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4l60e temps keep rising

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Old Dec 30, 2021 | 12:49 AM
  #41  
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Yep delta T btu exchange is limited by air supply(flow) and liquid supply (Flow)
You can increase them to the limits of the piping/pump power etc but there is a limit for sure..

Bigger cooler = more capacity to exchange btu's between the air and oil.

You have the same limit in the cooler tube in a radiator, its a few inches long and a single fluid pass.


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Old Dec 30, 2021 | 08:49 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by Racer-X-
If you're installing an external cooler (oil-air heat exchanger) without a bypass thermostat, I've found the best routing is trans hot fluid outlet -> external cooler -> plate cooler in radiator -> transmission return in. This minimizes "overcooling" which can be an issue in cold weather.

If you're using an external cooler with a bypass thermostat, then you'll get more consistent fluid temps and better overall cooing going trans hot fluid outlet -> plate cooler in radiator -> bypass thermostat inlet -> external cooler -> bypass thermostat outlet -> transmission return inlet.

Either works well for most street driven cars. The bypass thermostat with the external cooler after the plate cooler in the radiator is highly recommended for any vehicle towing a significant trailer (gross actual trailer weight > 33% of gross actual weight of tow vehicle).

All that said, the OP needs to check that his TCC is working properly, that there are no internal leaks in the transmission, especially in the TCC solenoid area, and that the TCC is disengaging above the speed where the increased temperatures are observed (I think this can be set up in the PCM tune). Since no vehicle is mentioned (none is listed @LTX's profile), It's hard to guess what speed you would normally expect a fully functional TCC to start slipping. If the vehicle is a truck with tow/haul mode capability, you could just be sure to be in "tow/haul" mode when you exceed 90mph.
Originally Posted by LTX
Is this post in the wrong thread? I feel like it’s suppose to be in my “temps keep rising thread” anyhow great info. Need a visual on the thermostat setup your explaining. I’m a retard at visualizing other peoples words & explanations.

94 Z28
Good catch. It does belong here. I'm not sure how I posted that on a 9 year old thread. Doh!

As for the cooler bypass thermostat, it goes in the lines to and from the cooler. When the fluid is below the thermostat temperature, the fluid is bypassed from the inlet to the outlet without flowing through the cooler. When the fluid temperature rises above the thermostat temperature, the thermostat closes the bypass passage and the fluid has to flow through the cooler. Derale makes a few of them. Here's a diagram of how it works:




That's from the Derale 15719 "fluid control thermostat" listed at https://www.summitracing.com/parts/der-15719

When you put a cooler in the line from the stock cooler back to the transmission, you really need one of those thermostats. That keeps the fluid at the thermostat temp, and prevents it from getting too cold. As @vorteciroc mentioned, there's not much danger of damage from cold fluid, but cold fluid can cause performance issues. Actually in sub-freezing temperatures, it's possible to cool the fluid to the point where it doesn't flow very well. That's less of a problem with synthetic fluids, but with Dex-III, it's an issue in areas with extreme winter cold.

Also, there are some coolers (mostly "stock" ones) that incorporate the thermostat into the cooler itself. The best example I know of is the oil cooler on the 2nd generation RX-7. That thing is huge, and it is a dual pass cooler, with a big thermostat in the tank with the fittings on it that opens and bypasses the core when the oil is below temperature. If you see a dual pass cooler in a parts yard with an additional plugged opening on the end tank with the connection fittings, it's likely there's a bypass thermostat in that cooler.
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Old Dec 30, 2021 | 09:02 AM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by pdxmotorhead
Yep delta T btu exchange is limited by air supply(flow) and liquid supply (Flow)
You can increase them to the limits of the piping/pump power etc but there is a limit for sure..

Bigger cooler = more capacity to exchange btu's between the air and oil.

You have the same limit in the cooler tube in a radiator, its a few inches long and a single fluid pass.
The thing with the plate cooler in the radiator is that it's heavy (thick) brass, which transferrs heat much more efficiently, and that it's submerged in engine coolant, which is a much more efficient heat exchange medium than air. The plate coolers in the radiator may seem small, but they have the capacity to exchange a lot of heat into the coolant. Also, the transmission cooler plate is always located in the "cool" end of the radiator, so if the engine cooling system is operating as designed, it's typically 30°F or more cooler than the engine coolant thermostat temperature.

And if you're using and external fluid-air cooler, a thermostatically controlled electric fan on the cooler is a really good idea℠. Medium duty vehicles with automatic transmissions (think large RV's and "school" buses with Allison automatic transmissions) almost always have a large external transmission cooler with a fan built onto it in addition to the plate cooler in the radiator.
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Old Dec 30, 2021 | 09:48 AM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by LTX
show me pictures of your cooler setup. Would really appreciate it. I’m considering a line pressure gauge for the pillar.

i live in Florida (Miami) and notice ambient air temperature plays a big role. It was 62 degrees the night after Christmas and drove from Orlando back down south and temps never broke above 173, but it seems on an average 85-90 degree day the fluid does not like that.
I don't have any pics right now but my parts list is in the Sticky at the top of the transmission section.

I have that cooler mounted where my a/c condenser USED to be. About 1/2 in. off the radiator in the front. Braided steel lines bypassing the SILLY stock "cooler" in the radiator.

My trans temp guage sending unit is in the pan.
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Old Jan 19, 2022 | 01:18 PM
  #45  
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Which direction do you mount plate-style coolers? which direction is best for the fittings to point--up, down or sideways? and if sideways, inlet on top or bottom? I see the big long plate-style coolers, some that were in the $109-$139 range, came down to $75-$85! Is something wrong with them that the bottom fell out on the price? I'm thinking of those or the plate style with built-in thermostat row for ~$50... Thanks.
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Old Jan 19, 2022 | 04:25 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by matermark
Which direction do you mount plate-style coolers? which direction is best for the fittings to point--up, down or sideways? and if sideways, inlet on top or bottom? I see the big long plate-style coolers, some that were in the $109-$139 range, came down to $75-$85! Is something wrong with them that the bottom fell out on the price? I'm thinking of those or the plate style with built-in thermostat row for ~$50... Thanks.
When vehicle manufacturers use(d) air-fluid plate coolers for transmission fluid or for engine oil, they generally mount them next to the radiator, in clean air, with the hot oil/fluid inlet at the top and the cool fluid exiting the bottom. Look at late 1980's Volvo turbocharged engine bays for an example, or early to mid 1980's Mercedes-Benz turbo diesels.

For two pass coolers, it doesn't much matter (like the oil cooler from 2nd generation Mazda RX-7), although there might be some thermo-siphon advantage to mounting those crosswise, with the upper fitting on the end for inlet (hot), and the lower fitting for outlet (cooled). The only time that direction really matters is when there's a bypass thermostat in the end tank, like in the 2nd generation RX-7. Then it's fairly important to get the direction correct. You want the thermostat sensor "pellet" on the hot side (inlet), which dictates which line is which.
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