V12 LS1 Build
I still think the V-4 with a small turbo would have just as much power as a 6.0 in stock trim.. And that way you only have to buy 4 injectors plus half the pipework for headers and such. Being that small of a setup you could use log style headers to keep clearances and wrapping the header easier.
Heck, I would switch to log headers if a set were available for the S-10. HMM, I have an idea now..
Heck, I would switch to log headers if a set were available for the S-10. HMM, I have an idea now..
6600 rpm clutch dump of death Administrator
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 4,983
Likes: 13
From: Texas
So, I don't want to take the V12 build off in a different tangent. But, the issue with the kit cars Seems to me to be a "square peg round hole" issue. If I read correctly, you are taking a transmission for a C5 Vette and trying to put it into a rear engine vehicle. With that done, the engine comb is 4" too long.
So, you hope to solve that by going with a shorter engine?
Anyone is free to build what they want, but I think fundamentally you are headed in the wrong direction. I don't know if you are looking at a C5 rear and tranny because they are relatively cheap and plentiful, but there are other options that are much shorter and will handle the HP.
First, the Porsche 930 transaxle.
The other option would be the custom transaxles used by desert buggies. I would think either of those would get you a drop in overall length. There are a lot of options and this is probably the best route. These were designed to replace the VW transaxles with a transaxle that could take 600-800HP. Many of them are used behind modified LS motors.
The last option would be to use a FWD LS4 and transaxle.
So, you hope to solve that by going with a shorter engine?
Anyone is free to build what they want, but I think fundamentally you are headed in the wrong direction. I don't know if you are looking at a C5 rear and tranny because they are relatively cheap and plentiful, but there are other options that are much shorter and will handle the HP.
First, the Porsche 930 transaxle.
The other option would be the custom transaxles used by desert buggies. I would think either of those would get you a drop in overall length. There are a lot of options and this is probably the best route. These were designed to replace the VW transaxles with a transaxle that could take 600-800HP. Many of them are used behind modified LS motors.
The last option would be to use a FWD LS4 and transaxle.
I'm really surprised no one has done an ls base v4 makes me think back to the scat v4 an v6 engines based off a sbc 350 an 400 engines
But I think the dirt track racers is what got the original scat v4 going.
But I think the dirt track racers is what got the original scat v4 going.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 53
Likes: 0
From: Seattle, Washington
Been a while since the last update. Ls1tech is the really the first forum we've posted on and checking the forums for questions/requests for updates never really became a habit. I'll start checking a couple times a week from now on.
Like I've said before, we're just a couple of guys working out of our garage. Both of us have full time jobs. Also, we have multiple interests and multiple projects going on at once. We are 95% done with a Honda SL70 that we put a turbo on, for instance.
As a broad statement to all the people who have messaged me, I'd like to apologize for the lack of replies. But as a blanket response, we don't have the desire or funding to be producing these for people on a larger scale at this time. We're just building some for ourselves at this point. If that changes, you guys will be the first to know. I do, however, love the various interests in applications (Formula D, motorcycles, show cars)
Aside from spending time on various other projects, we have made some progress. Mostly focused on the v12. We have made several billet crankshaft cores that we are looking on using. A couple different designs and firing orders. As for the v4, we have a friend, Mike Smith, finishing up the pattern for the crank for that.
I'll be on later tonight or tomorrow with some pictures of the cores for you guys. Let me know if you want to see pictures of something, and I'll see if I can get that uploaded.
Like I've said before, we're just a couple of guys working out of our garage. Both of us have full time jobs. Also, we have multiple interests and multiple projects going on at once. We are 95% done with a Honda SL70 that we put a turbo on, for instance.
As a broad statement to all the people who have messaged me, I'd like to apologize for the lack of replies. But as a blanket response, we don't have the desire or funding to be producing these for people on a larger scale at this time. We're just building some for ourselves at this point. If that changes, you guys will be the first to know. I do, however, love the various interests in applications (Formula D, motorcycles, show cars)
Aside from spending time on various other projects, we have made some progress. Mostly focused on the v12. We have made several billet crankshaft cores that we are looking on using. A couple different designs and firing orders. As for the v4, we have a friend, Mike Smith, finishing up the pattern for the crank for that.
I'll be on later tonight or tomorrow with some pictures of the cores for you guys. Let me know if you want to see pictures of something, and I'll see if I can get that uploaded.
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Teching In
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Not trying to steal your thunder, but Motus Motorcycles is going to start selling their "Baby Block" V4 that's 100 ci and based on LS architecture. It'll come in 160 and 180 horse versions.
http://motusmotorcycles.com/
http://motusmotorcycles.com/
Not trying to steal your thunder, but Motus Motorcycles is going to start selling their "Baby Block" V4 that's 100 ci and based on LS architecture. It'll come in 160 and 180 horse versions. http://motusmotorcycles.com/
I love this, whole heartedly. Keep it up guys!! There IS a market for this... Time to start thinking LLC
Teching In
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
This. Not too many dealers around but I'm really interested to see what comes of these.
And to V12baker, it's really awesome what you're doing. Not too many people with enough ingenuity to try something like this. Wish you were mass producing these, I'm planning on going with a 6.0 in my 84 4x4 chevy truck, but a V12 LS would accomplish the same power without turbos.
And to V12baker, it's really awesome what you're doing. Not too many people with enough ingenuity to try something like this. Wish you were mass producing these, I'm planning on going with a 6.0 in my 84 4x4 chevy truck, but a V12 LS would accomplish the same power without turbos.
Registered User
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
You need to be in this part of the forum. They will be able to help you.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/forced-induction-9/
https://ls1tech.com/forums/forced-induction-9/
Teching In
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
From: Melbourne, FL
the new crank can have power pulses every 60 degrees. The welded crank has some double pulses at 45 degrees and single pulses at the quarter turn, over the span of 2 rotations.
With the new firing order from a custom crank/cam you can match the newer Ferarri/Lambo/Jab 2-11-10-3-6-7-12-1-4-9-8-5 firing order every 2 rotations and power pulses every 60 degrees (like the 120 degree power pulse of the internally balanced 3.4L v-6
). I love the balance of those 3.4Ls !! It's actually the base of the new gen v-6 camaro that is making over 300hp stock.
Due to EFI and welding together gives you something like a 1 - 8 - 4/4 - 3/3 - 6/6 - 5/5 - 7 - 2. this means one entire rotation is double power and then the next rotation is single power. The engine would surge like heck and probably snap the crank before to long. The problem is the 45 degree firing pulse of the v-8 forces the overlap. you want 60 degrees with a v-12. I think the balance is a big, big benefit & smooth power. torque monster !!
1 x 4 3 6 5 x 2 (first 6 block)
x 8 4 3 6 5 7 x (second 6 block)
reprogramming the EFI/spark to fire 6 times a rotation instead of 4 might be a really big task, but fun !!!
With the new firing order from a custom crank/cam you can match the newer Ferarri/Lambo/Jab 2-11-10-3-6-7-12-1-4-9-8-5 firing order every 2 rotations and power pulses every 60 degrees (like the 120 degree power pulse of the internally balanced 3.4L v-6
). I love the balance of those 3.4Ls !! It's actually the base of the new gen v-6 camaro that is making over 300hp stock. Due to EFI and welding together gives you something like a 1 - 8 - 4/4 - 3/3 - 6/6 - 5/5 - 7 - 2. this means one entire rotation is double power and then the next rotation is single power. The engine would surge like heck and probably snap the crank before to long. The problem is the 45 degree firing pulse of the v-8 forces the overlap. you want 60 degrees with a v-12. I think the balance is a big, big benefit & smooth power. torque monster !!
1 x 4 3 6 5 x 2 (first 6 block)
x 8 4 3 6 5 7 x (second 6 block)
reprogramming the EFI/spark to fire 6 times a rotation instead of 4 might be a really big task, but fun !!!
Last edited by cold_surfer; Dec 27, 2013 at 07:41 PM.
