Question for you conversion guys
Question for you conversion guys My dad and I are thinking about making a hot rod from a '33/'34 ford. I'm thinking that a whole f-body/corvette drivetrain would be a good way to go. I mean, LS1, T56, "non 10 bolt" 
I think this would be cool because I have already read a ton about this stuff and know what would be good to buy, and with fuel injection and overdrive, it would be a very drivable car.
What I am wondering is, when doing a conversion like this, can you put in the pcm from an f-body? I really don't understand how this works. But you have to control the engine somehow, and don't the newer cars all require a computer to do this? Would this be easy to add to a hot rod? I mean, can you buy a new pcm and all the wiring to hook it up? How does this work? Have any of you done a conversion into non-computer controlled vehicles?
Sorry, but I now NOTHING about this, but I would like to clear things up before we even start thinking about doing this. Has anyone done a conversion into a hot rod like this? Does fuel injection have to be controlled via a pcm? Is this a good idea for a setup in an old car like that?
Thanks!!!
I think this would be cool because I have already read a ton about this stuff and know what would be good to buy, and with fuel injection and overdrive, it would be a very drivable car.What I am wondering is, when doing a conversion like this, can you put in the pcm from an f-body? I really don't understand how this works. But you have to control the engine somehow, and don't the newer cars all require a computer to do this? Would this be easy to add to a hot rod? I mean, can you buy a new pcm and all the wiring to hook it up? How does this work? Have any of you done a conversion into non-computer controlled vehicles?
Sorry, but I now NOTHING about this, but I would like to clear things up before we even start thinking about doing this. Has anyone done a conversion into a hot rod like this? Does fuel injection have to be controlled via a pcm? Is this a good idea for a setup in an old car like that?
Thanks!!!
You've done a few conversion vehicles, or made a few harnesses?
Is it possible to just order a new pcm and harness for an f-body and use it on the conversion vehicle? Link?
The reason I ask is because I'm probably going to get HPTuners and if I could buy a pcm that they support, I could tune it without any problems.
I'm going to spend some time looking at the forum in your sig, looks interesting. Thanks for the help so far!
Is it possible to just order a new pcm and harness for an f-body and use it on the conversion vehicle? Link?
The reason I ask is because I'm probably going to get HPTuners and if I could buy a pcm that they support, I could tune it without any problems.
I'm going to spend some time looking at the forum in your sig, looks interesting. Thanks for the help so far!
hp tuners will do what you need on the pcm, any factory one will work just make sure you buy the right car to support.. as for the harness it is fairly easy to make one from a factory carmaro harness.. you can get them from ebay for cheap. sometimes 150 bucks.. most of the time cheaper though.. and even better, if you buy a complete engine trans pullout with the wiring harness and computer you are all set.. just tear apart the harness hook up all the orange wires together, and the pink ones, and they go to power and ignition and you are all set.. besides the deleting of codes and vats ect... jes
Deranged Rat Fink
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From: Right here at my laptop, DUH!
There's a little more to it than that. The tach , temp, oil pressure wiring . The VSS wiring , plus the A/C stuff , for starters . Not to mention the starter wiring , too.
I have an LS1 engine/trans from a 2002 TA WS6 installed in my 1950 Merc. Front and rear suspensions are 94 Corvette ZR1. When I started this project the aftermarket had not gotten to the point that they could duplicate the GM PCM/ECM system so I opted to go with the stock units and wire harnesses. In your case with a smaller street rod, I would look into the aftermarket harnesses and computers. Take the time to read up on these systems, you'll have to do some homework because there's just too much to be learned to expect to get it all from a forum. If you have any specific questions feel free to email me at CharlieLed@***.net. BTW I also have a 35 Chevy 5W and an LS6 engine that I am looking at putting together with the C5 chassis. I also have a full set of molds for building Fiberglass 34 Ford 3Ws....
Not everyone on this forum builds/drives F or Y body cars.
Not everyone on this forum builds/drives F or Y body cars.
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I have my stock F-body PCM mounted on the firewall on my car. I tune with HPTuners, so I have the ALDL port under the dash, inside the car. It works well for me. No matter whether you use GM or aftermarket electronics, you're going to have to mount a PCM somewhere.
The latest issue of ChevyHiPerformance had an article on aftermarket control systems and a description of some of the things that are out there. F.A.S.T and Big Stuff 3 seem to be the big players right now. I honestly don't know why one would choose one of those over the GM setup or vice-versa other than cost. I haven't done enough research into those to learn what benefits they have.
-Matt
The latest issue of ChevyHiPerformance had an article on aftermarket control systems and a description of some of the things that are out there. F.A.S.T and Big Stuff 3 seem to be the big players right now. I honestly don't know why one would choose one of those over the GM setup or vice-versa other than cost. I haven't done enough research into those to learn what benefits they have.
-Matt
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Verdad Gallardo
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,707
Likes: 33
From: Anderson, Indiana
Originally Posted by matts22
My dad and I are thinking about making a hot rod from a '33/'34 ford. I'm thinking that a whole f-body/corvette drivetrain would be a good way to go. I mean, LS1, T56, "non 10 bolt" I think this would be cool because I have already read a ton about this stuff and know what would be good to buy, and with fuel injection and overdrive, it would be a very drivable car.
What I am wondering is, when doing a conversion like this, can you put in the pcm from an f-body? I really don't understand how this works. But you have to control the engine somehow, and don't the newer cars all require a computer to do this? Would this be easy to add to a hot rod? I mean, can you buy a new pcm and all the wiring to hook it up? How does this work? Have any of you done a conversion into non-computer controlled vehicles?
Sorry, but I now NOTHING about this, but I would like to clear things up before we even start thinking about doing this. Has anyone done a conversion into a hot rod like this? Does fuel injection have to be controlled via a pcm? Is this a good idea for a setup in an old car like that?
Thanks!!!
I think this would be cool because I have already read a ton about this stuff and know what would be good to buy, and with fuel injection and overdrive, it would be a very drivable car.What I am wondering is, when doing a conversion like this, can you put in the pcm from an f-body? I really don't understand how this works. But you have to control the engine somehow, and don't the newer cars all require a computer to do this? Would this be easy to add to a hot rod? I mean, can you buy a new pcm and all the wiring to hook it up? How does this work? Have any of you done a conversion into non-computer controlled vehicles?
Sorry, but I now NOTHING about this, but I would like to clear things up before we even start thinking about doing this. Has anyone done a conversion into a hot rod like this? Does fuel injection have to be controlled via a pcm? Is this a good idea for a setup in an old car like that?
Thanks!!!
Check out our web site, we can certainly help you out! We've done lots of street rod/ hot rod conversions. Tell your dad he'll love the finished product! There's nothing quite like blending the old cars with the new technology.
__________________
91 Z28 LS2 408CI, LS9 Supercharger, LPE GT7 cam, Yank3000, 3450 raceweight.
Latest numbers: 9.71 ET, 141.42 MPH, 1.40 60' , 610 RWHP Mustang Dyno
www.speartech.com
91 Z28 LS2 408CI, LS9 Supercharger, LPE GT7 cam, Yank3000, 3450 raceweight.
Latest numbers: 9.71 ET, 141.42 MPH, 1.40 60' , 610 RWHP Mustang Dyno
www.speartech.com
There was a complete drivetrain out of late model Corvette on Ebay recently. Included everything from the motor to the transaxle including the rear suspension. Something like that would be trick in a hot rod. Would have to build it on the Corvette's wheelbase though. If you were constructing your own frame it should be do able
Pat
Pat
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,707
Likes: 33
From: Anderson, Indiana
We did a complete harness/computer package for Twins Custom Concepts out in the L.A. area for a complete Corvette drivetrain going into a custom street rod. They actually lengthened the torque-tube assembly to match the wheelbase of the car!
They provided the dimensions for the amount they added, and we built them a custom harness that would reach back to the 4L60E transaxle. I guess if you're good with a welder, anything can be done!!
They provided the dimensions for the amount they added, and we built them a custom harness that would reach back to the 4L60E transaxle. I guess if you're good with a welder, anything can be done!!
__________________
91 Z28 LS2 408CI, LS9 Supercharger, LPE GT7 cam, Yank3000, 3450 raceweight.
Latest numbers: 9.71 ET, 141.42 MPH, 1.40 60' , 610 RWHP Mustang Dyno
www.speartech.com
91 Z28 LS2 408CI, LS9 Supercharger, LPE GT7 cam, Yank3000, 3450 raceweight.
Latest numbers: 9.71 ET, 141.42 MPH, 1.40 60' , 610 RWHP Mustang Dyno
www.speartech.com
Man, I'm gone for one day, I come back, and you guys have already posted tons of info! Thanks!
As for the conversion, I'm just checking it out now. It will probably be a year or more before we are ready to do it. But we've talked about it and decided that making one with streetable N/A power was what we wanted. I just wanted to know how the whole conversion with a pcm/harness worked. Seems like it is not a problem at all. Speartech, I'm sure we'll be in touch in the future.
As far as our overall plans: We know of a place that sells awesome fiberglass bodies and is pretty close to where I live. As far as the frame and stuff, I don't know if we would get one from them or have one fabricated. But I am pretty sure that we want to go with a LS1/T56/9inch or 12 bolt. We have already restored one car COMPLETELY ('69 Ford Mustang Mach 1) and I would prefer to go the premade body route this time to avoid all of the **** work. Instead, it would mostly be putting stuff together, painting, building, etc. instead of cleaning, welding, grinding, filling, etc....plus the fiberglass body will never rust. I think that a car like that--we're thinking either a '34 Ford 3 window (the classic hot rod) or a '33 Ford Sedan 2 door (able to take 4 people)--would be a blast to drive around, especially when it's just as reliable as any car on the road.
Anyway, keep the info coming if you have anything to add. Thanks again guys, glad to know this is easily possible!
As for the conversion, I'm just checking it out now. It will probably be a year or more before we are ready to do it. But we've talked about it and decided that making one with streetable N/A power was what we wanted. I just wanted to know how the whole conversion with a pcm/harness worked. Seems like it is not a problem at all. Speartech, I'm sure we'll be in touch in the future.
As far as our overall plans: We know of a place that sells awesome fiberglass bodies and is pretty close to where I live. As far as the frame and stuff, I don't know if we would get one from them or have one fabricated. But I am pretty sure that we want to go with a LS1/T56/9inch or 12 bolt. We have already restored one car COMPLETELY ('69 Ford Mustang Mach 1) and I would prefer to go the premade body route this time to avoid all of the **** work. Instead, it would mostly be putting stuff together, painting, building, etc. instead of cleaning, welding, grinding, filling, etc....plus the fiberglass body will never rust. I think that a car like that--we're thinking either a '34 Ford 3 window (the classic hot rod) or a '33 Ford Sedan 2 door (able to take 4 people)--would be a blast to drive around, especially when it's just as reliable as any car on the road.
Anyway, keep the info coming if you have anything to add. Thanks again guys, glad to know this is easily possible!
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Joined: Oct 2004
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From: Simi VAlley,CA
Since I am a Chevy dealer employee (30 yrs) I am using everything right out of the GM Performance catalog for my 1935 Ford project. The parts really aren't that expensive when you start comparing. The GM Performance "Hot Rod/Street Rod" PCM for the LS-1 (a matching harness is also available) is a real bolt-in part. The programming is "spot on" and with a stock LS-1 there is no tuning required. My hot rod runs like a banshee, idles like a swiss watch and even gets great economy.
TECH Resident
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 800
Likes: 1
From: Simi VAlley,CA
....oh yea, let me add.....you have the right idea with a glas' body. I have zillions of hours cutting, welding in repair panels, re-shaping, bracing and aligning that original Henry body. If I had it to do all over (such as the NEXT car I build), I will use a nice fresh high quality body
Originally Posted by Oscar Will
Since I am a Chevy dealer employee (30 yrs) I am using everything right out of the GM Performance catalog for my 1935 Ford project. The parts really aren't that expensive when you start comparing. The GM Performance "Hot Rod/Street Rod" PCM for the LS-1 (a matching harness is also available) is a real bolt-in part. The programming is "spot on" and with a stock LS-1 there is no tuning required. My hot rod runs like a banshee, idles like a swiss watch and even gets great economy.
Thanks
Pat
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Joined: Oct 2004
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From: Simi VAlley,CA
Sure.....these are the GM part numbers I am using,
PCM P/N 12480112
Harness P/N 12480113
There is a little known but awesome "LS-1 Installation" book that is cheap and has LOTS of part numbers and conversion stuff in it that GM has put together P/N 88959384. It contains quite a bit of accessory drive info for different configurations, wiring diagrams, troubleshooting and diagnostics and even has some relatively unknown Holden parts in it that may be used in different applications. I recommend to anyone doing a conversion to check it out, even if you don't use all the GM parts it has great info......and it's from the guys that engineered these things in the beginning.
Check with your local dealer on pricing, some have really good deals for hot rodders.
PCM P/N 12480112
Harness P/N 12480113
There is a little known but awesome "LS-1 Installation" book that is cheap and has LOTS of part numbers and conversion stuff in it that GM has put together P/N 88959384. It contains quite a bit of accessory drive info for different configurations, wiring diagrams, troubleshooting and diagnostics and even has some relatively unknown Holden parts in it that may be used in different applications. I recommend to anyone doing a conversion to check it out, even if you don't use all the GM parts it has great info......and it's from the guys that engineered these things in the beginning.
Check with your local dealer on pricing, some have really good deals for hot rodders.
Last edited by Oscar Will; Jan 14, 2005 at 10:19 AM. Reason: add info
Thanks again guys.
I was just thinking, I think that this is the way I'm going to go. But do you think there will be a lot of issues getting it to fit (the engine, tranny, etc.)? I haven't looked into it much, but I don't even know where to look to see if this setup would fit in that car.
Also, I've been reading a little bit and what are my options for headers? I'm guessing that nobody makes a set that will fit this conversion car, so I'd have to get some custom made. I just want to make sure that this is possible and not that big of a problem. I know Kooks makes custom headers, as well as other companies. How would I go about doing this? I mean, you can't give them the dimensions of everything in the engine compartment. Do they have to be made on the car or what? And there's no way that a set of F-body LS1 headers would fit, right?
What I am kind of thinking for now is to make a stroker ls1. I mean, I know what I will buy for my 2002 WS6 and I don't want to buy the same exact setup for a conversion, so this would make it more fun and I could learn a lot as I go. Good idea? I don't think I'm ready for forced induction yet. Plus, I want the muscle car sound, not the whining of a blower/turbo.
I was just thinking, I think that this is the way I'm going to go. But do you think there will be a lot of issues getting it to fit (the engine, tranny, etc.)? I haven't looked into it much, but I don't even know where to look to see if this setup would fit in that car.
Also, I've been reading a little bit and what are my options for headers? I'm guessing that nobody makes a set that will fit this conversion car, so I'd have to get some custom made. I just want to make sure that this is possible and not that big of a problem. I know Kooks makes custom headers, as well as other companies. How would I go about doing this? I mean, you can't give them the dimensions of everything in the engine compartment. Do they have to be made on the car or what? And there's no way that a set of F-body LS1 headers would fit, right?
What I am kind of thinking for now is to make a stroker ls1. I mean, I know what I will buy for my 2002 WS6 and I don't want to buy the same exact setup for a conversion, so this would make it more fun and I could learn a lot as I go. Good idea? I don't think I'm ready for forced induction yet. Plus, I want the muscle car sound, not the whining of a blower/turbo.
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 800
Likes: 1
From: Simi VAlley,CA
My 35' Ford Sedan is a good fit for the LS-1, I'm using off the shelf 97' Vette exhaust manifolds which look almost "custom made" for this chassis.....also I'm using the 97' Corvette engine mounts on pads welded to my front crossmember. I had to use a Direct Sheet Metal "Big Block" firewall to provide the clearance I needed but this thing fits better than many regular SBC or small block Ford motor conversions.