LQ9 Vs. 5.3 swap
08-14-2019, 01:48 PM
#41
Restricted User
Whats the point of having an (any engine) at displacement of 4 or 5 Liters for performance? Do you have any clue how large that is? Anything that large, if you are not going to have at least 800rwhp is a verypoor decision for performance applications, why do you need my help? I can't help your kind-> No, these posts aren't for you, guys who only want a regular engine, don't bother reading my stuff. I only cater to the performance crowd, approx 200hp per liter is a rough minimum for any engine platform or you had better switch fast!
for example 2L @ 400hp is a minimum, any sr20/4g63 can do that
3L @ 600hp minimum same thing, Aristo/Supra think this is stock territory
... do the math
LOL why are you still here?
at it being 'rod crushing' get a clue? Not trying to talk down just saying, you really don't know huh?
3.0L engine with stock rods will support ~800ft*lbs of torque, OEM engine. For 2.0L historically somewhere around 500ft*lbs is typical. A Six liter with stock rods would then theoretically support approaching 1600 ft*lbs of torque! Even if we account for weaker rods/girdle/block/design/etc it still lands somewhere in the 1200-1300ft*lbs ranges.
By force analysis, it should be possible, given the evidence. No, this is not a *lot* of torque, just 800!
Because power gets inane above 1000~ for daily drivers, I recommend the smallest stock V8 engine usually- 4.8L in this platform. When turbocharged, the engine displacement no longer affects the output total. The only ones who care about large displacement (to repeat), shouldn't be reading, because they just want it to use like a regular engine, for towing or something, not max rpm performance.
4.8L makes as much power as the turbo can provide. 6L makes as much power as the turbo can provide. The number is based on the turbo, not the engine. For daily/reliable/economy, Smaller is better fuel efficiency, so for example I want ~3.5L based on the weight of my vehicle and intended application, but the closest I can get is 4.8, ok so I will take that. Oh they have one engine thats 100lbs less and also LARGER at 5.3? Hmmmm yeah... okay I'll take that... seems fishy (whats the catch) too good to be true... but it isn't too good to be true, it really is -100lbs and bigger displacement thats ******* crazy if you aren't using that, it weighs around what the 2.0L for my car weighs!! How are you not buying these things up and hoarding them in a pile to sleep on... mental note not to announce my plans...
don't buy the Al 5.3L, that leaves more for me to hoard, so 6L has my vote
be the rod
The most important aspect of 'taking care of the rods' in performance is to turbocharge the engine. Backpressure from the turbine will help hold the rod down to the crankshaft on the exhaust stroke, thus preserving the engine internals, increasing it's redline safety. Every engine will benefit in this way from turbocharging, it is part of the reason those small engines can support such large power, if there was no cushion on the exhaust stroke it would fly apart. Using stronger rods and powerful hardware specifically to protect the rod on the exhaust stroke is a half-assed band-aid for the real problem of lack of turbocharger! In this way, I see ALL engines with turbochargers... and there are minimum expectations which depend on displacement to consider for each individual case...
theres nothing wrong with my perception you guys just need to come up a bit , get more experience I guess. Try using smaller engines to get perception for bigger ones. 2L does 500rwhp now from factory (seen it a couple times on 'the' dyno) junk looking cars, VW and stuff front wheel drive E85. If that 2L has 500 and the 3L has 800, you do the math from there and tell me what you think 6L should have, as a minimum. Hint: Its more than 800.
for example 2L @ 400hp is a minimum, any sr20/4g63 can do that
3L @ 600hp minimum same thing, Aristo/Supra think this is stock territory
... do the math
LOL why are you still here?
at it being 'rod crushing' get a clue? Not trying to talk down just saying, you really don't know huh?
3.0L engine with stock rods will support ~800ft*lbs of torque, OEM engine. For 2.0L historically somewhere around 500ft*lbs is typical. A Six liter with stock rods would then theoretically support approaching 1600 ft*lbs of torque! Even if we account for weaker rods/girdle/block/design/etc it still lands somewhere in the 1200-1300ft*lbs ranges.
By force analysis, it should be possible, given the evidence. No, this is not a *lot* of torque, just 800!
Because power gets inane above 1000~ for daily drivers, I recommend the smallest stock V8 engine usually- 4.8L in this platform. When turbocharged, the engine displacement no longer affects the output total. The only ones who care about large displacement (to repeat), shouldn't be reading, because they just want it to use like a regular engine, for towing or something, not max rpm performance.
4.8L makes as much power as the turbo can provide. 6L makes as much power as the turbo can provide. The number is based on the turbo, not the engine. For daily/reliable/economy, Smaller is better fuel efficiency, so for example I want ~3.5L based on the weight of my vehicle and intended application, but the closest I can get is 4.8, ok so I will take that. Oh they have one engine thats 100lbs less and also LARGER at 5.3? Hmmmm yeah... okay I'll take that... seems fishy (whats the catch) too good to be true... but it isn't too good to be true, it really is -100lbs and bigger displacement thats ******* crazy if you aren't using that, it weighs around what the 2.0L for my car weighs!! How are you not buying these things up and hoarding them in a pile to sleep on... mental note not to announce my plans...
don't buy the Al 5.3L, that leaves more for me to hoard, so 6L has my vote
be the rod
The most important aspect of 'taking care of the rods' in performance is to turbocharge the engine. Backpressure from the turbine will help hold the rod down to the crankshaft on the exhaust stroke, thus preserving the engine internals, increasing it's redline safety. Every engine will benefit in this way from turbocharging, it is part of the reason those small engines can support such large power, if there was no cushion on the exhaust stroke it would fly apart. Using stronger rods and powerful hardware specifically to protect the rod on the exhaust stroke is a half-assed band-aid for the real problem of lack of turbocharger! In this way, I see ALL engines with turbochargers... and there are minimum expectations which depend on displacement to consider for each individual case...
theres nothing wrong with my perception you guys just need to come up a bit , get more experience I guess. Try using smaller engines to get perception for bigger ones. 2L does 500rwhp now from factory (seen it a couple times on 'the' dyno) junk looking cars, VW and stuff front wheel drive E85. If that 2L has 500 and the 3L has 800, you do the math from there and tell me what you think 6L should have, as a minimum. Hint: Its more than 800.
08-14-2019, 01:48 PM
#42
I think the post above really shows why displacement isn't the real "more is better" attitude for performance efficiency minded crowd.
I get the impression most are undergrad students, many reading and not posting, so by being continuously exact with meaning many must re-think their previous perspectives and recreate what is assumed to be the 'normal' because even if you DO find a stable, perfect operating system, there will still be materials and control advancements in the future which can further improve on that foundation. So one must be constantly improving as well, and able to adapt to new incoming information.
08-14-2019, 02:03 PM
#43
I know you like ddn because you consider yourself more intelligent than he is.
I find it distasteful that you are only friendly with those who you consider less intelligent than you.
When I saw that highly undrivable, no air filter car... I felt bad for you. I thought, "he will learn from that" and placed you low in mechanic skill. I'm afraid to ask what you've done since.
If you are going to take shots at me it will end poorly, I hit back hard if I want to. I am still trying to be very nice to you because I feel like it would be similar to hitting a (incapacitated individual), its not their fault, poor animal.
08-14-2019, 02:06 PM
#44
Restricted User
I know YOU can't read them, but they are not for you.
I know you like ddn because you consider yourself more intelligent than he is.
I find it distasteful that you are only friendly with those who you consider less intelligent than you.
When I saw that highly undrivable, no air filter car... I felt bad for you. I thought, "he will learn from that" and placed you low in mechanic skill. I'm afraid to ask what you've done since.
If you are going to take shots at me it will end poorly, I hit back hard if I want to. I am still trying to be very nice to you.
I know you like ddn because you consider yourself more intelligent than he is.
I find it distasteful that you are only friendly with those who you consider less intelligent than you.
When I saw that highly undrivable, no air filter car... I felt bad for you. I thought, "he will learn from that" and placed you low in mechanic skill. I'm afraid to ask what you've done since.
If you are going to take shots at me it will end poorly, I hit back hard if I want to. I am still trying to be very nice to you.
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G Atsma (08-14-2019)
08-14-2019, 02:08 PM
#45
Pretty sure this is the question that most of us are asking too. Here's a reference for you --- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_holes
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G Atsma (08-14-2019)
08-14-2019, 02:15 PM
#46
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...post1599504992
You are the reason I came back to LS1tech that day, out of retirement
hubris asked me gently to teach you a lesson for being overconfident in your own awareness, again, and I said "okay but promise me more than 800ft*lbs of torque and less than 6L in a reliable daily driver" and we shook hands
08-14-2019, 02:15 PM
#47
I know YOU can't read them, but they are not for you.
I know you like ddn because you consider yourself more intelligent than he is.
I find it distasteful that you are only friendly with those who you consider less intelligent than you.
When I saw that highly undrivable, no air filter car... I felt bad for you. I thought, "he will learn from that" and placed you low in mechanic skill. I'm afraid to ask what you've done since.
If you are going to take shots at me it will end poorly, I hit back hard if I want to. I am still trying to be very nice to you because I feel like it would be similar to hitting a (incapacitated individual), its not their fault, poor animal.
I know you like ddn because you consider yourself more intelligent than he is.
I find it distasteful that you are only friendly with those who you consider less intelligent than you.
When I saw that highly undrivable, no air filter car... I felt bad for you. I thought, "he will learn from that" and placed you low in mechanic skill. I'm afraid to ask what you've done since.
If you are going to take shots at me it will end poorly, I hit back hard if I want to. I am still trying to be very nice to you because I feel like it would be similar to hitting a (incapacitated individual), its not their fault, poor animal.
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G Atsma (08-14-2019)
you wouldn't give him the satisfaction!
08-14-2019, 03:53 PM
#50
I've never seen anyone who could turn a thread into a **** show so fast. Guess it's time for a mod to review this post and see if it can be cleaned up.
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G Atsma (08-14-2019)
08-14-2019, 03:57 PM
#51
The only way to rid the forum of him is to report him to the Mods, He really needs a permanent vacation from this forum.
I don't always agree with everyone on this forum and I recognize everyone is going to have their own opinions but his posts go way beyond that.
I don't always agree with everyone on this forum and I recognize everyone is going to have their own opinions but his posts go way beyond that.
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G Atsma (08-14-2019)
08-14-2019, 04:41 PM
#52
TECH Senior Member
Are you saying I have incorrectly made the assumption that everyone here is a student, and not a professor? Nobody posting is a college professor. They are going to READ this but not post here themselves.
I think the post above really shows why displacement isn't the real "more is better" attitude for performance efficiency minded crowd.
I get the impression most are undergrad students, many reading and not posting, so by being continuously exact with meaning many must re-think their previous perspectives and recreate what is assumed to be the 'normal' because even if you DO find a stable, perfect operating system, there will still be materials and control advancements in the future which can further improve on that foundation. So one must be constantly improving as well, and able to adapt to new incoming information.
I think the post above really shows why displacement isn't the real "more is better" attitude for performance efficiency minded crowd.
I get the impression most are undergrad students, many reading and not posting, so by being continuously exact with meaning many must re-think their previous perspectives and recreate what is assumed to be the 'normal' because even if you DO find a stable, perfect operating system, there will still be materials and control advancements in the future which can further improve on that foundation. So one must be constantly improving as well, and able to adapt to new incoming information.
Yes, many read and do not post as they are absorbing what they are reading, and if/when they DO post it's to ask for further knowledge AND/OR add something to what is presented. It's not a matter of constantly striving to improve, more just doing the desired mods to reach a performance goal, usually within a certain budget. Most of my posting on these forums is to help others with knowledge I have acquired thru life AND right here. My knowledge is to be shared, and done humbly.
Plus, many do not have the luxury of choosing engine size. They are modding/using what they have, and many/most of them will be 4.8/5.3L engines, as they are most common/inexpensive.
So drop the arrogance or find your sorry *** booted from here AGAIN. This time not self-imposed. Many here would agree with this.
Last edited by G Atsma; 08-14-2019 at 06:58 PM.
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ddnspider (08-14-2019)
11-06-2019, 10:11 PM
#53
*following
i myself have a project lined up where reliability is more key than power + i plan A/C.
so
i have a 5.3 Aluminum LC9 SBE, that i built for a Single turbo /Drag car project that i sold.
So the motor is fresh & solid with 243 heads, a lunati Voodoo turbo cam, LS9 headgaskets , studs and all new bearings.
im just not sure if a turbo Setup brings the reliability im looking for since i would want to drive this car , and possibly accross country.
So i was rather thinking N/A ( less that can break) But also not a stock N/A i will be cammed and tuned at least and make some OK power.
When having this thought i am not sure if my 5.3 is the right motor to run N/A ( i would change the cam of course) and what would be the possible power potential of a cammed 5.3 LC9 with decent heads?
Or should i just get a 6.0 for a N/A build? (& cam it)
i myself have a project lined up where reliability is more key than power + i plan A/C.
so
i have a 5.3 Aluminum LC9 SBE, that i built for a Single turbo /Drag car project that i sold.
So the motor is fresh & solid with 243 heads, a lunati Voodoo turbo cam, LS9 headgaskets , studs and all new bearings.
im just not sure if a turbo Setup brings the reliability im looking for since i would want to drive this car , and possibly accross country.
So i was rather thinking N/A ( less that can break) But also not a stock N/A i will be cammed and tuned at least and make some OK power.
When having this thought i am not sure if my 5.3 is the right motor to run N/A ( i would change the cam of course) and what would be the possible power potential of a cammed 5.3 LC9 with decent heads?
Or should i just get a 6.0 for a N/A build? (& cam it)
11-06-2019, 10:35 PM
#54
TECH Senior Member
Unless someone kickstarts this thread again, there isn't much to follow here. The last few pages involved getting Kingtalon's *** booted out of here.