Stampede4ever

Why don't you have any intentions of it living? I also plan on running the T5, soon, hell you can rebuild one cheaper the a buying a used 3550 or T56.

Also, solid information, Thank you!!!!!

Stampede.

APillow

iTrader: (3)

@ Gary_68, yes a mechanical setup can work for any of these combos. As long as your Bellhousing has the pivot ball you are in good shape. BUT these mechanical setups usually limit the header options. Also you will need to fabricate the block mounted pivot for the clutch pedal cross shaft... This is a pain. Best bet is to use the Hydraulic/Mechanical Hybrid system, granted those bellhousings are expensive. At the end of the day, really it is cheaper to run a full hydraulic with the $100 Speedway kit.

@Stampede4ever, I may have mis-worded that. The Volvo 960 will come out to about 300 HP flywheel, the Ford WC T5 should live forever behind it. And you are welcome, I'm just trying to shed light on the T5 which for the amount of chatter has had few solutions in the LS world.

APillow

iTrader: (3)

Tips for the Ford T5, but not a solution - yet. Input is more than welcome!

The only thing missing is a ~1/2" thicker adapter plate. Call up Hot Rod Works and see if they will make one! Consumer demand wants!
http://www.hotrodworks.com/contact/

Unicorn Setup:
FORD T5 with GM Hydraulic Throw-Out Bearing and 11" Clutch:

Parts List:
- Ford T5
- GM T5 Gen3 Camaro/S10 Input Shaft Retaining Sleeve. Allows the use of Speedway Hydraulic TO Bearing kit. ALL of these are interchangeable between T5s! The Ford T5 just uses a thicker OD on the sleeve. All the rest is the same. Don't pay stupid prices for the Ford specific crap when Speedway has you covered for $100! Be sure to set your mainshaft end play when you change retainers.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/FRONT-BEARI...53.m2749.l2649
- SBC Truck Bellhousing. You will use 5 bolts.
- *Hot Rod Works Unicorn adapter plate*
- LS1 Flywheel
- LS1 Pressure Plate
- 11" Ford Cobra clutch disc (yes, these exist and I have one that does mate up. Stock parts FTW.)
- Custom Ford to LS Pilot Bearing (Rumor has it that McLeod makes these. Perhaps hit up Hot Rod Works for a kit!)
- ARP Flywheel Bolts (different than Flexplate bolts!)
- ARP Pressure Plate Bolts
- Speedway Hydraulic TO Bearing Kit: 910-25610
https://www.speedwaymotors.com/GM-St...ring,1945.html

I used a carpenters sliding square to take these measurements.

Measurements:
- Mounting face to input shaft tip: 7 3/4"
- Mounting face to input shaft end of splines: 6 3/4"
- Mounting face to bearing retainer end of sleeve: 4 1/2" (GM part see above, but early Ford T5 is the same length and style.)

Notes:
- For this setup bury the TO Bearing DEEP to avoid interference with the input shaft.
- With the 11" Ford disk the clamping force should be good for 350-400HP???

Let me know what you all want to see... Photobucket is dead, but I can make a craptacular video for YouTube if anyone needs a visual.

garys 68

iTrader: (1)

For the ford T5, instead of the 1/2" thicker adapter to move the input shaft out, could you use an adapter pilot bushing in the inner bore of the crank. It's about 1/2" farther in the crank.

gsalazar10

Great info!! Sorry to revive this but I need something clarified

I've got an NV4500 behind an L59. If you use the Mcleod 460535 conversion flywheel, is there any need to use an adjustable TB or adjustable pivot ball? Or does that flywheel bring everything in line to factory? Factory bearing is the short 1 1/4 bearing.

Thanks for any help!

garys 68

iTrader: (1)

If that's the Mcleod version of the Sachs 1050, you should be OK. I would assemble and check the fork geometry to be sure. BTW, any reason you're using the $400 Mcleod instead of the $50 Sachs flywheel?

gsalazar10

Long story short, I ran the Sachs for a year and a half but my throwout bearing failed on me so i decided to upgrade my clutch while i was replacing the throwout. I upgraded to a Mcleod clutch and I didn't want it to wear the same way the old clutch was wearing with the 1050 flywheel since it it's 100% contact. My main thing I'm questioning is my fork travel. Everything is in and assembled and I've been driving for a couple weeks without a noticeable issue but I don't want to prematurely wear anything. I may be over thinking this but how much free play should my clutch fork have? It's external slave

douglee25

garys 68

iTrader: (1)

A lot of the early ls swaps with the shorter LS1 flywheel ended up with poor fork geometry and required full pedal travel to release the clutch due to using the original short TOB and the shallower flywheel. The longer TOB solves that issue. But regardless of the combination, a good fork geometry will make it work well, Novak and other sites have good info on optimal fork geometry. All you need is a good combination of the fork, pivot ball length , and throwout bearing to achieve this. Best off to mock it up and adjust.

DailyGTO

garys_68, this thread has been a huge help so far!

I figured I would ask here instead of starting a new thread, but would anyone know what z bar to use in a 66 chevelle when using the 10 spline BBC clutch and 1050 flywheel? I have my original small block z bar, but will that play nice with the BBC clutch or would the BBC z bar need to be used? I cant really tell if the BBC Z bar has a different angle on the levers compared to the small block. the two Z bars seem very similar but the angles seem a bit different on the lower levers.

small block (what I currently have):
http://www.4speedconversions.com/3840836.html

big block:
http://www.4speedconversions.com/3872895.html

gsalazar10

Well then I am WAY off That's what I was afraid of - my TOB has to travel too far before it engages the fingers. That was my foolishness the first time I did this, I didn't mock up or check. This time I was in a hurry because it was my only vehicle at the time and I only needed it for a short time. My 3rd synchro is out and after 250xxx miles, its time for a rebuild. Problem was I wasn't anticipating the TOB going out on me so this clutch install was a rush job to get me back on the road. Now I'm ready to pull it all back out and actually measure and mock everything up. I'll report back what my final measurements will be. I'm just getting around to ordering my NV4500 rebuild kit.

Thanks garys_68 for the advise. I'm thinking a longer bearing will be my problem solver once I get my measurements taken care of. Thinking of going with the adjustable Mcleod to save time having to wait on an order or having to source locally. Novak is great with their formulas and really provided an insight on the geometry needed. As stated above, I was in a hurry and I knew better but hopefully only a couple thousand miles didn't do any permanent damage to my clutch

garys 68

iTrader: (1)

The Z bar is sort of independent of the clutch flywheel since the length of the pedal to z bar rod and Z bar to for can easily be adjusted/modified.
The initial problem you'll have is there no boss on the LS blocks for a Z bar ball. SDparts sells this:
https://sdparts.com/i-24074894-sdpc-...nd-trucks.html
You can also use the 621 bellhousing boss for the pivot ball like I did (seen in my earlier posts).
This may or may not line up with your original frame mount depending on the motor mounts you use. 1" setbacks will generally line up the frame and engine bosses. I moved my frame mount back since I used the bellhousing boss instead of the Olds block boss location. It also allowed me to move the frame mount in/out to fit the Z bar. I also shortened the z bar to fork rod.
Short answer: Mock it it, see what fits.

DailyGTO

Thanks Gary, I should have been more specific though. I have motor mounts to get the engine's bellhousing mounting location to be stock SBC and I have the clutch pivot bracket from SD that you listed. With the z bar frame side mont still in the stock location, the pivot ball seems to be aligned, so it seems my engine is in the stock small block location at this point.

I think you basically answered my question by saying the Z bar is sort of independent of the clutch/flywheel combo as I can adjust the Z bar to fork rod to take up slack, I just wanted to make sure the overall "throw distance' of the z bar for SBC and BBC are close enough. My worry would be the SBC z bar having a different overall rod travel distance compared to the BBC Z bar, causing clutch engagement issues since I have a "BBC" clutch. I'll be mocking it up over the next few days.

Thanks!

garys 68

iTrader: (1)

BBC and SBC used the same clutch, bell, fork in the early 70, so I suspect the angle, throw distance, etc are very similar betweem BBC and SBC. Guessing the difference will be in the length of the tube.

Rick Dorion

iTrader: (1)

This thread is fantastic. I'm installing a 5.3 in my 67 Bel Air and will be using a Muncie. I plan on using a Quick Time 6036 which states a bellhousing depth of 6.100". Do I still use the large diameter pilot bearing?

garys 68

iTrader: (1)

Mock it up with the larger LS7 bearing. IIRC the standard 621 bell is 6.25. Moving the input shaft forward 0.15 isn't much and there should be room before the splined area contacts the bearing.

Project GatTagO

iTrader: (7)

Look at my picture in post #2. I'd say use the large bearing and mock everything up without the clutch and see how it fits.

Andrew

Rick Dorion

iTrader: (1)

I found some references that the distance from the Muncie case face (bellhousing mating surface) to the end of the input shaft is 6 5/8". Can someone verify?

If true, I will be a slight interference issue with the large bearing and the splines based on my measurements.

I ordered a Quick time 1/4" spacer and will report back as well as my final experiences. Probably should have started a build thread but this thread is a great accumulation of knowledge.

Project GatTagO

iTrader: (7)

Muncie input shaft is 6.66", same as the Richmond 6 speed that I showed pictures of in post #2. Be careful with spacers because they can throw off the transmission alignment.

Andrew

Rick Dorion

iTrader: (1)

Point taken, Andrew. If I use the spacer I'll be certain to check alignments with my dial indicator. One other thread I read indicated the use of the small pilot bearing but nor pressed fully in. I'd prefer not to do that.