Is an automatic tranny better than manual? Help please?
Thread Starter
TECH Regular
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 480
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From: Ft. Worth, TX
Is an automatic tranny better than manual? Help please? Im sure the first answer that comes to mind is, "it depends what your using it for." Well...lets back up.
I am in the market for an f-body and i was almost fully convinced id never own an automatic. Now a car has come along that meets my criteria but its an auto. So i got to thinking maybe an automatic isnt so bad. I know i wont be able to roadrace as well and that it robs more power. I dont fully understand how a stall converter works and my buddy is telling me its great for launches but on the highway gas milage will be absolutely horrible regardless of what anyone says about a lock-up. Then again i hear its softer on the driveline, more consistent launches, plus its one less thing to hassle with in daily traffic.
What do you guys think? Keep in mind i will be using this as my daily driver/weekend warrior. Thanks.
I am in the market for an f-body and i was almost fully convinced id never own an automatic. Now a car has come along that meets my criteria but its an auto. So i got to thinking maybe an automatic isnt so bad. I know i wont be able to roadrace as well and that it robs more power. I dont fully understand how a stall converter works and my buddy is telling me its great for launches but on the highway gas milage will be absolutely horrible regardless of what anyone says about a lock-up. Then again i hear its softer on the driveline, more consistent launches, plus its one less thing to hassle with in daily traffic.
What do you guys think? Keep in mind i will be using this as my daily driver/weekend warrior. Thanks.
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 308
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From: Rochester, NY
Here is some basic info. The A4 will always get a little worse gas mileage then an M6 because we only have 4 gears and they have 6. So on the highway the M6 might pull out 30 mpg where an A4 may only see 24 mpg. An aftermarket torque converter will hurt gas mileage in the city but NOT on the highway. The converters will lock at 40-50 mph and you will be back to normal rpm's.
M6 pro's
better gas mileage
more fun to drive (subjective but a popular opinion)
better for roll racing and road courses
less HP loss from engine to wheels
holds up better then the A4 at 400+ rwhp
M6 cons
Inconsistant at the drag strip
driver error is a big factor when racing
much harder on the stock 10 bolt
pain in the butt during rush hour traffic
A4 pros
Much better drag racing setup
easier on the 10 bolt
no misshifts ever
better suited for rush hour traffic while eating McDonalds
4000 stall torque converters kick all sorts of butt
A4 cons
Less fun to drive
less mpg
not able to handle 400+ rwhp setups for very long
not ideal for road courses or racing from a roll
not popular at all among the non-drag racing crowd
It sounds to me like you really want an M6. I would not settle for an A4 if that's the case or you will regret it later. If however you are considering some quarter mile tracks as part of the weekend warrior fun then get the A4, stall it up and never look back.
Good luck
M6 pro's
better gas mileage
more fun to drive (subjective but a popular opinion)
better for roll racing and road courses
less HP loss from engine to wheels
holds up better then the A4 at 400+ rwhp
M6 cons
Inconsistant at the drag strip
driver error is a big factor when racing
much harder on the stock 10 bolt
pain in the butt during rush hour traffic
A4 pros
Much better drag racing setup
easier on the 10 bolt
no misshifts ever
better suited for rush hour traffic while eating McDonalds
4000 stall torque converters kick all sorts of butt
A4 cons
Less fun to drive
less mpg
not able to handle 400+ rwhp setups for very long
not ideal for road courses or racing from a roll
not popular at all among the non-drag racing crowd
It sounds to me like you really want an M6. I would not settle for an A4 if that's the case or you will regret it later. If however you are considering some quarter mile tracks as part of the weekend warrior fun then get the A4, stall it up and never look back.
Good luck
Thread Starter
TECH Regular
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 480
Likes: 0
From: Ft. Worth, TX
Thanks, those are definitely some good points to think about. What are some realistic 1/4 mi times with 400rwhp in an a4 and will it be reliable for a daily driver? Also you said the a4 wouldnt be as good from a roll......damn.
My 4-door neon SRT-4 ran 12.51@108 and im looking for a car that will smoke that.
My 4-door neon SRT-4 ran 12.51@108 and im looking for a car that will smoke that.
Last edited by 240M3SRT; Mar 3, 2005 at 02:08 PM.
dude i was looking for an m6 when i set out to get a z but i came across my 98 a4 and was kinda dissapointed at first but u know something the first time i ran the car it was with a 99 m6 we went from a roll and from a light i smoked him both times and he had an slp cat back, slp air lid, and k&n he couldn't believe one that my car was stock and he really couldn't believe it was an auto. so my dissapointment went out the window because with the m6 if your not a good driver u take to much time between shift were and a4 will just pull. and as for 1/4 times with 400rwhp i couldn't say but i would expect mid to low 11's cause mine n/a without the juice made 360 at the wheels and i ran a 12.4 97 cobra with drag radials nad got him by a car or a car and a half on street tires. but i could be wrong i'll get back to u in a month or so when i hit the track.
11 Second Club
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 418
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From: Pembroke Pines,FL
Like said above if your going to drag with it, get it & stall it. Don't have to worry about the 10bolt or missing a gear & bending a rod. I just run a small Vig3200 with a totally stock trans with Mickey Thompson Drag radial's 1.6 short times every time. But if Drag racing is not your bag?
TECH Resident
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 884
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From: Green Bay, WI
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...68#post2537168
Bird_of_Prey is running an A4 with 3600 Viglante Converter, SLP Whisper Lid, Magnaflow Catback, Rear HAL 12 way adjustable shocks, BadZ Billet Aluminum adjustable Lower Control Arms, and MSD Spark Plug Wires and he's hitting 12.20 on the 1/4th...
That's plenty fast enough for me!
Bird_of_Prey is running an A4 with 3600 Viglante Converter, SLP Whisper Lid, Magnaflow Catback, Rear HAL 12 way adjustable shocks, BadZ Billet Aluminum adjustable Lower Control Arms, and MSD Spark Plug Wires and he's hitting 12.20 on the 1/4th...
That's plenty fast enough for me!
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Verdad Gallardo
Joined: Nov 2003
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From: Wichita KS / Rancho San Diego
Dude, I wanted an M6 but found a car (Formula, good color) with everything I wanted except it was A4 and had 2.73s. Well, I bought it, swapped out the gears, got the tranny tuned and now I have a little converter and I'm really enjoying it.
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 308
Likes: 0
From: Rochester, NY
Originally Posted by 240M3SRT
Thanks, those are definitely some good points to think about. What are some realistic 1/4 mi times with 400rwhp in an a4 and will it be reliable for a daily driver? Also you said the a4 wouldnt be as good from a roll......damn.
My 4-door neon SRT-4 ran 12.51@108 and im looking for a car that will smoke that.
My 4-door neon SRT-4 ran 12.51@108 and im looking for a car that will smoke that.
If you go with all the bolt-ons, mid size cam (224/224 114 for example), 3800 stall and sticky tires you'll be around 380-400 rwhp with a good tune. With some good launching your gonna be in the mid 11's @ 117ish. Add a 100 shot of N20 and say hello to 10's. This is of course assuming your running slicks, getting good 60' times and have all the safety devices required by the tracks.
Finally, if you keep the cam and stall reasonable then it will be very streetable and reliable as a daily driver.
Good luck
Stock dead spot is a result of lame stock PCM shiftpoint
programming. A converter will cover that up to more or
less extent depending on stall, and expose other things
(like TCC lock/unlock being too busy, torque management
and so on). But having a nice sensible converter and good
programming for the A4 actions will beastify your car big
time.
A4 = "I can beat you with one hand tied behind my back"
programming. A converter will cover that up to more or
less extent depending on stall, and expose other things
(like TCC lock/unlock being too busy, torque management
and so on). But having a nice sensible converter and good
programming for the A4 actions will beastify your car big
time.
A4 = "I can beat you with one hand tied behind my back"
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 308
Likes: 0
From: Rochester, NY
Originally Posted by jimmyblue
A4 = "I can beat you with one hand tied behind my back"
BTW don't forget that when the 4L60E eventually breaks you can always upgrade to a TH400 which can handle all kinds of abuse and HP upgrades
TECH Resident
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 884
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From: Green Bay, WI
How much does a TH400 normally cost? I'm probably looking at a 3600-4000 Converter ( haven't really looked into them ), lid, GMMG Exhaust, Some kind of LT headers, Mufflex Y-Pipe and High Flow Cats and then maybe next yea or the year after adding a cam and I'm guessing by then the stock tranny will be having its troubles...
