Two things here.

1. I wish I made the money that the engineers I know at Ford make. $65k/hour

2. It's the worker that relies on the Union for quality. They're like our attorney to keep a company from taking advantage. There's no human connection between a corp. exec. and the one's who do the labor. It's just right now those in the UAW are corrupt.

 

They owe you fair pay. If they're selling their product and making 120% profit. You deserve to be fairly compensated, or they can expect low quality employees.

 

Thank you!!! finally one of you said!! This is where the problem starts. Its the defenition of a union. You view it as a "3rd party". We elect our own membership to serve as our reps. Not some contracted 3rd party. DeereCo has fully paid health coverage for its union workers on the floor. 4 yrs ago they took health coverage away from the non-union salaried college educated workers and they took a survey of the overall satisfaction of the salaried workers. And they rated it an "F". But Deere said they couldnt afford it, and still paid the CEO $74.5 million as well as countless millions to the other execs.. As far as quit and go find a new job, like I said, in our area we had Case IH, CAT, FORD , and Minn-Moline....and now they are all gone in our area. So what jobs are you suggesting people go look for?

 

This thread is talking about the UAW, not all unions.

Ford motor company, GM, nor Mopar have below average profits. Maybe sales; due to the position these crooked bastards in congress have put us in. It's downright UN-American to even entertain the idea of sending work out of country. I could understand if you were a new citizen with ties to your old country.

But seriously, Ford has cars built in Mexico... Henry's rollin in his grave.

 

You're delusional if you think an engineer makes $65k/hour. On my two co-ops I made $14/hour, and several of my friends who have recently graduated are making about $25/hour. So I'd say that if you're making $30/hour than you are making the same as many engineers, and for unskilled labor. There's no reason that the union workers should be bitching about $14/hour starting, especially with the benefits they're getting.

$14/hour is certainly enough to pay the bills, especially for young people fresh out of high school who this starting salary is likely aimed toward. The union is actually hurting themselves with this locked-in starting salary. Say an older guy, in his 30s with a wife and a kid, gets laid off and gets a job w/ one of the Big 3 as an assembly line worker. He's now essentially forced to take $14/hour, regardless of his past experience and true value as a worker. He may be worth $25/hour because of his work ethic or problem solving ability or what have you. Unions either need a serious restructuring or they need to disappear completely.

I've worked in a union environment. It encourages mediocrity and stifles competition. I worked at UPS as a package sorter. I was one of the best guys on the sort aisle for 2 years, yet I was the lowest paid simply because I hadn't been there as long as the other guys there. The other guys on the aisle didn't like me very much because I continually performed better than them day in and day out and got along with management. I was one of the most valuable guys in that facility, yet it was not reflected in my pay. Pay should be tied to performance, not to how long you've been with the company.

 

That's downright comedic. You're not a shareholder. You are paid to do a task. That task does not change or become any more valuable when the product is marked up. Youre paid to put your 3 bolts in; that has nothing to do with the selling price of the car.

They don't owe you a fair wage. Your employer decides what that task is worth to them and they tell you your wage for doing it; you don't like the wage leave and find a place that will pay you what you feel you're worth.

 

I used 3rd party as a description for a MF in the middle that aint doing ****.
The reason why Deere couldn't afford the health benefits for the non-union workers is bc of the union workers gouging their eyes out. What they pay the CEO is none of your damn business actually

Get your fat *** greedy hands out of people's pocket. If the market is so good for a product/service then go in business for yourself, don't bitch because someone else did it and became successful and you didn't.

 

Haters.... I make $65K+/year, have a BIG 5 bedroom house, 4 kids, 3 dogs, a cat, a carpayment, one paid off, and am working on getting finances sorted out to pick up a C6Z! I love my life!!! Hate on me all you want because of what a company pays me!!!!!

 

Are you actually suggesting that a Ford engineer makes $65,000/hour? That's $135.2 million every year. Like I said, you're delusional if you think an engineer pulls in that much money.

 

I said :fat *** greedy hands

Zac says: How do you know I'm fat? I'm actually 6' 185lbs.

That proves that you don't have to be smart to make 65k a year, have a BIG house, kids etc etc. You can't even master basic reading comprehension. And your old lady is prolly sleeping around Oh wait, you didn't say happily married....she likely left your *** a long time ago

 

it seems engineers make descent money.



http://degreedirectory.org/articles/..._Engineer.html

alot more than an assembly line worker.


some much for that BS.

 

I fail to see how a median income of $69,850 is "a lot more" than the UAW who has an average wage of ~$30/hour, which translates to $62,400 assuming a 40 hour work week, before overtime. Also of note is that engineers are typically salaried workers and not hourly.

 

Also remember that the union requires that the employer pay into a pension/annuity fund for the worker, which they always leave out of the argument when discussing their wages. That is usually something that the engineer has to pay into out of their own pocket.

Also health insurance.

 

pay is based on experience as it clearly states there which tops out at 90k plus.

UAW workers dont start at 60k. as is also stated there engineers start at about 54k.

 

so a big three engineer doesnt get a pension or health insurance from its employer?

also new a UAW worker starts at a reduced rate and gets a lesser pension and health ins. pkg.

 

You're not adding any new or insightful input with these posts. Everyone always starts with lower pay and lower benefits. But there's a glaring problem when your pawns are treated like rooks and bishops.

 

an engineer starts and ends considerably higher pay wise. theres really no argument there.


again, pay was negotiated. perhaps engineers should get together if they think their pay is a problem.


my friend is an engineer for the govt. and was making 80-90k 10 yrs ago. they sold his house for him and paid for him to move so they have it pretty well from what ive seen.


my moms bf is an engineer and while he works alot of hours and travels alot he makes a great living. alot more than 60k.

im sure automotive engineers share similar advantages.

 

Not trying to bust *****, but I don't believe the average wage for a UAW worker is $30 an hour. At least not at GM. If it is I would like to know what job positions are included in that survey to get that average, because it can't only be your average line/shop floor worker. A close family member of mine worked at GM for 41 years (1965-2006). The most he ever made per hour was $28 and that was in his final year working night shift which they pay a little more for. So at $30 per hour I guess the average UAW employee for GM had nearly 50 years seniority and worked night shift? It just doesn't make sense. At the time he retired in 2006 a new hire at Bay City Powertrain started at $15.60 an hour.

 

He might have been counting the included healthcare/benefits/retirement. Stuff you have to pay for yourself at a non-union job.

 

unions provide well trained journeyman level craftsmanship. try getting my level of expertise outside of a union. the quality level is assured. higher wages are not why jobs are going overseas like the media/republicans/corporate greed says. lack of worker protections is. try moving a factory overseas from germany. or france, or mexico, or anywhere but here. we are the only country in the world that does not protect its citizens.


foreign companies can DUMP product here at a loss to kill american competition, and our corrupt government does nothing. dont blame the unions who assure all of your quality of life. blame greed.


if you people wanna make a dollar a day go for it. believe bush cronies and the media.