first gen wayne due in a second gen?
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2006
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From: shasta lake, north cali
first gen wayne due in a second gen? has anybody ever looked into putting a first gen camaro front subframe into a second gen firebird. i haven't been able to find any information from waynes website as of lately to see if he is producing second gen stuff yet. i have a 1970 firebird i want to redo the suspension on and there is a c5 wayne due sub frame for sale near me. how hard would it be to modify to work? any help would be greatly apreciated.
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2006
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From: shasta lake, north cali
thank you for the link how is martz's quality as far as handling goes. i am looking to pro tour my car and want some pretty serious cornering ability. is it worth the investment or could i just use my second gen frame and upgrade it to handle just as well?
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 273
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From: shasta lake, north cali
lsibird that car is absolutely sick. i would love to do that to my car. i have read all about yours on other posts and i wish i was skilled enough to take on a project like that. i know that the 2nd gen frame is much better than the first gen but there is a guy with a c5 wayne due subframe for a first gen camaro near me that i was thinking about buying if i could mount it. it is not a super deal but it is decent. i was just wondering how hard it would be. there are not a lot of people doing second gen front subs is that because they already kick ***?
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Launching!
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 242
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From: Los Angeles, CA
Simple answer-
A 1st gen Wayne due chassis will not fint into a 2nd gen without starting over. Too much to change to make it worth while.
Also the WD unit will kill a Martz chassis any day of the week, and last-
Aftermarket subframes save little weight off the front end, no more than 75 lbs at the max. While a nice gain, it is no where near the 150-225 that people have claimed in the past.
Tyler
A 1st gen Wayne due chassis will not fint into a 2nd gen without starting over. Too much to change to make it worth while.
Also the WD unit will kill a Martz chassis any day of the week, and last-
Aftermarket subframes save little weight off the front end, no more than 75 lbs at the max. While a nice gain, it is no where near the 150-225 that people have claimed in the past.
Tyler
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Originally Posted by Teetoe_Jones
Simple answer-
A 1st gen Wayne due chassis will not fint into a 2nd gen without starting over. Too much to change to make it worth while.
Also the WD unit will kill a Martz chassis any day of the week, and last-
Aftermarket subframes save little weight off the front end, no more than 75 lbs at the max. While a nice gain, it is no where near the 150-225 that people have claimed in the past.
Tyler
A 1st gen Wayne due chassis will not fint into a 2nd gen without starting over. Too much to change to make it worth while.
Also the WD unit will kill a Martz chassis any day of the week, and last-
Aftermarket subframes save little weight off the front end, no more than 75 lbs at the max. While a nice gain, it is no where near the 150-225 that people have claimed in the past.
Tyler
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 273
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From: shasta lake, north cali
thanks i have been told the wd was better also. i haven't seen any of there frames listed for a second gen though. i have seen threads that compared some of them and i believe there was some doubt as to the rigidity of the martz unit in hard cornering. i guess it didn't look like it was braced solid enough. since i want the cornering i would probably go wd if i were to buy either. it sounds though that for bang for buck it is just better to clean my second gen frame and put some nice pieces on it.
One question that i havent asked Martz was if someone were to use there ls1 mounts on the orginal frame then later , when and if they swiched to the Full chassis replacement if it changed the placement of the engine.
If you do find a WD after you have already installed an LS1 it might??? change the position of the engine and may also lead to new pipping or extensions.
If you do find a WD after you have already installed an LS1 it might??? change the position of the engine and may also lead to new pipping or extensions.
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 273
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From: shasta lake, north cali
i have heard that they do as well. when i heard it i believe he was custom making it for a second gen fire chicken for a client but when i have gone on his website all i ever see is the first gen stuff. so i don't know if he has gone into production for them or if they are on a case by case basis.
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2006
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From: shasta lake, north cali
Originally Posted by ss496
i have a martz, and i love it...the quality of build, fit&finish, price, and customer service are all excellent!! Everything fit perfectly!!
just an FYI, i called Martz today and talked with them about using there ls1 mounts on a stock subframe.... they dont "think" it will work since they taylor the mounts to the Martz Subframe which puts the engine in Center instead of off center...
Teetoe_Jones how do the ATS mounts work? do they center the engine( i went to the site and i did read about the mounts ) ? how close is the engine to the firewall?
How much Weight difference have you seen between Aftermarket and Sock Subframes?
Teetoe_Jones how do the ATS mounts work? do they center the engine( i went to the site and i did read about the mounts ) ? how close is the engine to the firewall?
How much Weight difference have you seen between Aftermarket and Sock Subframes?
Launching!
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 242
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From: Los Angeles, CA
Here is the LSX/T56 install we did onto a 70 Camaro, it will show you everything:
http://www.t56kit.com/projects/mortenson/
Tyler
http://www.t56kit.com/projects/mortenson/
Tyler
Take a look at my webpage.. Short list of my car:
Wayne Due / Art Morison front end (Yes it did shave 200lbs) http://www.73-ls1.com/front_suspension.html
LS1 / T56
Low compression 348 with a PT91 Turbo
Custom 3 link (originally installed the Martz rear set upand ripped it out before I even drove it)
My car was the first AM/WD front. I don't know if he has done a second gen since. He also advised he did do a couple Gen 2 / C4 fronts but had not looked at a C5 for a 2nd gen yet. That was almost 1 year ago.
He has a 74 (I think) firebird there as a build platform. I'm sure he could do a C5 front using it.
Wayne Due / Art Morison front end (Yes it did shave 200lbs) http://www.73-ls1.com/front_suspension.html
LS1 / T56
Low compression 348 with a PT91 Turbo
Custom 3 link (originally installed the Martz rear set upand ripped it out before I even drove it)
My car was the first AM/WD front. I don't know if he has done a second gen since. He also advised he did do a couple Gen 2 / C4 fronts but had not looked at a C5 for a 2nd gen yet. That was almost 1 year ago.
He has a 74 (I think) firebird there as a build platform. I'm sure he could do a C5 front using it.
Launching!
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 242
Likes: 0
From: Los Angeles, CA
Originally Posted by LIL SS
Take a look at my webpage.. Short list of my car:
Wayne Due / Art Morison front end (Yes it did shave 200lbs)
Wayne Due / Art Morison front end (Yes it did shave 200lbs)
Tyler