Getting new rad should I get one with internal cooler ?
02-06-2010, 02:31 PM
#1
Getting new rad should I get one with internal cooler ? I am getting a new rad and not sure if should get one with internal trans cooler or not.I will of course run external cooler but my car was originally a t56 car so no internal cooler in current rad.
The external cooler running now don't really seem to do all that much and not sure wanted to run dual externals or fan type externals. I was looking into getting this deep derale 4l80 pan with these cooling tubes but not sure have the ground clearance ,this pan is pretty deep compared to stock types.
So figure if used the rad cooler and one external likely wouldn't need the deep pan. Might still get a cast pan with near stock clearance and just external fins then. Does running the tranny fluid thru the rad really increase engine coolant temps? Also I live in colder place and my car does seen some temps a bit below 0F in spring and fall sometimes so think good idea to have the trans fluid going thru rad and then into cooler since external cooler is not a temp controlled type.
Opinions on this..I have heard of a few guys when rad started leaking coolant into trans or vice versa but every factory car runs this setup so that problem can't be too common. Fact I have never had it happen to me on any vehicle I have owned. Also going to be getting top of line radiator like Ron Davis not some cheap one.
I drive a lot in heavy city traffic not much highway. I have 3400 stall in my 4l80 swap.
The external cooler running now don't really seem to do all that much and not sure wanted to run dual externals or fan type externals. I was looking into getting this deep derale 4l80 pan with these cooling tubes but not sure have the ground clearance ,this pan is pretty deep compared to stock types.
So figure if used the rad cooler and one external likely wouldn't need the deep pan. Might still get a cast pan with near stock clearance and just external fins then. Does running the tranny fluid thru the rad really increase engine coolant temps? Also I live in colder place and my car does seen some temps a bit below 0F in spring and fall sometimes so think good idea to have the trans fluid going thru rad and then into cooler since external cooler is not a temp controlled type.
Opinions on this..I have heard of a few guys when rad started leaking coolant into trans or vice versa but every factory car runs this setup so that problem can't be too common. Fact I have never had it happen to me on any vehicle I have owned. Also going to be getting top of line radiator like Ron Davis not some cheap one.
I drive a lot in heavy city traffic not much highway. I have 3400 stall in my 4l80 swap.
02-07-2010, 04:18 PM
#3
i just did the a stall swap to a ss4000 and accidentally cranked my rad. in the process. so i had to get a new one. everyone i found for m6 car still had the tranny adapters but were blocked off with caps. The aftermarket one i got was actually thicker than the stocker. If i lived in Canada i would have prob ran tranny fluid through rad than cooler. But bc i live in south carolina i just did one massive cooler.
02-07-2010, 04:29 PM
#5
Heat is the number one enemy of a transmission. The more cooling you have available the lower your tranny temps are going to be. Driving in town will have the tranny and engine temps up higher than driving highway.
Go with the extra cooling with the internal cooler in the radiator along with an external cooler. Tranny life will be doubled. Its cheap insurance!
Go with the extra cooling with the internal cooler in the radiator along with an external cooler. Tranny life will be doubled. Its cheap insurance!
02-07-2010, 04:36 PM
#6
i said run it though the rad in cold climates so that the tranny fluid would warn up faster. i personally think that tranny fluid operates better a little warn vs cold startup. not hot and not cold.
02-08-2010, 01:23 AM
#7
Your tranny fluid is climbing upwards of over 250 degrees and your engine coolant is running around 180 degrees depending on your specific thermostat. So as the 250deg tranny fluid passes the cooling coils filled with "cold" 180degree coolant, the tranny fluid is getting cooled toward the lower temp of 180 degrees. Its not rocket science.
The higher capacity of cooling, the better. (IE: radiator tank and a external tranny cooler).
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02-08-2010, 08:05 AM
#8
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I observed higher temps with internal/external coolers then with just one external cooler. Bc the engine's coolant HEATS UP THE TRANS FLUID. Anyone who thinks you will run cooler using the radiator is an idiot. Tha radiator is a heat source. If I lived in cold climates I would hook it up during the cold months exactly bc of that reason
02-08-2010, 08:09 AM
#9
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And remauto, before you suggest that trans fluid over the 180 coolant temp, the radiator would cool the trans fluid. Yes, this may be true, however my transmission never runs 190 where my coolant runs, so it will never act as a cooler, only a heater.
02-08-2010, 08:41 AM
#10
Operates better? What on earth are you TRYING to say? Whatever it is...ITS WRONG!
Your tranny fluid is climbing upwards of over 250 degrees and your engine coolant is running around 180 degrees depending on your specific thermostat. So as the 250deg tranny fluid passes the cooling coils filled with "cold" 180degree coolant, the tranny fluid is getting cooled toward the lower temp of 180 degrees. Its not rocket science.
The higher capacity of cooling, the better. (IE: radiator tank and a external tranny cooler).
Your tranny fluid is climbing upwards of over 250 degrees and your engine coolant is running around 180 degrees depending on your specific thermostat. So as the 250deg tranny fluid passes the cooling coils filled with "cold" 180degree coolant, the tranny fluid is getting cooled toward the lower temp of 180 degrees. Its not rocket science.
The higher capacity of cooling, the better. (IE: radiator tank and a external tranny cooler).
im not even sure if the radiator even routes the tranny fluid though any fins. if you look at it, it looks like it just runs down the plastic side and is blocked off from any fins. damn, i had a old rad that i should have cut open and found out.
02-08-2010, 03:17 PM
#12
To the OP, if you are concerned about really cold weather, put a thermostatically controlled valve on the cooler line.
Using the radiator as a cooler is designed for a vehicle where the engine coolant is at 210 degrees and the transmission temp (non-cooled) is 250 degrees.
On my car, with a 160 degree thermostat the coolant is around 180-190 degrees (the 160 number is when it starts to open, not when it is fully open).
My stalled transmission with an external cooler consistently runs around 160 degrees (measured with an Autometer gauge with the sending unit mounted on the transmission).
So if I put the radiator back in line it would cause the transmission to run hotter, not cooler.
Put another way, when I purchased my sponsor-built transmission, they told me that keeping the radiator in-line would void the warranty. Think about it.
Using the radiator as a cooler is designed for a vehicle where the engine coolant is at 210 degrees and the transmission temp (non-cooled) is 250 degrees.
On my car, with a 160 degree thermostat the coolant is around 180-190 degrees (the 160 number is when it starts to open, not when it is fully open).
My stalled transmission with an external cooler consistently runs around 160 degrees (measured with an Autometer gauge with the sending unit mounted on the transmission).
So if I put the radiator back in line it would cause the transmission to run hotter, not cooler.
Put another way, when I purchased my sponsor-built transmission, they told me that keeping the radiator in-line would void the warranty. Think about it.
02-08-2010, 03:28 PM
#13
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I just bypassed mine, it seems to run maybe a lil cooler, but defiantly not hotter. The real big difference i saw with it is that it doesn't get hot as quick.
02-08-2010, 07:48 PM
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02-09-2010, 02:55 AM
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im not sure how the internals work exactly. But i thought the fiuld was always in circulation even through the cooler. Someone with more knowledge in that area correct me if im wrong.
