FuzzyLog1c

iTrader: (4)

In preparation for the purchase of a forged and balanced LS3 short block, I'm trying to figure out how to get rid of my existing block. I could sell it as a short block and keep the heads, valves, springs, rockers, and whatnot (I doubt 243 heads are going to hold me back when I add a TVS2300), or I could say "screw it" and buy a set of LS3 heads, Yella Terra rockers, and a LS3 intake manifold while I wait for my savings to build up again.

Here's what's I'd potentially sell with the motor. If you could give me a rough idea of what I could reasonably expect to get for it in a short block and long block configuration, I'd appreciate it.

- 364 CID LS2 with 26,000 miles. Redline 15W-40 diesel oil flush and fill with zinc phosphate additives every 4,000 miles. 422 RWHP / 383 RWTQ in this configuration with similarly thick tranny and diff oil (est 0.83 drivetrain losses). Oil pressure on 15W-40 60+ psi at WOT and 42 psi hot at idle.
- TruTorq L3 cam (223/236 .610/.612 115 LSA) AND stock LS2 cam
- 7.425" Comp hardened pushrods, retainers, shims, and locks
- Comp 26926 dual springs (.675 lift)
- Comp rocker trunnion upgrade
- Newly installed valves, seals, and gaskets
- Pinned crank
- Professionally ported LS2 intake manifold
- Stock fuel rails and injectors
- Stock LS2 oil pump and chain

98cobra

iTrader: (32)

I'd pick it up for a good price!

FuzzyLog1c

iTrader: (4)

Hence the question: what's a good price? I'm not asking for an offer--I simply want to get a value assessment for budgetary purposes.

I'll definitely keep you in mind when I pull it, though.

1BADCTS

iTrader: (17)

Assuming average mileage, I would ask $2K for the long block, and guess $1750 is what you would ultimately get for it, then go LS3 heads!

FuzzyLog1c

iTrader: (4)

Even though the block has 26k and the cam, intake manifold, and valvetrain upgrades cost that much in parts 3 months ago? They've got a thousand miles on them.

98cobra

iTrader: (32)

I could see the shortblock going for $1000- $1600

Onefast V

iTrader: (3)

you would get more money reverting the shortblock to stock and selling off the aftermarket parts seperately

MN_V

iTrader: (5)

Fuzzy if you don't mind me asking did those recent mods you did affect your gas mileage?

adanieljohnson1

iTrader: (1)

Keep it and sick it in a hybrid car... I'd do an old Pontiac or something

punishmentcycle

iTrader: (6)

Realistically the stock short block should bring 1500-2k given the mileage. The cam honestly doesn't make much money difference. Now the entire long block can bring between 2500-3k. That's what I've seen as an average.

FuzzyLog1c

iTrader: (4)

Possibly. It's hard to tell how much, given that I've been driving the car harder following the tune at Slowhawk, the wider Forgestar F14 wheels, and reading books by various driving schools (e.g. Going Faster by the Skip Barber school). I'm sitting at about 11 mpg in the city (avg 22 mph, which represents a LOT of up and down). Before these mods, I was doing about 13 mpg. If I had to give you an estimate, I'd say I lost 1 mpg to the losses introduced by the beefier valvetrain and the thicker oil I'm using (15W-40 in the motor, 70W-80 in the transmission, and 75W-140 in the differential.

Of course, I get 25-27 mpg at high speed, like everyone else.

DMM

Since the price of LS3 heads is so cheap, I would go that route. It would also make the supercharger easier if you plan on going with an E Force as you would only have to order a Camaro or G8 head unit, nothing fancy like I did.

If you do not plan on keeping your cam, I might be interested...shoot me a price and an idle clip if you have one. I think that cam would be ideal for a roots blower. I'm not alone....I think LEP's new blower cams are almost the exact same specs as what you already have.

To further answer your question...list it stock for $2500 and let someone talk you down (they will anyhow). Looking forward to your project!

FuzzyLog1c

iTrader: (4)

It's an excellent blower cam. I was going to add a blower on this motor, but then 1BADCTS blew his LS6 on the same kind of setup that I was planning. So my plans changed.

For what it's worth, I did post a couple of months ago. I just ducked outside to record a quick take of my exhaust...Youtube says it'll take about an hour to upload and convert. Stay tuned.

FuzzyLog1c

iTrader: (4)

As indicated...super impromptu. Hope you like 0:54-0:56. Valvetrain sounds 3x louder with this camera than in real life. Hawk HP+ pads were cold and squeaky.

cammedv

just curious to hear the benifts of runing 15w40 diesl oil.
seems odd are you in a weird temp area or something?

Dmax/04V

Can't say that I know exactly why you would run diesel oil but I would assume it has to do with the fact that it is made to stand up to much harsher use than regular 5w-30. Diesel oil has to survive temperatures and loads that a gas car will never see, EGT's on diesel motors can spike into the 2000 degree range, or run stable around the 1200 degree mark when pulling a load for thousands of miles. A different blend of additives, and a heavier weight might wear more on the oil pump but be beneficial to the motor. My guess is it is more of a trade off...oil pump life vs engine wear and tear. I'm sure fuzzy will give the exact reasoning.

DMM

Thanks, Fuzzy. That cam sounds healthy at idle, how does it feel? Is there much shake to it?

As a side note, I would not base your aspirations of FI on the lone guy that had a Whipple. Granted, I am probably going to get a forged 383 after I work out all of the bugs, and then turn up the boost. A TVS 2300 is different than a Whipple in that once the bypass closes on a Whipple, you have instant boost. This not only stresses the engine, it also stresses the supercharger. That my be why the V2 guys with Whipple's are breaking jack-shafts and bearings every 500 miles...the Whipple is just poorly designed and needs to go back to the drafting table for additional R&D.

FuzzyLog1c

iTrader: (4)

Thanks for the information on the Whipple.

Pre-tune, there was a little shake. Post tune, effectively zero. Don Kinder (Slowhawk) set idle to about 875 RPM. Every couple of seconds, something will line up just right and you'll get a little shimmer, but that's it. And I think it all might go away when I install my new motor mounts.

I'm not sure if I want to get into this again. Dmax/04V got most of it. I did a pile of research on this and I could easily write another technical dissertation on the subject. First off you need to know that ZDDP (Zinc Dithiophosphate)

Suffice it to say that:

• ZDDP (Zinc Dithiophosphate) is a sacrificial anti-wear additive present in all automotive oil and provides critical protection in areas where boundary pressures/shear forces in motors are high to extreme (e.g. cam to lifter contact surfaces, main bearings, and piston rings) and it helps combat harmful byproducts of combustion blow-by that make it into your oil (especially if you use methanol to control detonation).
  
• In 2004, the US government mandated a longer 120,000 mile lifetime for catalytic converters. ZDDP chemically attacks catalytic converters by the same chemical process that allows it to adhere to your cam, lifters, cylinder walls, etc. Instead of requiring better catalytic converters, the API (American Petroleum Institute) in conjunction with the EPA released the new SM/ILSAC GF-4 standard in 2006 that lowered the limit on ZDDP to 800 ppm (down from 1200 PPM in 1988).
  
• Diesel oil and racing oil doesn't have to follow the same category of standards as standard motor oil (you know, because those motors actually have to work), which is why they include 1600-2400 PPM ZDDP, amongst other detergents and additives designed to increase shear resistance. In severe racing/driving applications where preventing motor wear is more costly than burning out your catalytic converters every 80,000 miles (assuming you even have them), people use oils with higher concentrations of ZDDP, or add ZDDP after the fact.
  
• If you've modified your engine significantly and you drive it hard (or you live in a hot climate), there's a good chance your oil temperatures are exceeding GM's design criteria. This should be blatantly obvious for those of you with superchargers. Remember that the second number in the oil viscosity rating is specified at 210 degrees. Viscosity, or the ability of a fluid to resist shearing, is inversely proportional to temperature. That means that your 30 weight oil will behave like a 20 weight or less as you exceed 210 degrees, and it'll be thicker when it gets colder. Although I don't fully understand it yet, in attempt to improve fuel economy, the SM/ILSAC GF-4 regulations on these new oils also skew their viscosity down to the point where the 5W-30 oil you buy off the shelf today behaves a little more like a 0W-20 oil, and now that it's been stripped of its ZDDP, it will definitely behave like 0W-20 as it ages and picks up contaminants.

In general, try to be smart about this--you can't just put 15W-40 in your car and expect it to work in the winter, and you definitely shouldn't be running this kind of oil if you drive your CTS-V like a Toyota Camry 5 miles to work and back every day. Be cognizant of your oil temperatures. Be aware of where the industry is going...personally, I'm going to be looking at some of the custom 0W-40 race oils once I run out of 15W-40 (I buy oil in 5 gallon containers) to reduce wear in the critical first few seconds following engine start.

itsslow98

iTrader: (18)

Shortblock should get 2k pretty easy I'd even hold out for 2500. I'd also ditch the 243s and swap to ls3 heads because you'd break even but end up with much better flowing heads for the blower.

FuzzyLog1c

iTrader: (4)

The way I see it, I wouldn't be breaking even. I'd be spending $2500 more than I planned to get 821 casting heads and rockers.