Aceshigh

I'm looking for someone that runs a shop out of their garage or someone in the Chicago area that can do an LS1 install into a 2nd gen 78 Camaro. It's a 2004 GTO LS1 with 4L60E replacing a Gen I 350 / 700R4. So the driveshaft + crossmember are done already.

I have 2 guys locally, but I'm trying to find more resources. www.ls1speed.com can't give me a legitimate estimate, they want an open ticket to do the work which I just won't do. I refuse to do that when I know they have done one of these before. Larry told me possibly around $3700....which I've been told is ludicrous especially if I pull my old motor + trans out for them and drop off a shell.

What I need done.
1. Motor mounts installed
2. Motor installed with trans
3. ECU + Harness reworked (I will be sending it to Speartech most likely)
4. Headers connected + exhaust hooked up. (haven't figured out which to buy yet)
5. Fuel system ran + tank modified.

I have the money to pay for all of this but I'm not paying a shop $4,000 to do this install. Any takers??

pt67camarols1

What is the reason , you dont do yourself? It's not that hard.

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

Lesrace (or Lesrace82) is in Rockford and has done a 2nd gen swap for himself.

hardtohitme7

02ws6bird could do a nice job and hes located in chicago

Aceshigh

Don't know how to put the new motor mounts on it.
Hell if someone could do that for me, I could probably figure out the rest with teh Street and Performance LS1 install on the first gen.

Problem is.....I don't know how to do the mounts.

I spoke with Lesrace via PM before......awhile ago. I just PM'd him again tonight.
I also spoke with the other guy you just mentioned via PM today too.
I'm waiting to hear back from them.

02WS6Bird

iTrader: (2)

I've got you covered Ace you've got Mail- only a few requirements prior to start. All are in the email we can discuss price later on

Jon @ Speed Inc

iTrader: (2)

Any estimate would be "legitimate" from us but you had a ludicrous demand of it being with in 10% on a custom job. That will not happen. Do you want an LS1 just slapped in your car or do you want everything functioning? I already gave you a list of things that you missed out of your list. Oil pan, gauges, headers? Like I explained to you, there is many things that can change right in the middle of a conversion because things do not go as planned.

If you do not have the budget to do a conversion properly then I would not recommend doing it - or try to save money and do it yourself. There are $60 motor mounts that will bolt a LS1 into any SBC application.

Teetoe_Jones

I agree with Jon- You are asking a bit much. You aren't going to get out of my shop for anywhere near that $4K figure. If you want it done right, the SpeedInc guys know what is up.

Tyler

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

Aces, I think the point that is getting lost is that you are not asking them to take your 98 Z28 and install heads, cam, full exhaust and tune it. If you were, Speed Inc. could give you a nice tight quote. In fact you are doing a custom project. They need to keep it open ended since the vast majority of custom LS1 conversions run into unique problems.

I myself have been contemplating a custom hybrid, and it's very difficult for me to control the price factor when I am not sure how stuff like the fuel system is going to work. Plus custom wiring will differ widely.

LS1 SPEED INC.

iTrader: (1)

Well put John. We can create an Estimate, but there are several things that come up during custom work of any kind. When doing a conversion, just about every system has to be addressed, and several unforeseen problems arise. Being "nailed down" on a price is unrealistic, unless you are willing to take your car at a stage where it may be not be complete, because your "cap" had been reached.

On the other hand....want to install a clutch on a 2000 Camaro? We can get you to the penny 99% of the time.

Camaro_Zach

iTrader: (19)

I was in contact with aceshigh through a friend, and he also told me he thought the estimate was out of hand. I havent been able to contact him back as im never on AIM at night. however.....

But you used two words, custom, and fabricate. When those words are mentioned, you NEVER look at less than 3g. Period. Im not sure why you think 4g is outrageous but its not at all.

If you assume its $70 an hour, 4g will only get you 57 hours of labor. (Im not sure if labor is taxed?) The swap will take more than one week at 8 hours a day. Period.

Back in the day when i knew nothing i was quoted 1g for a v8 swap into a freakin 4th gen camaro that was a v6. That is something i can now do in a day in my garage with my setup. You want a custom setup into a 2nd gen and youre not prepared to spend 4g in labor? Whoever told you that 3700 is ludacris outta do it himself.

I wanted to swap an ls1 into a 69 camaro, thats documented as all hell, everyone makes swap parts etc. i STILL expect it to take me an entire winter to do. As Jon said, you want everything to work, gauges and such. I dont want to do a hack job on my own car.

Bottom line, I will give ya a hand man, at your place haha cause that thing wouldnt leave my garage for 5+ months if we did it there. My honest opinoin is to send it to speed inc or do it yourself and have many headaches. I did my twin turbo vette in my garage, EVERYTHING was torn out, and replaced, etc. I also bought a mini fridge for my garage and a $300 stereo for the garage because i freaking live in the garage trying to get the car squared away for spring. Point is, its a headache and I know what im doing and have bout 3-4g in tools in my garage.

02WS6Bird

iTrader: (2)

All these are stout reasons, and 100% understandable. Everything will take alot of work- As I said Ace, Everything i am capable of doing, the fuel system would probably be the Biggest PITA along with the Guages which kinda slipped my mind to begin with. I have people who can fabricate things- so your mounts shouldnt be too big of a problem if you decide to go a custom route-otherwise like being said that there is a set of moutns guaranteed to swap. Oil pan is a must- and i've already seen several sites that sell those. It is alot of work, 2 months is a tight time frame but it can be done, and done right. As i said, I've worked on several all gen Camaro's and i am very familiar with LS1's. One thing you will need to know is clearances. Everything must be measured and worked outright from the get go. removal will be easiest, puting everything back is the hardest part because everything must fit. The motor and trans might be able to pull together (they should) but it might have to go in separated. It's a matter of patience, time and teamworl; and many adjustments must be made.

Let me know man whatever your decision turns out to be

Schitzo

iTrader: (6)

I am doing this swap on my 71 which is pretty much the same setup as you have. I can see why a shop would need an open ticket. I have ran into hitches in just about everything and I have to figure out a different route to follow. The fuel system alone took me 2 months to complete. I still have to mount everything.I started in Oct and hope to fire up in a couple months.

My advice to you is either be patient hook up with 02WS6bird and have him help you at your place...or

Shed the big bucks for a shop to do it.

I called S&P just for kicks and asked them how much it would cost for them to install my LS1/t56 in my 71....with the engine out. Lets just say $4000 is just a fraction of the price range they gave me.

Aceshigh

Ludicrous??? I wouldn't say that....not when I have found 2 shops in the area that can do this work for ALOT less and they guarantee it. Experienced with LS1 retrofits too. My engine bay is 10x easier to access then a 4th gens is..... Not hatin here, just being honest in my search.....2 shops emailed me from this thread so I got my point across and found what I was looking for.

Sorry, your prices were just too high for me and I heard Camaro Zach knows many of the guys from Speed Inc from what I was told. So there might be a slight bias there....I dunno. I'm buying all my components from Street and Performance....EVERYTHING. Harness and ECU is going to Speartech. I never asked Speed Inc to get my gauges and all that going IIRC. I asked them for a simple pull and drop. (I know it's not THAT simple...but it's not that complicated either) I had planned on buying all of my components myself, and was just asking for a labor quote. My new gauges aren't even in the car yet.

I was only basing this off what 4 other LS1 2nd Gen camaro owners on www.nastyz28.com have told me. Some had some work done at shops, and others did it themselves.....overall the consensus was the price you guys gave me was orbital. No offense, I'm basing it off what other experienced shop owners and enthusiasts have told me. I see some here on this site feel your price was okay.....that's cool , it just wasn't okay with me, so I've acquired the services of a different shop that fit my parameters for the work. If that doesn't work out to my expectations, then I will be learning to do this on my own with Adam assisting me.

Hell, the ONLY thing I really needed done was mounting the engine and trans.....the rest I can do myself. (Harness to Speartech of course)
So far Adam 02WS6BIRD has been the most helpful to me overall.

LS1 SPEED INC.

iTrader: (1)

Ace, no one here quoted you $3700 for mounting the engine and trans only. As much as I would like to charge $3700 for a single days worth of work, there is no way we would.

The main problem our deal wouldnt work is because before I spent the time doing a detailed quote for you, we wanted to tell you up front that with ANY type of custom work, there are always things that come up that would need to be addressed, and we wouldnt be able to "stick" to a hard number. This is typical of any type of custom job, especially one that you have to address several different "systems" on the car. You thought that was ridiculous, and unacceptable, and you "saw too many of your friends get ripped off that way".

Having a "friend of a friend" do work for you, or someone out of their garage will always be cheaper than paying a professional, insured shop to it.

Good luck with your conversion, and please post pics of the progress.

Tom

Aceshigh

Well it's possible it WAS a miscommunication by Larry during one of his busier days. I do know I spoke with.....Mike also, I believe because he knows a mutual friend and someone else quoted me $1500 just for the drop in....but I will admit the $3000 figure came from Larry. No BS......and that was after I sent my harness to Speartech and paid for it. His words "to get it in and get it running would be around $3,000 + the cost of the harness". Maybe he assumed the gauges and all that without asking....who knows. We didn't discuss anything outside of a drop in though....no headers purchase at all.

Either way, like I said, I'm not familiar with shop prices and I based my findings off others opinions.....and I'm sure you guys can do a good job, just outta my ballpark figure I've been told. It's cool, thanks for understanding.
I'm hoping it goes well, and I hope this first shop I found can truly do it for what they say......God only knows. lol Adam, I'll be in touch once I have everything in concrete answers ....right now I'm still shopping for the best option. If it's a no go on the shop, you're my Ace in the hole to help me do it.

Camaro_Zach

iTrader: (19)

Id like to say sure im biased...but the price you were quote was a 'drive the car out of our shop' price to my understanding. and thats awesome. as i said before they quoted me years ago for swapping the ls1 into a 4th gen v6 that the cost would START at 1g. So for custom work, i think 3000 is f'in great. I would only be biased if you were debating 2 shops, then id say speed inc cause im biased. im not saying its a good deal just because i "know" some people there. I know people all over. I also "know" people at shops i would never send you to. So its hard to say im baised because i know people.

But seriously man, if you do it yourself in your garage give me a shout. im more than happy to come help ya out. as tom said, post pics of the swap, ive never seen an ls1 in a 2nd gen.

Aceshigh

Like who and where ?? Give me what info ya got.
See this game can be played back and forth.
Opinions vary from person to person, shop to shop.
I've heard some bad things about certain shops already.....even Speed Inc
....like I said opinions vary....it's too hard to base a decision off that info.

Just out of curiousity though WHO or WHERE wouldn't you send me to and why not ??
I'm interested to see what you have to say now, because the more opinions I hear that are similar, the more it can sway my decision.

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

$70 hour x 40 weeks = $2800, one way to break down numbers.

I use Speed inc. for my custom FI setups. They do excellent work. Come check out my car there in April when we try to make 1100rwhp with it.

PSJ

pwrtrip75

iTrader: (8)

buy the mounts, buy an oil pan, have someone reprogram the pcm deleting all the useless codes and vats.

Bolt it in, use stock harness, and the few wires you have to hook up is easy.. bam it starts right up.

At first I thaught mine was going to be a nightmare. despite the mounts I made, and the oil pan I cut and welded up, and a few more wires, its as easy as putting an old small block in. Standing from the sidelines it does look overwhelming, but once your in it, its a peice of cake.