stops spinning freely. Work each section front, back, side, side, and diagonally each direction.
10-10-2005, 07:05 PM
#10
Use speed 6 for stubborn spots, I had a pretty good scuff where someone smacked the car with their door, speed 6 an orange pad, and some pressure, along with the IP took it right out.
All it takes is practice.
As for Menzerna vs Tropi-care, I haven't used the Tropi-care, but I like the way Menzerna makes my black T/A look, plus it was originally formulated for Mercedes to fix any factory flaws in the paint, and if it's good enough for MB, then it's good enough for me
All it takes is practice.
As for Menzerna vs Tropi-care, I haven't used the Tropi-care, but I like the way Menzerna makes my black T/A look, plus it was originally formulated for Mercedes to fix any factory flaws in the paint, and if it's good enough for MB, then it's good enough for me
10-10-2005, 07:42 PM
#12
Originally Posted by meissenation
Don't spend too much time on one spot or press too hard, I burned right through my clear coat on a spot right behind my antenna.
10-10-2005, 07:50 PM
#13
Sadly, yeah. I had a rock chip in my paint, so I used touchup paint and used thin layers, built up enough layers that it was higher than the surrounding paint. Turned the buffer on, I used Sonus SFX-1 though not a Menzerna product, but in any case put the buffer on, really worked at it for awhile. Didn't know what I was doing, so I was pushing harder than I obviously should've been and letting it really work in the same spot, now the clearcoat's gone, no matter what I do to try and bring it back, it's a dull "fogged" spot. At first I thought something happened to the clearcoat, so I tried *lightly* polishing and the pad turned red from pure paint coming off.
Edit: Needless to say, on the rest of the rock chips, I learned to very lightly wetsand with 2000 grit sandpaper, and then very lightly buff out with the PC.
Edit: Needless to say, on the rest of the rock chips, I learned to very lightly wetsand with 2000 grit sandpaper, and then very lightly buff out with the PC.
10-10-2005, 08:11 PM
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OUCH! That's the first time I've ever heard of someone doing that with a PC. Sorry that happened to you, Meissenation. Hopefully others will learn from that.
Orange, I would try the IP/orange pad combo on about 4 or 4.5. I rarely go past that speed on mine because I just don't feel like I have good control past that.
-Mike
Orange, I would try the IP/orange pad combo on about 4 or 4.5. I rarely go past that speed on mine because I just don't feel like I have good control past that.
-Mike
10-10-2005, 08:32 PM
#17
A picture is worth a thousand words (56k don't even try)
http://members.***.net/akelly12/P9252567.JPG
http://members.***.net/akelly12/P9252565.JPG
And the reflection shot
http://members.***.net/akelly12/P4192102.JPG
http://members.***.net/akelly12/P9252567.JPG
http://members.***.net/akelly12/P9252565.JPG
And the reflection shot
http://members.***.net/akelly12/P4192102.JPG
10-10-2005, 09:20 PM
#20
Originally Posted by ZaneO
Menzerna polishes are very good. I've heard less flattering things about the glaze and sealant though.