pedaltothemetal

Why I got my Z28 A4 in 1998?
I drove 2 Toyota Corollas manuals since 1971 and was tired of shifting. But recently I drove a couple of my buds M6, one down the strip at LACR, and the other one around the neighborhood. I now miss manual shifting. So if I got a new car today, it would be a manual.
As for which is quicker stock for stock. We all know M6s are quick after the 1/8th due to the gearing. Now if our A4s were A6s that would be a different story.
Drag racing stock for stock, depends on the driver. Stock for stock any race against a Nineball caliber of driver, the A4 will loose. Most drivers just can't outshift an auto. Or their nerves will get the better of them during a race and they miss a shift.
In the high HP LS1 the auto all the way heads up. However a slower M6 with a good driver, can be very competitive in the brackets as Nineball has mentioned.
BTW I really don't think manual shifting an auto is any fun, and is not the real deal!

Leo

promod1955

iTrader: (44)

[QUOTE]Was this a full automatic, or a manually shifted auto with a brake? Either way, that is hauling *** and just keeping that car straight is showing skill. Much different scale than a 13-second A4 though <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> . BTW, Chimps have been into space and should be smart enough to floor a gas pedal (with blocks of course). haha, what is harder, learning sign language or pressing a gas pedal? [QUOTE]

powerglide w/ brake. ide shift it but shift point is a little before the 1/8th mph cone and looking for the other car, trying to go straight, deciding to dump,lift, stay in it and watch the shift light tends to get real congested so i have an air shifter on it. 1 less thing i gotta do so i can concentrate more on putting the other guy out. hopefully a dragster. i love beating dragsters <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> .BTW, at the 1/8th mile im runnin 139+ mph. not to mention with a 1.11 60ft, i doubt i could get my hand of the transbrake and onto the shifter. talk about fun. if i didnt suck at the internet so bad ide post a pic of my pontiac.can anyone help me?... <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" />

oh and tony, its easy for chimps to go into outerspace. its not like they got shift the shuttle. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> just "stab and steer" <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" />

Crazyquik

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by promod1955:
<strong>[QUOTE]
oh and tony, its easy for chimps to go into outerspace. its not like they got shift the shuttle. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> just "stab and steer" </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" /> <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" /> <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" />

Thats a great one!!!!!

Slamming gears lets you do a cool Ronnie Sox impersonation <img border="0" alt="[Driving]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_driving3.gif" />

J.

OBSSSD

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Nine Ball:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">you have to run a "factory stock" clutch also</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Clutch has nothing to do with the transmission type. Does that mean you would run a factory torque converter in an A4?

Show me an all-motor LS1 running 10.67 or better with a stock 4L60e and 3600 lbs

RomanSS ran 9s with a stock T56. Any 9-second LS1/LT1s with an unmodified 4L60e? Nope.

Tony</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Show me an M6 running 10's on the stock 10-bolt. I'm running 11.1X on the stock 4L60E and stock 10-bolt with 3.42's. By the time my car is tuned the next couple of weeks I'll be running 10's - on the stock 4L60E and the stock 10-bolt. There hasn't ever and won't ever be an M6 that will be able to do this.

So there's your answer. The A4 is quicker, the M6 is faster. Quicker rules at the track <img border="0" alt="[Fluffy]" title="" src="graemlins/fluffy.gif" />

PewterZ28

iTrader: (1)

I had a '99 Z28 M6 that ran a best of 11.6 @ 121 mph. I loved that car and had a blast but on the street it could not compete with the A4 cars with the same or fewer mods. Street race from a stop and the A4 wins 90% of the time. Even at the drag strip I saw the A4's having the quicker ET's. All you have to do is look at the bolt on list to see that A4's dominate.

Now I have a '02 Z28 A4 and it is already faster on the motor with the same mods and I'm still on the stock converter! I've got a PT4400 waiting to go in. Let the fun begin! <img border="0" alt="[Burnout]" title="" src="graemlins/burnout.gif" />

A4 all the way! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="gr_images/icons/cool.gif" />

RedlineSS2000

Hey forget 4l60e i still want to be in control of my shifting thats why i got a turbo 400 built by trans king with a manual valve body and it only costed 1700 total with converter no core. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

OBSSSD@work

The MTI car was a 383 not even a stock 346. Show me the time slips for an M6 car (346ci) going at least 10.9X

For every 1 of those I'll show you a bundle with an A4 car on the stock 4L60E and the stock 10-bolt. It doesn't cost over $2,000 to rebuild a 4L60E unless you use a high priced forum vendor like FLP. I'm going to do mine for a few hundred bucks including labor and it will hold 500rwhp no problem. For now, however, it is holding just fine.

The A4 bashing gets a little old around here sometimes. Just because someone is driving one doesn't make the M6 person a better driver.

I'm done now..

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

One Monkey

I got in on this very late and did not read all the post!!

but here's my opinion. A4 cars run faster most of the time. that's just because of how easy it's too set one up. there are so much auto cars running out there, and so much convertors that prove them self.

But if a manual car owner figuers out the clutch and sets it up right, The auto guys would have too go get a T-Brake too even stand a chance and there would still get the *** handed.

The SAM car is about the only example I could point out in the F-body world, since no one else have gone as far too get a clutch too work. but it proves it by it's 1.29 60ft 99% of that is the clutch.

there's no auto car even close too that. and then we all know after the 60ft the manual cars have the advantage. If it dose not it's not the car it's the driver. Ask all the A4 guys that street race with me and figuer I was on gas going down the track mod for mod. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
laters
Brent

<small>[ December 22, 2002, 06:19 PM: Message edited by: One Monkey ]</small>

Trevor @ Texas Speed & Perf.

iTrader: (3)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Nine Ball:
<strong>Come on down on a Saturday, any Saturday when HRP bracket season is in full swing and let me know how easy it is to win. HAHA!

Tony</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I never said it was easy to win. My point with my posts is that there's skill in going rounds, no matter what trans you have. Sure, it takes skill to hit your shifts just right, but my original post was in response to you saying that you've never seen a guy get congratulated on his driving when running an auto. There's still more to driving than a shifter and a clutch pedal. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_tounge.gif" />

Trevor

restoman45

iTrader: (2)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> The MTI car was a 383 not even a stock 346. Show me the time slips for an M6 car (346ci) going at least 10.9X

For every 1 of those I'll show you a bundle with an A4 car on the stock 4L60E and the stock 10-bolt. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">1) what does it matter what engine is powering the car...just because the 6-speed can take the power of bigger cubes and the 4l60e's cant...jk <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" /> . but seriously it doesnt matter how many cubes are powering your car, it matters what tranny you have, and if its taking the abuse.
2) the reason that you will find a bundle of a4's compared to every 6 speed running tens is because 10 times the amount of ls1 drag racers have automatics...actually, that goes for all cars...90% of drag cars are automatics, and that is well known, and that is why u are able to see so many 10 second 4l60e's for every 6 speed.
3)who cares if the car is running a 10 bolt or not...6speeds break them, a4's are too wussy to break them...jk <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" /> . but for the money you guys spend to buy strong auto's or rebuild your 4l60e's, we can have a 12-bolt no problem...and maybe some spare parts on the side as well.

sorry to vent, but i have to stick up for my 6-speed brethern...we should all stop <img border="0" alt="[fight]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_punch.gif" /> ing and just admit that 6-speeds are cooler <img border="0" alt="[devil]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_devil.gif" /> and back to the original topic, auto's are usually better in the et department (unless you bring up the fact that top fuel dragsters, and funny cars run standards(even though its a one speed <img border="0" alt="[devil]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_devil.gif" /> ), and none of you auto guys are as fast as them i'd be willing to bet) because of the fact that autos usually can shift faster than a standard driver. but mod for mod, the 6-speed will put more power to the ground, and thus will usually trap higher. im getting off my soap box now, and putting my flame suit on <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
i say we stop fighting, gang up, and go race some mustangs...that or gang up w/ the stangs and go torture some rice... Have a good day! <img border="0" alt="[Fluffy]" title="" src="graemlins/fluffy.gif" />

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Show me an M6 running 10's on the stock 10-bolt. I'm running 11.1X on the stock 4L60E and stock 10-bolt with 3.42's. By the time my car is tuned the next couple of weeks I'll be running 10's - on the stock 4L60E and the stock 10-bolt. There hasn't ever and won't ever be an M6 that will be able to do this.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Better do your research. The MTI shop car (red 1998 Z28, 383ci with nitrous) ran 10.41 on the stock 10-bolt, with the stock 3.42 gears, about 3 years ago. I ran 11.0 @ 130 mph about 2 years ago on the stock 10-bolt (heads/cam/nitrous). Would I recommend it? No. But, you are making a bold statement that "there hasn't ever and won't ever be an M6 that will be able to do this." Several already have. I know a few 422ci 6-speeds that have run deep into the 10s with nitrous and stock 10-bolts.

Besides, this thread isn't about 10-bolts. Once you have to upgrade/rebuild your 4L60e for $2K, you will end up spending the same amount as a good 12-bolt rearend, and you will still have a POS 10-bolt under the car. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_tounge.gif" />

-Tony

Joe Kizzire

Damn Tony you're all over this thread... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
Keep up the good work... <img border="0" alt="[guns]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_guns.gif" />

CAT3

iTrader: (9)

Really nothing like listening to an M6 with a good driver being shifted down the 1320. A few friends have M6's and they sound cool, hell a couple of them shift so fricking quick you swear its and A4. But, I like to be consistently fast so I go for the A4. Now if someone could come up with a F body with a M6 / A4 combo with an air activated engagement link, that would rock.......ANYONE??

Charlie.

383LQ4SS

iTrader: (33)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Show me an M6 running 10's on the stock 10-bolt. I'm running 11.1X on the stock 4L60E and stock 10-bolt with 3.42's. By the time my car is tuned the next couple of weeks I'll be running 10's - on the stock 4L60E and the stock 10-bolt. There hasn't ever and won't ever be an M6 that will be able to do this.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">10.7 @ 131 stock T-56 stock 10 bolt with stock 3.42 gears here at 3650 weight with ET streets and SS rims/275 tires up front.

fastlif

iTrader: (1)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by AlienDroid:
<strong>so why did rob raymore's auto run a 9.xx at 13x with a 1.5x 60' and harlan run a 10.0x at 14x with a 1.4x 60'?

What happened, harlan ran a better 60' and a faster mph, but still didn't beat Rob. Might have something to do with the shifting ehh?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Harlan was NOT powershifting in order to save his tranny.....I wish he would.

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The MTI car was a 383 not even a stock 346. Show me the time slips for an M6 car (346ci) going at least 10.9X

For every 1 of those I'll show you a bundle with an A4 car on the stock 4L60E and the stock 10-bolt.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Is your limit the engine size, or the 10-bolt? Make up your mind! Gordon Sevin and Allan Futral have both run 10s (on motor) with 346ci 6-speeds. Gordon ran a 10.66, tied with the quickest A4 346ci N/A car (Raughammer). Gordon also had 300 more lbs and worse weather conditions.

Running 10s on a stock 10-bolt isn't safe. I've seen A4s break them too. I busted one shifting into 4th gear at over 100 mph at the track once, and almost put the car into the wall when it locked up. When it locked up, it also tore my tranny apart inside. I could have avoided all that mess (downtime on the car, replaced rear, rebuilt tranny, new driveshaft, etc..) had I just bought a 12-bolt in the first place. It could have cost me my car and/or my life. A 10-bolt shouldn't be pushed into the 10s for safety reasons. It was designed for a V6!

I'd say the ratio of A4 to M6 drag racers is about 10:1 in favor of A4 owners. They also sell more A4 cars than M6 cars. Three years ago, there were only 6 of us running consistent 11s on motor, and I was the ONLY 6-speed out of those 6 cars. Its always been that way, very few M6 drivers out there.

-Tony

OBSSSD@work

383QL - Are you running a 346ci motor?

mobius

hmmm just a guess here but i would think the 383 in his name answers that <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Ws6Luvr

iTrader: (1)

both have their advantages and disadvantages! learn to accept that there is no "better" one. This arguement has been beaten to death NUMEROUS times and NEVER once has there been a definite answer to it! I prefer M6's, always will, but that's just me. If someone likes the A4, that's fine too, it's different strokes for different folks.

(had to come out of retirement on this thread <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> ) lol

to each their own guys, no sense in arguing over a topic which will never be settled...

Nitin Reddy
Ws6Luvr

kp

iTrader: (34)

An age old debate <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> Quick rundown of transmissions over the years I ran starting in 1980 till the recent, intersting to see the trend. These were just all fast bracket, super gas/comp, match race, quick 8/16 cars..

'hemi' crashbox in a 68 camaro BB (no clutch between gears) 4 speed with a clutch that took two legs to hold down, a he-man combo if there ever was one..

Clutch-flight in a chevy - great idea putting a clutch in front of an auto, especially a chrysler auto - NOT

Turbo 400 and a 'real' (not hydro bob <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> ) converter - the auto 'real race car' has arrived.

Powergide with a brake, usual 8" converter - still the most popular today..

Lenco/single disc clutch - great until the 800fwhp mark..

Lenco/multi disc clutch - you soon realize you know nothing about clutches and cant afford to learn <img border="0" title="" alt="[Sad]" src="gr_sad.gif" />

Back to an all aftermarket powerglide/brake..

Last is a Bruno torque converter setup with a g-force 3 speed manual.

And so it goes, its kind of funny to me that over the years the 'hot' setup went from putting a clutch in front of an auto to putting a converter in front of a manual. Main thing is drive what you enjoy, cars are cheap - great experiences are priceless..

Merry Christmas