3200 to 4000rpm Stall question ???
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 10
From: Las Vegas NV
3200 to 4000rpm Stall question ??? All of you guys used 3200 to 4K stall did it with the factory cam?
My car bone stock did 13.91 101miles. Now i installed a set of Jet hot 1 3/4 and a mufflex 4" and ran 13.74@102 with 2.73 gears. Next event is Dic.2 and i going to put 3.42 gears SSRA a drag pack Bogarts with 275/50/15MT and play for now with Predator programmer. Hope to cut 1/2 second and like 3 to 5 miles trap speed. But next my concern is, what stall? So i can use anywhere from 3200k to 4000k stall with the factory camshaft?
My car bone stock did 13.91 101miles. Now i installed a set of Jet hot 1 3/4 and a mufflex 4" and ran 13.74@102 with 2.73 gears. Next event is Dic.2 and i going to put 3.42 gears SSRA a drag pack Bogarts with 275/50/15MT and play for now with Predator programmer. Hope to cut 1/2 second and like 3 to 5 miles trap speed. But next my concern is, what stall? So i can use anywhere from 3200k to 4000k stall with the factory camshaft?
TECH Junkie
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 3,913
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From: White Bear, Mn
All of you guys used 3200 to 4K stall did it with the factory cam?
My car bone stock did 13.91 101miles. Now i installed a set of Jet hot 1 3/4 and a mufflex 4" and ran 13.74@102 with 2.73 gears. Next event is Dic.2 and i going to put 3.42 gears SSRA a drag pack Bogarts with 275/50/15MT and play for now with Predator programmer. Hope to cut 1/2 second and like 3 to 5 miles trap speed. But next my concern is, what stall? So i can use anywhere from 3200k to 4000k stall with the factory camshaft?
My car bone stock did 13.91 101miles. Now i installed a set of Jet hot 1 3/4 and a mufflex 4" and ran 13.74@102 with 2.73 gears. Next event is Dic.2 and i going to put 3.42 gears SSRA a drag pack Bogarts with 275/50/15MT and play for now with Predator programmer. Hope to cut 1/2 second and like 3 to 5 miles trap speed. But next my concern is, what stall? So i can use anywhere from 3200k to 4000k stall with the factory camshaft?
A good way to look at it is look at a stock ls1 dyno graph.... Now see how much power you are making at 3200 rpm's as opposed to 4000 rpm's.
This is a quick run down of my car.
100% bone stock A4 2.73 car 13.8@101 mph
Lt's, tune, drag radial. 13.2@107 mph
3.73's, yank ss3600 12.2@111 mph
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 34,611
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
I would do the stall upgrade before worrying about a gear swap. There isn't much to be gained from a 2.73 to 3.42 swap once you already have a 3500+ stall speed in place. The biggest gain at that point would be a tighter feel at part throttle - which is a bigger deal to some than others.
Is your track at high elevation? What was the DA on that 102mph run? That's very slow for an LS1 with LT headers + full exhaust, unless the DA was poor. Was it tuned for the headers?
I found a 3500 stall speed to be great with the stock cam. But 4000 would also work well, though at this range and above is when part throttle "looseness" starts to become more noticeable IMO. Some folks are more bothered by looseness than others. 3500 felt as natural as stock to me after a few drives. SS3600 would be a good current choice.
Is your track at high elevation? What was the DA on that 102mph run? That's very slow for an LS1 with LT headers + full exhaust, unless the DA was poor. Was it tuned for the headers?
I found a 3500 stall speed to be great with the stock cam. But 4000 would also work well, though at this range and above is when part throttle "looseness" starts to become more noticeable IMO. Some folks are more bothered by looseness than others. 3500 felt as natural as stock to me after a few drives. SS3600 would be a good current choice.
Yes I'm running a 4000 stall with the stock cam. My convertor is on the looser side of things but that does not bother me. If at all possible try to drive some friends car that has a 4K stall or higher and maybe one with a 32-3600 stall speed to get the feel before you buy it. That may not be possible for you but if it is, definitely do it before you buy so you will be happy with your purchase.
Moderator
Joined: Aug 2010
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From: Ann Arbor, MI
With a stock cam, I doubt the 4000 stall would be any quicker at the track than the 3600; and as stated the 4000 stall will feel very loose to a newbie around town.
If you want to spend $500-$800 and 5-6 hour labor, you might consider a cam upgrade instead. A cam is $400, but you might need new springs too.
If you want to spend $500-$800 and 5-6 hour labor, you might consider a cam upgrade instead. A cam is $400, but you might need new springs too.
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 10
From: Las Vegas NV
Yes you can use a 4000 stall with the stock cam.
A good way to look at it is look at a stock ls1 dyno graph.... Now see how much power you are making at 3200 rpm's as opposed to 4000 rpm's.
This is a quick run down of my car.
100% bone stock A4 2.73 car 13.8@101 mph
Lt's, tune, drag radial. 13.2@107 mph
3.73's, yank ss3600 12.2@111 mph
A good way to look at it is look at a stock ls1 dyno graph.... Now see how much power you are making at 3200 rpm's as opposed to 4000 rpm's.
This is a quick run down of my car.
100% bone stock A4 2.73 car 13.8@101 mph
Lt's, tune, drag radial. 13.2@107 mph
3.73's, yank ss3600 12.2@111 mph
"I was talking to a friend today and i going to do a dyno run to order the converter using that information."
"The results with your 3.73 and stall is impressive. Is the first time i decided to mess with the 4l60e and stall converter. That is why Im looking in deep what you guys are doing."
I would do the stall upgrade before worrying about a gear swap. There isn't much to be gained from a 2.73 to 3.42 swap once you already have a 3500+ stall speed in place. The biggest gain at that point would be a tighter feel at part throttle - which is a bigger deal to some than others.
Is your track at high elevation? What was the DA on that 102mph run? That's very slow for an LS1 with LT headers + full exhaust, unless the DA was poor. Was it tuned for the headers?
I found a 3500 stall speed to be great with the stock cam. But 4000 would also work well, though at this range and above is when part throttle "looseness" starts to become more noticeable IMO. Some folks are more bothered by looseness than others. 3500 felt as natural as stock to me after a few drives. SS3600 would be a good current choice.
Is your track at high elevation? What was the DA on that 102mph run? That's very slow for an LS1 with LT headers + full exhaust, unless the DA was poor. Was it tuned for the headers?
I found a 3500 stall speed to be great with the stock cam. But 4000 would also work well, though at this range and above is when part throttle "looseness" starts to become more noticeable IMO. Some folks are more bothered by looseness than others. 3500 felt as natural as stock to me after a few drives. SS3600 would be a good current choice.
"Yes i know my trap speed is low. I moved a year ago from Puerto Rico that is sea level to Las Vegas 3700 feet above sea level and dry air with most of the year over 95 degrees. The run with LT was with 90 dregree temp. and like 25 to 30% humidity and like 30 in var.pressure. I know need to tune the car play it to make it work better. "
Good to know.Thanks
Yes I'm running a 4000 stall with the stock cam. My convertor is on the looser side of things but that does not bother me. If at all possible try to drive some friends car that has a 4K stall or higher and maybe one with a 32-3600 stall speed to get the feel before you buy it. That may not be possible for you but if it is, definitely do it before you buy so you will be happy with your purchase.
Very nice input from you guys. So know now i can not be wrong with 36-4000 stall in my car.
Last edited by fastsspr; Nov 4, 2016 at 04:01 PM.
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 10
From: Las Vegas NV
Yes I'm running a 4000 stall with the stock cam. My convertor is on the looser side of things but that does not bother me. If at all possible try to drive some friends car that has a 4K stall or higher and maybe one with a 32-3600 stall speed to get the feel before you buy it. That may not be possible for you but if it is, definitely do it before you buy so you will be happy with your purchase.
With a stock cam, I doubt the 4000 stall would be any quicker at the track than the 3600; and as stated the 4000 stall will feel very loose to a newbie around town.
If you want to spend $500-$800 and 5-6 hour labor, you might consider a cam upgrade instead. A cam is $400, but you might need new springs too.
If you want to spend $500-$800 and 5-6 hour labor, you might consider a cam upgrade instead. A cam is $400, but you might need new springs too.
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10 Second Club
Joined: Oct 2015
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From: Hillsdale, MI
I currently have a yank ss4000 with stock cam. I went 12.30 with the 2.73 rear end and toyo tq tires, 11.81 with 3.42 rear and toyo tq tires, and 11.66 with 3.73 8.8 swap with slicks. All three times have a trap speed of 112.9 to 113.5. The car around town with the 2.73 rear and converter was terrible. It was a lot better with the 3.42 and almost like stock with the 3.73 rear.
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Verdad Gallardo Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 10
From: Las Vegas NV
I currently have a yank ss4000 with stock cam. I went 12.30 with the 2.73 rear end and toyo tq tires, 11.81 with 3.42 rear and toyo tq tires, and 11.66 with 3.73 8.8 swap with slicks. All three times have a trap speed of 112.9 to 113.5. The car around town with the 2.73 rear and converter was terrible. It was a lot better with the 3.42 and almost like stock with the 3.73 rear.
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 34,611
Likes: 2,526
From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
These gear-swap-only results are highly irregular. To get 0.50 seconds from a 2.73 to 3.42 swap even with the stock converter is on the high side. To get that much with a 3500+ stall already in place, and no other changes, is record-worthy IMO. I would just caution others to be aware of the rarity of such gains. Many of us have typically seen gains of less than 2 tenths for 2.73 to 3.73 swaps with stall speeds at 3500 and up already in place (and 3.42 would be a bit less.) Of course, this is assuming that weather/track/tire conditions were the same for both runs. How different was the 60-foot? The fact that trap speeds were so similar would suggest that weather/DA was also very similar.
10 Second Club
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 238
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From: Hillsdale, MI
This is highly irregular. To get 0.50 seconds from a 2.73 to 3.42 swap even with the stock converter is on the high side. To get that much with a 3500+ stall already in place, and no other changes, is record-worthy IMO. I would just caution others to be aware of the rarity of such gains. Many of us have typically seen gains of less than 2 tenths for 2.73 to 3.73 swaps with stall speeds at 3500 and up already in place (and 3.42 would be a bit less.) Of course, this is assuming that weather/track/tire conditions were the same for both runs. How different was the 60-foot? The fact that trap speeds were so similar would suggest that weather/DA was also very similar.
Da's were similar. I never trapped 113 with the 2.73. The 12.30 was a 1.90 60' because I could only warm up one tire. Rear brake was holding one from spinning. When I swapped in the 3.42 I installed a line lock to take care of that issue along with strange SA rear shocks. 11.81 was a 1.62 60'. I never dead hooked with the toyos and wasn't about to run slicks on the 10 bolt while driving 1.5 hrs to the track. The 11.66 was a 1.52 60'.
To put everything together with what I know now; I could have cut a 1.52 60' with the 3.42 if it held and actually would have ran quicker because 10 bolt vs 8.8. I could have probably gotten a high 1.6 out of the 2.73 and ran about 11.90.
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 34,611
Likes: 2,526
From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
You are correct. I didn't really think about the info I was commenting with, just chimed in. Didn't mean to misinform.
Da's were similar. I never trapped 113 with the 2.73. The 12.30 was a 1.90 60' because I could only warm up one tire. Rear brake was holding one from spinning. When I swapped in the 3.42 I installed a line lock to take care of that issue along with strange SA rear shocks. 11.81 was a 1.62 60'. I never dead hooked with the toyos and wasn't about to run slicks on the 10 bolt while driving 1.5 hrs to the track. The 11.66 was a 1.52 60'.
To put everything together with what I know now; I could have cut a 1.52 60' with the 3.42 if it held and actually would have ran quicker because 10 bolt vs 8.8. I could have probably gotten a high 1.6 out of the 2.73 and ran about 11.90.
Da's were similar. I never trapped 113 with the 2.73. The 12.30 was a 1.90 60' because I could only warm up one tire. Rear brake was holding one from spinning. When I swapped in the 3.42 I installed a line lock to take care of that issue along with strange SA rear shocks. 11.81 was a 1.62 60'. I never dead hooked with the toyos and wasn't about to run slicks on the 10 bolt while driving 1.5 hrs to the track. The 11.66 was a 1.52 60'.
To put everything together with what I know now; I could have cut a 1.52 60' with the 3.42 if it held and actually would have ran quicker because 10 bolt vs 8.8. I could have probably gotten a high 1.6 out of the 2.73 and ran about 11.90.
BTW, great times overall for the setup.
TECH Resident
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 898
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12.29 at 109 with stock cam, 2.73s, and 4k stall. Et streets on stock snowflake rims, torque arm, lca's, sbfc's, kooks headers and true duals, slp lid and tune.
When you go with a stall traction is an issue on stock tires. I'd recommend drag radials, lcas and subframe connectors.
Stock cam is fine with a 4k, just make sure you bring your shift points up.
When you go with a stall traction is an issue on stock tires. I'd recommend drag radials, lcas and subframe connectors.
Stock cam is fine with a 4k, just make sure you bring your shift points up.
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 10
From: Las Vegas NV
You are correct. I didn't really think about the info I was commenting with, just chimed in. Didn't mean to misinform.
Da's were similar. I never trapped 113 with the 2.73. The 12.30 was a 1.90 60' because I could only warm up one tire. Rear brake was holding one from spinning. When I swapped in the 3.42 I installed a line lock to take care of that issue along with strange SA rear shocks. 11.81 was a 1.62 60'. I never dead hooked with the toyos and wasn't about to run slicks on the 10 bolt while driving 1.5 hrs to the track. The 11.66 was a 1.52 60'.
To put everything together with what I know now; I could have cut a 1.52 60' with the 3.42 if it held and actually would have ran quicker because 10 bolt vs 8.8. I could have probably gotten a high 1.6 out of the 2.73 and ran about 11.90.
Da's were similar. I never trapped 113 with the 2.73. The 12.30 was a 1.90 60' because I could only warm up one tire. Rear brake was holding one from spinning. When I swapped in the 3.42 I installed a line lock to take care of that issue along with strange SA rear shocks. 11.81 was a 1.62 60'. I never dead hooked with the toyos and wasn't about to run slicks on the 10 bolt while driving 1.5 hrs to the track. The 11.66 was a 1.52 60'.
To put everything together with what I know now; I could have cut a 1.52 60' with the 3.42 if it held and actually would have ran quicker because 10 bolt vs 8.8. I could have probably gotten a high 1.6 out of the 2.73 and ran about 11.90.
Very interesting and enlightening points here. My hard time in the track going to be that in Las Vegas weather changes are extreme around the year to compare accurate data.