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Subscribed. I just bought an all stock 2000 TJ with a rod knocking 4.0. I'm studying the LS swap. Any tips, tricks, or advice is what I'm looking for. I'm leaning towards a LM4 and 4L60E. Also want to keep the A/C and factory gauges.
Nice jeep! Nicely built, love your drive train!
I like the idea of the water pump for being different, I'm not aware of lifespan /durability pros and cons, but how fast can water flow anywhere, when it's regulated by a thermostat?
Just my thoughts, not slamming the idea at all, but you have so much power and gears (literally in spades).......That I would think that a pretty problem free/no worries/simpler/cheaper belt driven water pump would be way to go.
I would think better radiator/fan/s could be a great addition, (maybe you already got the good stuff)
I can deff see for a drag car, that only needs it for short passes, failures might not be as detrimental, but your out spending more time on a trail/wheelin' just being in a bad *** jeep!
How much hp are the pumps claimed to free up?
Will follow your build for sure
Ok, I'm back! For Suburban Tyler. If I was not dead set on having an LS3, I would buy a used chev/gmc with the engine and trans you want. Get an adapter to run the 231 t/c and do a basic build/cleanup of the engine. It will cost a lot less and you will have all the small items. Small items add up quickly! Things like hardware, sensors etc. Novak Enterprises has a lot of good info on their site about retaining the stock gauges.
For slocaddy, my thoughts on trying the electric pump are this. When running the rubicon or other tough trails, my jeep is loaded down, the rocks reflect heat, the rocks prevent breezes from flowing through, often times I am on the throttle in 4 low and not getting much air into the grill or winching someone else with the throttle kicked up a little. At idle for hours, there is a lot of heat build up, thus the hood vents. On my jeeps I drill a small hole or two in the thermostat to allow some coolant to flow. I am not sure either about how long this pump will last. It's not my DD, so I'm not real worried about longevity. As to how much power it really free's up? In the hot summer, I think that once I turn on the a/c or crank on the wheel and use the p/s pump it's a wash. The cheapest way is the belt driven pump, no doubt! It's an expensive little experiment. The worse I can do is my best Beavis impression and say "Hey, this sucks!" and change back to the stock pump!
Plasma cut off rear bumper and mounts. Was a custom bumper mount system, not all bolt on. I'll leave the rear mounts loose because the genright tire carrier will need two bolt holes drilled once I drop the gas tank.
Got the engine and trans bolted together. Headers, motor mount plates and starter installed. Maybe tomorrow will be the test fit. Hey slocaddy! I have a 1957 Cadillac limo that may be my next project. It is the style that does not have the glass divider between the seats. Looking forward to seeing your project as well!
Ok, I'm back! For Suburban Tyler. If I was not dead set on having an LS3, I would buy a used chev/gmc with the engine and trans you want. Get an adapter to run the 231 t/c and do a basic build/cleanup of the engine. It will cost a lot less and you will have all the small items. Small items add up quickly! Things like hardware, sensors etc. Novak Enterprises has a lot of good info on their site about retaining the stock gauges.
I have my eye on an engine. As far as the transfer case goes, "I think" I am going to shoot for a 231 from an 92+ S-10. At least the front side of the case and get an adapter from an 02 ZR2 that has a 4L60E. That way I can still use the 27 spline output and input. I may wrong on some or all of this. I'm never to sure until everything is in front of me. Friend of mine has this setup on is LS 94 Wrangler if I remember right on what he told me. Since his wasn't obd2 his set up will be a little different then mine since I want to keep the factory gauges. I didn't even think about the EVAP. Something else I probably may try to keep to keep both computers happy. I'm still studying though.
If you use the 231, consider getting the wider chain. I like the 231. It is light, easy to work on and has some after market support. I am likely going to ditch the jeep computer. For gauges, I am looking at the obd2 style from speedhut. Also, you will need to figure out which fead (front end access. drive) you will use. It is determined by which balancer/pulley you use. Mine is the corvette offset which is closest to the engine. Holley was my choice for engine brackets. They specify which p/s pump, alternator and a/c pump to use. For our jeeps, the stock low mounted LS a/c pump will not fit. That is why I am using an aftermarket kit.
The compressor that is on the stock engine is up high and on passenger side. The holley kit is also high/pass side. I just ordered a sanden 4711, which has the same bolt pattern as the 508 model. The 508 model is one of the models holley says to use. However, the 4711 is a 7 piston model instead of a 5 piston like the 508. In researching this I found that the 7 piston models make less vibration on LS motors as compared to the 5 piston models. The lines should bolt up ok. FYI- there are a lot of Chinese made, Sanden "style" compressors out there. They are cheap in price too! In talking to one tech, he said the Chinese ones are not made to the same specs as the original. I don't need any failures so I ponied up and got a real Sanden!
On my 98 TJ LS swap I used the stock speedo, volt, temp and at first oil pressure gauges. I then added a Auto meter oil pressure gauge for better accuracy.
I used a smaller Auto meter tach since the stock tach won't work with the LS computer. Tucked the tach and oil pressure gauge right up next to the windshield pillar. Can't really see it from the out side of the Jeep.
Also if you are running a stock height TJ watch the clearance between the left upper control arm and the alternator if running Fbody accessories. I'm running Rubicon springs and added longer bump stops to keep the control arm from hitting the alternator. If I was to do it again I would use truck accessories. They are cheap and very available.
To JIMB- Is your LS a gen3 with 24x reluctor? This one is gen4 with 58x reluctor. I am looking at obd2 gauges from speedhut. The e38 provides so much info it relieves me from hooking up more wires to senders! Plus the model I am looking at allows me to change gearing and tire size without using an outside programmer like HP. Use 33's on the street and 35's offroad.
On my suspension it's a three link front so there is no left upper control arm! I will be checking clearances though. My concern is the oil pan.
24 tooth Gen 3. I did the swap almost 7-8 years ago so someone may have come up with some type of work around for the stock tach. The stock oil pressure gauge kind of gives you a range of pressure. The Auto meter gauge is much more accurate. Having said that after 7-8 years I hardly look at it.
Get the jeep rolled into the front garage where the engine is. Try to test fit the engine and the hoist runs into the hood. The hood will not fold back because it hits the ceiling. The solution! Put on small tires. Or so I think! The hood still does not clear the ceiling. So I will lower this baby to the floor and flop the hood back out of the way. There is enough room when the hood is resting on the windshield. Like all builds...one step forward and two steps back.
Jeep looks willing to take all that motor!
I've ran into "dang it low celing stuff" thinking I could put my top up on my jeep to drive in the rain.......
I'm following progress, and enjoying it. I have a 2007 4door rubicon that I am about to swap. I just picked up my motor from Texas Speed and Performance. I am doing a 408 stroker. I have ordered my wiring harness from PSI, motor mounts, trans mount, radiator, and transfer case adapter from Novak. Trans is currently being built, (4l80). Thanks for the write up. It really helps to read other peoples build.
I saw the towel on the windshield frame. Good plan the hood will dent some what easily.
I would suggest unbolting the hood and fenders. About 20 bolts and they are off. Makes working around everything so much easier.
That LS3 is going to be great.
I like the Howell harnesses over the PSI just due to the braided harness cover that Howell uses. I put the LS computer right under the brake master cylinder. On a TJ there is a nice bracket.
Are you going to have this running for the summer?
King kong- That motor is going to kick a$$!
JIMB- I was trying not to remove the fenders! I may need to after all. The space under the master cylinder might work. Will first need to lay the harness out and see what I've got. That location had been used for my viair compressor. Been thinking of relocating it, so that may be an option. Thanks! Hoping to have it running soon.
Suburban Tyler sent me a PM that does concern these swaps. Relating to header/motor mount/steering shaft support bracket/starter clearance issues. I would recommend that you select the motor mounts and headers from the same company to ensure they work together. The ones that come to mind are Advance Adapters and Novak. Both are great companies with great products. I am removing my headers and starter for my next attempt at a test fit. The headers are a nice coated style and don't need to be scratched up. They will be installed loosely once the engine is in place. The starter is a chrome one piece sealed unit from summit. Behind it is a sensor that would be difficult to plug into if the starter was mounted.
The stock steering bracket could cause problems if you made your own motor mounts or bought a kit without them. The novak kit has a new steering shaft support bracket that gets welded onto the driv side motor mount. Pretty sure AA has the same thing.
Also, the headers from novak are made by sanderson. Nice quality and beautiful! Kinda odd in that they do not use a gasket at the heads, but use black silicone sealant. The collector uses a really thick copper gasket.
When I did my swap the Novak/Sanderson headers weren't finalized yet so I went with Hooker block huggers. 1 5/8". I've used the Sanderson's on other LS swaps with good results. It is a bit strange the no gasket design but it worked well. I always use copper gaskets for collectors and exhaust work. Prep them with a thin layer of high temp RTV and they won't leak.
The steering shaft bracket I made from some steel I had laying around. Attached it to the motor mount on the drivers side. I made the motor mounts as the Novak's weren't available yet.
Yes it's better to plug in the crank sensor before bolting on the starter. Also it's nice to fab the exhaust so you can pull the starter with out unbolting the exhaust or header. I brought the left side exhaust from the header around the front of the oil pan, using a 2:1 merge with the right side into a 3" cat. Then the largest 3" Flowmaster muffler I could fit to a 3" tail pipe. All mandrel bent tubing cut and welded as needed. If I was to do it again I would run two 2.5" cats then into the merge to the muffler for better flow. Also 1.75" shorty headers. The 3" tail pipe meant for a Grand Cherokee. It fit with some rework.
Test fit of engine went well. The area above the drivers side bell housing needs some treatment from my 2lb. Ford wrench. There was maybe 3/8 of an inch clearance. My concern was the tall, 6L80 trans. It had plenty of room. The transfer case was not test fitted. However, it is an atlas II and can be clocked as needed. The oil pan (2010 Camaro model) did clear the axle/suspension and had some room for the exhaust. I will still replace it because the new one will give me so much more room to work with. On the Camaro pan, there are bosses that stick out from the pan around 2 inches. I have no idea what they bolted to in the Camaro, but they take up valuable room.
Plus...the oil pan still would need to come off to drill a hole for the dipstick.
It looks like there is room for the electric water pump. There is room on the passenger side inner fender to mount the ECM. This would let me mount the air compressor under the master cylinder. This is a very closely mounted engine swap. There is little room for error and I am glad I did not have to fab these myself. My hat is off to those of you who did it all on your own!
Folks! The lighter weight of this combo is noticeable! There is an 80lb difference.
JIMB- Thank you again! Prepping the collector gaskets sounds like a good idea. My plan on the exhaust is to build it with flanges in specific locations so I can remove it as needed. I have 2 cats that are 2.5 inches (hi flowing) and a merge pipe that exits at 3 inches. The muffler is a Solo Performance "Stealth" model. They have a resonator that I purchased a swell.
I know! It's an LS let it be heard! On the trail, I need to hear my spotters! On the street I have this uncanny urge to screw with mustangs, Hondas or any victim! Just straight line stuff, no corners! Everyone knows that jeeps are geared low and just aren't that fast!
02-14-2016, 08:57 PM
