TheRival

Who is that directed at?

BanditTA

iTrader: (3)

People that write dumbass articles like this are the same people that blame GM for building the big SUV's. GM did what people wanted, Toyota and Nissan were behind in that time, now they are ahead because of the market shift.

7998

iTrader: (1)

I'll refrain from calling you a Toolbag, some things need not be said.
1. WTF is a LS1 platform?
2. Out of curiousity, what do you drive?

You should be suprised, I have never seen a Ford Astrovan in my life

So is the Big 3, Who would you rather support?

[QUOTE=WHEN the big 3 fail, someone will show up in their place and offer us a better and more sustainable product. )[/QUOTE]

Oh ya, because we all know how a lack of competition would bring that to fruition.



[QUOTE=Is America going to fall because the big 3 auto makers die? NO!!!! they are not the main source of our economical success...(or downturn for that matter)[/QUOTE]

You obviously, have no foresight into the mass ramifications that would have on the U.S economy.

You sir, are a import loving weenie. As far as imports being better, why don't you come out of the import closet, and I'll take you to my old work truck, it's 97 Chevrolet C2500 with over 370K miles on it.
Import quality is a farce!

Platinum WS6

iTrader: (6)

as far as pre 95's... my little 93 saturn runs great, gets 40+ mpg, and has more miles than most imports will ever see. I drive it 70 miles a day round trip to work. Put cheap oil in it, replaced the air filter, original clutch THIS YEAR, and the paint doesnt look too bad. I would rather have it than a 93 civic any day! Too bad saturn is basically a clone car now.....

TheRival

I appologize, CHEVY ASTROVAN (got mixed up with the ford arostar!) second the LSX platform is what was intended being their shortblock, again i appolgize for being incorrect on my labeling,

Yes i drive a subaru but that has nothing to do with me being an import loving weenie or anything other. My work fleet consists of three ford f250's one f350 superduty duallie and a 25' chevy flatbed with a cat motor. I also have 3 F450's in the yard from the 80's. My very first vehicle was a dodge ram 1500 which i adored!

I am not going to sit here and say the import truck or vehicle is better then the american, what is being disputed is the business model (or lack there of) for the big three auto makers.

You can sit here and call me a toolbag and an import loving weenie all that you wish because frankly i could care less and the fact that this is getting under your skin is amusing to me. You can pick apart my post as much as you like but bottom line is that the big three automakers are self distructive and irresponsible businesses.

what mass ramifications will there be when they fail? unemployment rate will raise? what happened when Kodak and Xerox went bankrupt? Rochester NY alone lost 60K jobs... did the world end? NOPE we now have better technology and new companies have come in to filled the void.

and you ask who would i rather support? i will support a company with a promising business model and a strong work ethic. Look at companies such as Honda and Toyota, they are producing vehicles for the USA in the USA offering us a product as well as jobs, why wouldn't you want to support that? you are losing the big 3 but we have already gained two new auto manufacturers right here in the USA.

TheRival

Congrats! i am not saying that the american vehicles are of poor quality! infact my shop truck 04 f250 has 215K miles on it and that is with 50% under full load. some TLC and PM can take your vehicle to astounding lengths. and i am glad that your vehicle has sustained as many miles as it has and is still a reliable vehicle.

i think it is hearsay to make a statement of "import quality is farce!" so you are telling me that the BMW's and Merc's, Porche's, and Ferarri's build quality are all farce? or just Honda, Toyota, Hyundia, Kia...

that was a rather bold statement my friend

TheRival

and i apologize if i am rubbing people the wrong way, that is not my intentions by any means! i will not personally slander anyone or their beliefs, i am simply stating my opinion and how i feel about this whole situation!

El_Diablo

iTrader: (9)

I love my GM toys but I agree with the OP...NO FREAKING WAY do I support a bail out of the Big Three. Let the declare bankruptcy and re-think the way they do business.

TheRival

https://ls1tech.com/forums/racers-lo...vate-jets.html

And this is what i mean by a failing business model...

7998

iTrader: (1)

Here is a major reason why the Big 3 are struggling
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll...609260338/1040

what mass ramifications will there be when they fail? unemployment rate will raise?

Gee lets ponder this for moment. 400-500K directly employed by the Big 3.
Their suppliers companies and employees. The thousands of dealerships and their employees, The numerous small businesses that are supported by those factories, dealerships, suppliers. The numerous small businesses that are supported by those employees with their paychecks. The aftermarket business would shrink in time. and more. Also last but not least for me and many others National pride. Obviously that holds no meaning to you and the likes. But to us it does.

"My friend" I sold new hondas, VW's, Audis', and Mercedes so I am very familar with their so called build quality. Not enough space or time to type all the problems with those " perceived superior quality automobiles"
I've owned bmw's an Audi A4, GTI VR6, Passat 1.8t, honda civic si hatch(fun car, gay car, but fun) Oh and a subaru legacy
Both bimmers were junk, the Audi while nice was not worth the $5000,differential at 64k miles, the GTI got bought back by Volkswagen after 14-16k miles, the Passat was nice, no qualms there. The civic I was just too embarassed to drive more then a month, and the subaru nickel and dimed me too death.

Evilways

iTrader: (1)

What hurt the American auto industry is forum trolls and idiot kids who latched onto the ricer culture .

TheRival

So i am assuming that i am the "forum Troll" you are referring to?

National pride you say? yes lets have national pride in our big three auto manufacturer's that have not been able produce a profitable consumer product? Yes lets take pride in our failing economical businesses! WOOO HOOO! HURRAY...lets give them a green ribbon for trying!

I don't know where to begin with your break down of your vehicles, the same can be said about most american made cars, I am not going to delve into that one but bottom line is that you can find faults in any and every car! I do not feel that the Imports are inferior to any american made car!

Lets touch on Unemployment... Unemployment is not a bad thing for our economy believe it or not. I do not know your education and i am not going to begin to question it as i am sure you are an intellegent person but the bottom line is that unemployment at a certain percentage is a GOOD thing. (now i feel bad for those who lose their jobs but this is america and nobody ever said that life was fair...{except unions HAHA})

in October of this year we lost a totaled 651,000 This caused our national unemployment rate to raise from 6.1% to 6.5% that is a .4% swing. So the loss of another 500K jobs would equate to another .4% swing. that puts us still under 7% unemployment within the USA. that is not an outstanding number!

Yes like i said, i feel bad for the people who will be losing their jobs but such is life. I do not feel bad for Ford, Chevy/GM or Dodge/Chrysler! they are getting exactly what they deserved! I hope they can right the ship but lets be honest, it is not going to happen. I do not take pride in a business that dominated for 70 years and has dwindled their profit and company resources to the point of bankruptcy! what pride is their to take in that?!?!

TheRival

thank you F&F... we all could have done with out that shock culture movement...

dankl

iTrader: (1)

Bad Blue WS6

iTrader: (41)

i want my 10 minuites back

Z28 DIddy

I won't get into the Import vs. Domestic battle that is ensuing, but I would like to add my .02.


I would just like to comment on the above comments regarding the pending failure and business model of big 3. I think the acceptance of a "bailout" would be affected by your economic views. Free market economies - which have been proven to promote efficiency, quality, and lower prices - would reject the notion of a government funding a private company to prevent it's failure. The idea of a government sponsored bailout is consistent with a socialist society. I happen to agree with a free market economy, where it truly is survival of the fittest. I do not even agree completely with the bailout of the banking system, even though that is highly hypocritical (I work for a major bank that has been the recipient of the benefits of a bailout package).


Secondly, I would like to point out that if the big 3 are not bailed out they will file for chapter 11 bankruptcy. This is bankruptcy centered around re-organizing a corporate entity. This should not be confused with chapter 7, which is a liquidation bankruptcy. Chapter 11 is the same thing that the airline industry used, and more recently Lehman Bros. and Washington Mutual.


Whether you want to argue that domestics are better cars than imports. Great! Maybe you're right. The indisputable fact is that the domestic companies are not able to build cars that consumers want, for the price consumers are willing to pay, and still turn a profit. I think the GOVT should let the big 3 fail so that they can be re-tooled for the current economy, and focus on where they need to be going. Not how things used to be.


For what it's worth I have owned 4 cars in my life, 3 of them domestics, and 1 Dodge Stealth (Not sure if that qualifies as a domestic, since they used a Mitsubishi motor). I recently sold my 00 Camaro to someone on this very board, and it was my favorite car. I look forward to purchasing another one in the near future.

mach1337

All I can say is that I grew up in my dad's 90' dodge power ram 1500. I still remember the first time I heard him start it the sound of a v-8 compaired to my moms dodge stratus (i believe 4 cyl not sure tho). The sound of a V-8 is worth more to me then the mpg. If you want mpg buy a bike! I will support american builders long before I will a import. And with gas below $2.00 a gallon in alot of places hell with the imports. But the big 3 do need to catch up...

TheRival

Does that mean you will buy a vehicle from Toyota and Honda as they are both American Made cars?!

TheRival

Finally someone with some sense to their logic!

7998

iTrader: (1)

You are