Ran a Pontiac G8 GXP - Vid inside
03-26-2010, 08:14 PM
#81
Taken from a post in the GM inside news forum from 2007.
"Sigma uses (according to the CTS Specs) a "4-wheel independent design that utilizes a short/long arm, coil-over strut with anti-sway bar in front, and an independent, modified multi-link with anti-sway bar in the rear; both benefit from coil-over monotube dampers," while Zeta (according to Holden) uses a "Fully independent multi-link rear suspension with progressive-rate springs and matched damper calibration and MacPherson strut front susension with progressive-rate coil springs, gas-pressure dampers and anti-roll bar"
Basically the system in Sigma costs more, and it happens to be made with lightweight components that cost more even with economies of scale.
There are other issues such as how the frame is put together, basically Sigma uses expensive methods to do everything. It was designed for cars with high margins, and outside of Cadillac it doesn't make sense."
The platform on a V1 is not very versatile and was unique to Cadi. The Zeta has 26 different variations and is a good solid well engineered platform that covers alot of models. The sigma is the main reason a V costs so much. A 5 year old V1 listed for alot more than a new Camaro with basically the same power train. Also it doesn't have the lower cost McPherson strut front end. This is why the V may not be a good value for a pure muscle car because alot of the value is in the chassis. Straight line street performance can be had cheaper and faster with other platforms. That being said, the Zeta brings affordability to a higher level of performance. It may not be as good as a sigma but it is close. My .02.
So if there is no value proposition for you in a fantastic chassis design like the sigma, don't spend the money on it. V will always be best suited for the road course and will always be one of the most competitive cars in that class.
"Sigma uses (according to the CTS Specs) a "4-wheel independent design that utilizes a short/long arm, coil-over strut with anti-sway bar in front, and an independent, modified multi-link with anti-sway bar in the rear; both benefit from coil-over monotube dampers," while Zeta (according to Holden) uses a "Fully independent multi-link rear suspension with progressive-rate springs and matched damper calibration and MacPherson strut front susension with progressive-rate coil springs, gas-pressure dampers and anti-roll bar"
Basically the system in Sigma costs more, and it happens to be made with lightweight components that cost more even with economies of scale.
There are other issues such as how the frame is put together, basically Sigma uses expensive methods to do everything. It was designed for cars with high margins, and outside of Cadillac it doesn't make sense."
The platform on a V1 is not very versatile and was unique to Cadi. The Zeta has 26 different variations and is a good solid well engineered platform that covers alot of models. The sigma is the main reason a V costs so much. A 5 year old V1 listed for alot more than a new Camaro with basically the same power train. Also it doesn't have the lower cost McPherson strut front end. This is why the V may not be a good value for a pure muscle car because alot of the value is in the chassis. Straight line street performance can be had cheaper and faster with other platforms. That being said, the Zeta brings affordability to a higher level of performance. It may not be as good as a sigma but it is close. My .02.
So if there is no value proposition for you in a fantastic chassis design like the sigma, don't spend the money on it. V will always be best suited for the road course and will always be one of the most competitive cars in that class.
Last edited by Big Bu Bu; 03-26-2010 at 08:29 PM.
03-26-2010, 08:31 PM
#84
03-27-2010, 09:58 AM
#87
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1) 1-year old C6Z, don't need the 3LT or 4LT, just the motor and car, slap a TT kit on her and run with 10psi, cost=$70K
2) 1-year old V2, don't need the Nav or Sunroof, get her up to 14psi, cost=$60K
3) $30K left for go fast mods, look at full exhaust on both, maybe H/C, maybe tranny and rear-end work aimed at 1-mile speeds
4) With remaining cash, go to Porsche dealership, take picture of Panamera, get pic posted on about 50 rolls of TP and wipe my **** for about 2 years while thinking about how well I spent $160K
03-27-2010, 10:10 AM
#88
03-27-2010, 10:12 AM
#89
For $160K, I would do the following:
1) 1-year old C6Z, don't need the 3LT or 4LT, just the motor and car, slap a TT kit on her and run with 10psi, cost=$70K
2) 1-year old V2, don't need the Nav or Sunroof, get her up to 14psi, cost=$60K
3) $30K left for go fast mods, look at full exhaust on both, maybe H/C, maybe tranny and rear-end work aimed at 1-mile speeds
4) With remaining cash, go to Porsche dealership, take picture of Panamera, get pic posted on about 50 rolls of TP and wipe my **** for about 2 years while thinking about how well I spent $160K
1) 1-year old C6Z, don't need the 3LT or 4LT, just the motor and car, slap a TT kit on her and run with 10psi, cost=$70K
2) 1-year old V2, don't need the Nav or Sunroof, get her up to 14psi, cost=$60K
3) $30K left for go fast mods, look at full exhaust on both, maybe H/C, maybe tranny and rear-end work aimed at 1-mile speeds
4) With remaining cash, go to Porsche dealership, take picture of Panamera, get pic posted on about 50 rolls of TP and wipe my **** for about 2 years while thinking about how well I spent $160K
03-27-2010, 02:16 PM
#92
03-27-2010, 02:51 PM
#93
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Taken from a post in the GM inside news forum from 2007.
"Sigma uses (according to the CTS Specs) a "4-wheel independent design that utilizes a short/long arm, coil-over strut with anti-sway bar in front, and an independent, modified multi-link with anti-sway bar in the rear; both benefit from coil-over monotube dampers," while Zeta (according to Holden) uses a "Fully independent multi-link rear suspension with progressive-rate springs and matched damper calibration and MacPherson strut front susension with progressive-rate coil springs, gas-pressure dampers and anti-roll bar"
Basically the system in Sigma costs more, and it happens to be made with lightweight components that cost more even with economies of scale.
There are other issues such as how the frame is put together, basically Sigma uses expensive methods to do everything. It was designed for cars with high margins, and outside of Cadillac it doesn't make sense."
The platform on a V1 is not very versatile and was unique to Cadi. The Zeta has 26 different variations and is a good solid well engineered platform that covers alot of models. The sigma is the main reason a V costs so much. A 5 year old V1 listed for alot more than a new Camaro with basically the same power train. Also it doesn't have the lower cost McPherson strut front end. This is why the V may not be a good value for a pure muscle car because alot of the value is in the chassis. Straight line street performance can be had cheaper and faster with other platforms. That being said, the Zeta brings affordability to a higher level of performance. It may not be as good as a sigma but it is close. My .02.
So if there is no value proposition for you in a fantastic chassis design like the sigma, don't spend the money on it. V will always be best suited for the road course and will always be one of the most competitive cars in that class.
"Sigma uses (according to the CTS Specs) a "4-wheel independent design that utilizes a short/long arm, coil-over strut with anti-sway bar in front, and an independent, modified multi-link with anti-sway bar in the rear; both benefit from coil-over monotube dampers," while Zeta (according to Holden) uses a "Fully independent multi-link rear suspension with progressive-rate springs and matched damper calibration and MacPherson strut front susension with progressive-rate coil springs, gas-pressure dampers and anti-roll bar"
Basically the system in Sigma costs more, and it happens to be made with lightweight components that cost more even with economies of scale.
There are other issues such as how the frame is put together, basically Sigma uses expensive methods to do everything. It was designed for cars with high margins, and outside of Cadillac it doesn't make sense."
The platform on a V1 is not very versatile and was unique to Cadi. The Zeta has 26 different variations and is a good solid well engineered platform that covers alot of models. The sigma is the main reason a V costs so much. A 5 year old V1 listed for alot more than a new Camaro with basically the same power train. Also it doesn't have the lower cost McPherson strut front end. This is why the V may not be a good value for a pure muscle car because alot of the value is in the chassis. Straight line street performance can be had cheaper and faster with other platforms. That being said, the Zeta brings affordability to a higher level of performance. It may not be as good as a sigma but it is close. My .02.
So if there is no value proposition for you in a fantastic chassis design like the sigma, don't spend the money on it. V will always be best suited for the road course and will always be one of the most competitive cars in that class.
03-27-2010, 10:33 PM
#94
By 2011 the Sigma/Zeta platform will probably merge and the unique Sigma I & IIs found on the Cadi will be history. That's not to say that the new version won't be a great chassis.
