why not a 4l80e over a 4l60e
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 90
Likes: 0
From: fort worth, tx
why not a 4l80e over a 4l60e why does it seem as if everyone here running a 60e is constantly repacing them?
why dont more swap to the 80e?
yes it has its disadvantages to the 60e, but i think it would be more popular just for the fact that you could beat the snot out of it for 100K miles with 500+ rwhp and it not even hiccup.
is this just me because i dont plan on changing trannys every time i floor it.
why dont more swap to the 80e?
yes it has its disadvantages to the 60e, but i think it would be more popular just for the fact that you could beat the snot out of it for 100K miles with 500+ rwhp and it not even hiccup.
is this just me because i dont plan on changing trannys every time i floor it.
TECH Regular
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 465
Likes: 0
From: Edgewood, MD
I think part of the reason you weren't seeing more is you do have a large number of fbodies on this site. Until recently, there were some big hurdles to overcome to get a 4l80 into an fbody. Now that there are several options for the cars to run a 4l80, you're starting to see a lot more going into the cars. (To my knowledge, the hurdles were dealing with the computer and either getting the tranny to talk to the computer, or getting the tranny to work without the computer.)
I know the trucks can go through their share of 4l60's like the cars, but I don't know why they wouldn't be swapping to 4l80's. I'm not familiar enough with the truck side to know what those obsticles were...if any.
I know the trucks can go through their share of 4l60's like the cars, but I don't know why they wouldn't be swapping to 4l80's. I'm not familiar enough with the truck side to know what those obsticles were...if any.
Originally Posted by unredeemed
Without a HUGE amount of TQ, the 4l80's 1st gear sucks.
IMHO - TOO MUCH TQ + TOO MUCH GEAR = HUGE TIRE SPIN. TO MY UNDERSTANDING TIRE SPIN USUALLY LOSES RACES.
KEVIN
gen 3 i think there are too many factors to take into consideration. no such thing as too much torque for most cars. too much gear only when you run out of gear on the big end.
lets not get shift extension and flash stall mixed in with tranny gearing and rearend gearing.
lets not get shift extension and flash stall mixed in with tranny gearing and rearend gearing.
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I will likely swap in a 4L80 into my '98 when my new 4L60 dies, although from what I have heard, I will have to run a non-electronic valve body, as the factory '98 ECM cannot communicate with a 4L80. Somebody please tell me I'm wrong.
TECH Resident
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 841
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From: Baltimore, MD.
Part of me hopes that more people will do this swap. Hopefully better aftermarket support will result.
Part of me hopes that nobody will do it anymore (keep the price of salvage yard parts down. Kinda selfish motive, dont ya think).
The 1-3 gear ratios are the same as the TH400. And I have seen a few places that have a low 1st (and therefore 2nd) of 2.75:1 (and 1.57:1 2nd) versus the 2.48 and 1.48 factory ratios. Also, the 80 has a .75:1 4th, where the 60 has a .70 overdrive ratio.
I have also heard (unconfirmed at this point) that the factory computers can't controll the trans with the low gearsets. If somebody has verification of that one way or other, I'd love to hear about it.
And I also think the 98 computer can't run the 80e. I'd consider converting to the 99+ PCM instead of running a different valvebody. But thats just me.
'Dreamin'
Part of me hopes that nobody will do it anymore (keep the price of salvage yard parts down. Kinda selfish motive, dont ya think).
The 1-3 gear ratios are the same as the TH400. And I have seen a few places that have a low 1st (and therefore 2nd) of 2.75:1 (and 1.57:1 2nd) versus the 2.48 and 1.48 factory ratios. Also, the 80 has a .75:1 4th, where the 60 has a .70 overdrive ratio.
I have also heard (unconfirmed at this point) that the factory computers can't controll the trans with the low gearsets. If somebody has verification of that one way or other, I'd love to hear about it.
And I also think the 98 computer can't run the 80e. I'd consider converting to the 99+ PCM instead of running a different valvebody. But thats just me.
'Dreamin'
The reasons I went with a TH400 over the 4L80E is cost, weight, and the fact that I don't drive the car on any long trips or anything. I could see the 4L80E being a great choice for some people (those who still want to cruise on the highway). Who knows, I may go that way one day myself...
done right, a 4l60 can handle a heads & cam car reliablely. For most people that is enough and they're are no compromises in gearing and weight, nor any swap issues.
Is a 4l80 ok when the rpms starting 6800+ ?
Is a 4l80 ok when the rpms starting 6800+ ?
Originally Posted by Ragtop 99
done right, a 4l60 can handle a heads & cam car reliablely.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 90
Likes: 0
From: fort worth, tx
Yeah but when done right the cost are through the roof. So why pay so much when you can pay a lot less and have a pretty sweet setup? EX: th400, th350, 4l80e
Originally Posted by gator's 99TA
gen 3 i think there are too many factors to take into consideration. no such thing as too much torque for most cars. too much gear only when you run out of gear on the big end.
lets not get shift extension and flash stall mixed in with tranny gearing and rearend gearing.
lets not get shift extension and flash stall mixed in with tranny gearing and rearend gearing.
i was referring to launch traction on street tires. yes stall flash, stall torque ratio, and shift extensions will play into the whole package. but with less gear ratio in the trans and rear diff you will ultimately gain traction due to reduced torque multiplication at the wheels.
my dd spins the tires @ 70 mph with street tires and 4.10 gears <--- too much tq to the wheels. if the engine makes enough tq at the right time you dont need the deep 1st gear of a 60. alot of cars will go faster with less gear.
a friend of mine put wide ratio gears in a c6 in a 69 cougar. then he installed the standard ratio gear sets and wetn 2-3 tenths faster and picked up some mph. it all depends on the tq curve of the engine. most engine dont recover well with a wide ratio trans.
From what I've seen programming my PCM, the constants for gear ratios for each gear are adjustable. They have 3-decimal precision. I would think that the factory computer could be made to work with a 4L80-E with different planetary gearsets. My knowledge and experience is limited to trucks where the same computers are used for 1/2, 3/4, and 1-ton truck chassis all modified for the particular application. I cannot speak for the support of or lack of support of the 4L80-E in a PCM setup for an F-Body. The trucks definately do support and have the pinouts for the forward RPM sensor.
As far as the gear ratios go, I *LOVE* the ratios in the 80. Closer ratios are so much more drivable and performance-oriented than the huge range of the 4L60-E. First actually SHIFTS to second instead of FALLS INTO second like the 60. Sticking with the stock ratios gets my vote.
As far as the gear ratios go, I *LOVE* the ratios in the 80. Closer ratios are so much more drivable and performance-oriented than the huge range of the 4L60-E. First actually SHIFTS to second instead of FALLS INTO second like the 60. Sticking with the stock ratios gets my vote.
