180 at idle, 210 driving.
What pressure did you use for leak down? I'm sure not nearly as much as actual cylinder pressure when the engine is running. The real test is to check for combustion gasses in the radiator when running. I don't generally think of LS motor as having weak head gaskets, but the way yours acts with the pressure, it could be.
Do you have the part number for the exact thermostat you used?
Do you have the part number for the exact thermostat you used?
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 276
Likes: 1
From: Mid Mo via Lancs. England
Pressure in was 100psi. It's all the gauge goes up to on the leak down tester.
Lowest was 86 or 88 IIRC, with no bubbles in the coolant, only a slight hiss from the oil filler neck.
Here is the thermostat I just installed.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hyp-1014
It shows it fits pretty much anything with a Ls series in it.
Water pump is from a 2002 Escalade IIRC. I needed to do some swapping around after the LS6 intake swap with a cable TB and didn't want to start pulling necks, putting dents in stuff, etc. That is how most do it from my reading, but I am not to $150 or so, to make it right.
Martin
Lowest was 86 or 88 IIRC, with no bubbles in the coolant, only a slight hiss from the oil filler neck.
Here is the thermostat I just installed.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hyp-1014
It shows it fits pretty much anything with a Ls series in it.
Water pump is from a 2002 Escalade IIRC. I needed to do some swapping around after the LS6 intake swap with a cable TB and didn't want to start pulling necks, putting dents in stuff, etc. That is how most do it from my reading, but I am not to $150 or so, to make it right.
Martin
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 276
Likes: 1
From: Mid Mo via Lancs. England
And for what it's worth, I agree totally that all indicators show a head gasket problem.
I almost wished the leak down test and compression would have shown me a bad cylinder, just to get a definitive answer out of the thing!
Thanks for your time trying to figure this out with me.
Martin
I almost wished the leak down test and compression would have shown me a bad cylinder, just to get a definitive answer out of the thing!
Thanks for your time trying to figure this out with me.
Martin
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 276
Likes: 1
From: Mid Mo via Lancs. England
Been working away for a few months, but did pick up a block test kit fro NAPA today.
At idle, electric fan kicked on at 180 and the temp stays there. Up to 2200rpm's, temp goes slowly to 215 with both the Taurus fan on, and the condenser fans in front of the radiator on. Drop back to idle, temp drops. No hoses collapsing, and if anything they get bigger with the pressure in the system. Slight hiss when removing the overflow tank cap.
Did the test and the fluid went from blue to green! I wish it had turned yellow per the instructions, but typical of this issue, nothing is clear.
Did some further research, and the general consensus is that ANY color change is bad. Yellow and blue making green and all.....
Opinions?
The heads have never been off this motor while I have had it. Got it from a junk yard so no known history.
Heads off and pressure test/surface time, or???
Martin
At idle, electric fan kicked on at 180 and the temp stays there. Up to 2200rpm's, temp goes slowly to 215 with both the Taurus fan on, and the condenser fans in front of the radiator on. Drop back to idle, temp drops. No hoses collapsing, and if anything they get bigger with the pressure in the system. Slight hiss when removing the overflow tank cap.
Did the test and the fluid went from blue to green! I wish it had turned yellow per the instructions, but typical of this issue, nothing is clear.
Did some further research, and the general consensus is that ANY color change is bad. Yellow and blue making green and all.....
Opinions?
The heads have never been off this motor while I have had it. Got it from a junk yard so no known history.
Heads off and pressure test/surface time, or???
Martin
I just did a flush on my coolant system, and I couldnt believe the silt that came out of the radiator and engine.
My engine was also from a junkyard. It runs way cooler now.
On another note, typically when you are only getting extra heat while driving at rpm that indicates that the heat transfer capabilities of the radiator are insufficient.
Basically the heat generated by the motor under load is more than the radiator can remove while at increased RPM. I would switch to a thicker and better radiator since you can not fit a taller one in the Rover.
Good Luck
My engine was also from a junkyard. It runs way cooler now.
On another note, typically when you are only getting extra heat while driving at rpm that indicates that the heat transfer capabilities of the radiator are insufficient.
Basically the heat generated by the motor under load is more than the radiator can remove while at increased RPM. I would switch to a thicker and better radiator since you can not fit a taller one in the Rover.
Good Luck
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 276
Likes: 1
From: Mid Mo via Lancs. England
Just read your sig.....y first car back hoe in England was a 1.3L Opel Kadette!
Anyways....
Cooling system is free and clear, no restrictions there.
The radiator is as big as I can go. It's a FSR all aluminum double or triple pass deal. I had to get it to where the top and bottom hoses are on the same side, although I dont think this could effect it too much when sitting with no load on the engine? It was basically at a high idle today in the shop, no load besides the ac compressor.
Martin
Anyways....
Cooling system is free and clear, no restrictions there.
The radiator is as big as I can go. It's a FSR all aluminum double or triple pass deal. I had to get it to where the top and bottom hoses are on the same side, although I dont think this could effect it too much when sitting with no load on the engine? It was basically at a high idle today in the shop, no load besides the ac compressor.
Martin
I had the same exact issue after converting my Jeep.
Turned out the adapter company sent me a standard radiator vs the heavy duty larger one.
Back then I would get up to 225/230 on the freeway and 180 in town.
After the radiator swap I never see Temps above 197 except when running the ac in 100 plus weather.
During the fall and winter I barely get above 180 now.
Fan is a 16" Spal puller with an aluminum shroud.
Turned out the adapter company sent me a standard radiator vs the heavy duty larger one.
Back then I would get up to 225/230 on the freeway and 180 in town.
After the radiator swap I never see Temps above 197 except when running the ac in 100 plus weather.
During the fall and winter I barely get above 180 now.
Fan is a 16" Spal puller with an aluminum shroud.
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Launching!
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 276
Likes: 1
From: Mid Mo via Lancs. England
How could I improve my cooling though?
Would it help if the top hose went onto the drivers side of the engine bay/radiator you think? Would have to redo the intake....
Martin
Would it help if the top hose went onto the drivers side of the engine bay/radiator you think? Would have to redo the intake....
Martin
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 87
Likes: 0
From: Kentucky
I may be shooting in the wrong field here, but I had this problem with my Camaro when I first swapped it. I had originally capped off my steam vents coming out of the heads. I plumbed it back into my radiator and it fixed it. It was not circulating good, causing the excess heat to stay trapped. If you have not already I would tie into the radiator or water pump. Just an idea that might help you.
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 276
Likes: 1
From: Mid Mo via Lancs. England
The rear vents were blocked off already. The front ones go the the coolant overflow tank. I did notice that when I squeezed the top hose when the tester was in the overflow tank, there was a LOT of bubbles for a while......
Martin
Martin
TECH Resident
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 954
Likes: 9
From: Encinitas CA
TECH Resident
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 954
Likes: 9
From: Encinitas CA
In this thread it says Dexcool turns the test green. Sounds like inconclusive results on head gasket test.
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/s...t=72706&page=2
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/s...t=72706&page=2
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 276
Likes: 1
From: Mid Mo via Lancs. England
Had some time today so made an inline steam vent/bleeder adapter from stuff I had laying around. 1 3/4" tubing, a 1/8" NPT 90 degree barb and a bleeder in 1/8" NPT. Ran the steam hose to the top hose, with the fitting in the middle of it. Bled it a little and went for a drive.
Ambient temp was @95 degrees.
Engine ECM is reading the same engine temperature as the Autometer gauge.
On idle, engine fan (Taurus fan with shroud) cycles on and off wherever its set. Currently on @200, off at @190
70mph, temp of 225. Drop it into 3rd gear (4L60E) and it went to 240 on a light steady throttle at the same speed.
Park it, temp starts to drop.
Trans temp 190-200, sensor is on the outlet line at the trans oil pan.
Some measurements I took with the IR temp gun when I got back home.
Water pump outlet, at the aluminum neck 230.
Thermostat housing heading back to the pump 212.
Top of aluminum radiator 143
Bottom of radiator 128
Cylinder temps, measured on the downpipes of the manifolds.
Cylinder:
Rear
8=538 7=400
6=380 5=470
4=500 3=530
2=440 1=439
Front
Trying to get an exact measurement from the manifolds is kinda hard, but some interesting numbers maybe?
I did unscrew the bleeder when I got back, and got air before coolant, so there was air in there.
Thoughts??
Thanks as always
Martin
Ambient temp was @95 degrees.
Engine ECM is reading the same engine temperature as the Autometer gauge.
On idle, engine fan (Taurus fan with shroud) cycles on and off wherever its set. Currently on @200, off at @190
70mph, temp of 225. Drop it into 3rd gear (4L60E) and it went to 240 on a light steady throttle at the same speed.
Park it, temp starts to drop.
Trans temp 190-200, sensor is on the outlet line at the trans oil pan.
Some measurements I took with the IR temp gun when I got back home.
Water pump outlet, at the aluminum neck 230.
Thermostat housing heading back to the pump 212.
Top of aluminum radiator 143
Bottom of radiator 128
Cylinder temps, measured on the downpipes of the manifolds.
Cylinder:
Rear
8=538 7=400
6=380 5=470
4=500 3=530
2=440 1=439
Front
Trying to get an exact measurement from the manifolds is kinda hard, but some interesting numbers maybe?
I did unscrew the bleeder when I got back, and got air before coolant, so there was air in there.
Thoughts??
Thanks as always
Martin
TECH Resident
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 954
Likes: 9
From: Encinitas CA
Is there no way to keep the bleeder open while driving?
Radiator top temps doesn't sound right. I found that shooting at shiny aluminum (like the tank) doesn't return correct #s. I can shoot in to the fins, though and get good #s.
Doug
Radiator top temps doesn't sound right. I found that shooting at shiny aluminum (like the tank) doesn't return correct #s. I can shoot in to the fins, though and get good #s.
Doug
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 276
Likes: 1
From: Mid Mo via Lancs. England
I can leave the bleeder open while driving ........Until all the coolant comes out and it blows up
If I changed the bleeder to one with a nipple, I could, in theory, run the coolant into a catch tank. I added some more coolant to it this morning, and got air out of the bleeder again. Started it and ran it until no more air. Still did the same thing when I ran to get some full synthetic for the wifes Rover.
I can try to shoot temps again when I get hers out of the shop.
Martin
If I changed the bleeder to one with a nipple, I could, in theory, run the coolant into a catch tank. I added some more coolant to it this morning, and got air out of the bleeder again. Started it and ran it until no more air. Still did the same thing when I ran to get some full synthetic for the wifes Rover.
I can try to shoot temps again when I get hers out of the shop.
Martin
TECH Resident
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 954
Likes: 9
From: Encinitas CA
stock, the vent line bleeder is a nipple which dumps to some part of the cooling system. A radiator tank with a nipple, T in another coolant line, combined coolant tank or other.
I wonder if the temps are off due to boiling gas in the head which isn't bleeding out?
Doug
I wonder if the temps are off due to boiling gas in the head which isn't bleeding out?
Doug