WeatherGuy

OK - enough of this.

You can brag as much as you want to about your driving skills. I will be watching you congratulate yourself in my rear-view mirror at the track. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

PontiacFireTA

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Coach 02 M6 Z/28:
<strong>The difference in the two is you have to push in the clutch and pull or push the shifter to change gears in a stick. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

In a auto, all you have to do is push or pull the shifter to change gears. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

Hence, more chances to mess up in a stick than in an auto. <img border="0" alt="[devil]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_devil.gif" />

Coach <img border="0" alt="[Driving]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_driving3.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">yes, but still skill involved..

Coach 02 A3 Z/28

iTrader: (10)

It takes skill to win at bracket racing with a auto or a M6 Hot Rod. <img border="0" alt="[hail]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_hail.gif" />

All Iam saying is try and win a bracket race with over 50 cars in a M6 or a Auto and tell me that luck and skill is not involved. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

I was not trying to brag about my driving skills. I work very hard to be the best bracket racer that I can. I race every weekend and practice a 100 light on my practice tree every day to be a good bracket racer. <img border="0" alt="[devil]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_devil.gif" />

IMO- there is more chance for error in a M6 Hot Rod than Auto Hot Rod. Hence, Auto will win more races in the long run. Thats all Iam trying to say. <img border="0" alt="[angel]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_angel.gif" />

Have a great Holiday season.

Coach <img border="0" alt="[Driving]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_driving3.gif" />

Trevor @ Texas Speed & Perf.

iTrader: (3)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Nine Ball:
<strong>How many A4 owners were ever congratulated on their driving skills after running a new best ET? How many popular A4 owners are also known as "good drivers"?

Thats what I thought. You could train a chimpanzee to run the same or better ET in your A4 car.

If you are only interested in having a quick car, go ahead and stick with the A4. If you like to challenge yourself and be rewarded for your car and your skills, learn how to shift <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

-Tony</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">There's more to racing than a new best. Anyone can make a pass down the 1/4-mile. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_tounge.gif" /> Some of us non-driving sissies actually go for money. I've been congratulated more than once on my driving after getting out of an auto. Not only was it an auto, but it was one of those big sissy autos...a powerglide! There's more to driving than just shifting gears. If you don't think so, then I invite you to any big bracket race where there's some nice money up for grabs. I'm not talking about the trophy class or a small Wednesday night bracket race. I'm talking about classes where a guy with a .510 light that runs .01 over his dial gets put on the trailer pretty easily. I can't count the number of times I've seen people cut a perfect light or run a perfect dial and lose. You'll understand what I'm talking about when you cut a .506 light, run .005 over your dial, and still lose the race. I was not at all disappointed after that race because I did everything I could. I had a great "package", ran a great race, and just flat-out got beat. No matter how good you think you are, there is ALWAYS someone better out there! To me, skill is being able to make it into the money round with an 80+ car field where the competition is fierce. Now THAT is challenging yourself and being rewarded for your car and skills!

You can keep the bragging rights to shifting gears. I'll take the money any day. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> BTW, well said Coach. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

Trevor

<small>[ December 20, 2002, 08:06 PM: Message edited by: Trevor D ]</small>

promod1955

iTrader: (44)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Trevor D:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Nine Ball:
<strong>How many A4 owners were ever congratulated on their driving skills after running a new best ET? How many popular A4 owners are also known as "good drivers"?

Thats what I thought. You could train a chimpanzee to run the same or better ET in your A4 car.

If you are only interested in having a quick car, go ahead and stick with the A4. If you like to challenge yourself and be rewarded for your car and your skills, learn how to shift <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

-Tony</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">There's more to racing than a new best. Anyone can make a pass down the 1/4-mile. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_tounge.gif" /> Some of us non-driving sissies actually go for money. I've been congratulated more than once on my driving after getting out of an auto. Not only was it an auto, but it was one of those big sissy autos...a powerglide! There's more to driving than just shifting gears. If you don't think so, then I invite you to any big bracket race where there's some nice money up for grabs. I'm not talking about the trophy class or a small Wednesday night bracket race. I'm talking about classes where a guy with a .510 light that runs .01 over his dial gets put on the trailer pretty easily. I can't count the number of times I've seen people cut a perfect light or run a perfect dial and lose. You'll understand what I'm talking about when you cut a .506 light, run .005 over your dial, and still lose the race. I was not at all disappointed after that race because I did everything I could. I had a great "package", ran a great race, and just flat-out got beat. No matter how good you think you are, there is ALWAYS someone better out there! To me, skill is being able to make it into the money round with an 80+ car field where the competition is fierce. Now THAT is challenging yourself and being rewarded for your car and skills!

You can keep the bragging rights to shifting gears. I'll take the money any day. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> BTW, well said Coach. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

Trevor</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">thats how it is at my track every weekend.i went to the finals in a $5000 footbrake race at vmp this year and i won money 13 out of the 14 points races i went to. the one i didnt win money at, i had the flu and still went 3 rounds. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> not to bad for just pointing the wheel and hittin the gas huh? for consistency you can't beat an auto. and yes, i shift it.just like trevor says, its all about the money. all those 5 dollar trophies dont mean a thing to me.

<small>[ December 20, 2002, 09:23 PM: Message edited by: promod1955 ]</small>

AlienDroid

so why did rob raymore's auto run a 9.xx at 13x with a 1.5x 60' and harlan run a 10.0x at 14x with a 1.4x 60'?

What happened, harlan ran a better 60' and a faster mph, but still didn't beat Rob. Might have something to do with the shifting ehh?

ROB'S SS

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Nine Ball:
<strong>How many A4 owners were ever congratulated on their driving skills after running a new best ET</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">i was congratulated when i ran a new best when i switched from the m-6 to the a-4. whodathunkit, an auto running faster than a manual mod for mod <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

Coach 02 A3 Z/28

iTrader: (10)

Thanks! Trevor,

True Bracket Racers will understand! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

Coach <img border="0" alt="[Driving]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_driving3.gif" />

Paul F

iTrader: (2)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Nine Ball:
<strong>How many A4 owners were ever congratulated on their driving skills after running a new best ET? How many popular A4 owners are also known as "good drivers"?

-Tony</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yeah that's true but we do get a lot more $hit when we do something stupid in an auto car. Like when I left my wife's car in 2nd gear after the burn out, twice. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="gr_images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="gr_emb.gif" />

Seriously though it's all in what you are happy and satisfied with. I like an auto at the drag strip period. I'm really looking forward to manually shifting my TH350 though. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> But everytime I drive a buddy's or a customer's 6-speed I come back with a smile on my face and saying "man I really want another 6-speed car". It's all boils down to which is better for you.

Paul

Joe Kizzire

I see you guys have been busy.LOL I'm glad I gave you something to discuss. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

2000LS1Z28

Which is quicker: Usually the A4.

Which is faster: Usually the M6.

I think these scenario's(1/4 mile) have been generally proven to this point by now. Although there really is no straight-forward answer to this because there are just so many factors(modifications, suspension, tires, weight, track, weather, driver, etc...) But...anything is possible. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

I've now had both the A4 & M6. About this fun factor thing: it just depends upon what your definition of fun IS? Both have there pro's and con's. And to me personally, I prefer the M6 for street use and the A4 for dragracing.

Does it really matter to me which one is truly better? NO!

BTW, great thread. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

Ragtop 99

iTrader: (7)

Take the top 5 M6 and and top 5 A4 drivers on this board and set them aside. Out of an 8000+ member board, they are the statistical outliers. Then draw a random sample of NA bolt-on or H&C cars consisting of 25 A4s and 25 M6 from the rest of membership and bring them to the track. I would bet $$ that the A4 group cleans up.

Before you rip on A4s for needing a converter, remember that the number of real fast M6 cars with a stock 10 bolt and stock 3.42s is a small list too. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

beardWS6

iTrader: (1)

I love my Auto! My wife can drive the car safely, and when I get ready to run. Hello! My car pulls really good off the line, I`m gone before the next guy can think about 2nd. Auto`s are really good racing tools. I don`t think driving a auto is less of a challenge. It give me the chance to look at fuel psi,rpms,mph, and the guy next to me. Nice to be able to look and see how much you took him off the line! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> Just kidding. It`s like fords and Gm`s. You like them or you don`t. Just remember we all are racers at heart. Thats what matters! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

Peace!

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">when george went 9.99 with his auto we congradulated him.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If you read an earlier reply in this thread from me, I stated that manual-valve body automatics that must be operated by the driver are not really "automatic" in my opinion. The driver still controls the shift points and has complete control. Throw that transbrake in the mix, and they now have to monitor launch rpm and pushing a button. More control.

Thats FUN. I'm really just picking on those that don't have to do anything but stab and steer. The "Driver Delete Option".

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">When i went a 7.92 at 178mph there is no way in a chimpanzee could have done that. you think that consisted of just pointing and hitting the gas? give me some credit at least </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Was this a full automatic, or a manually shifted auto with a brake? Either way, that is hauling *** and just keeping that car straight is showing skill. Much different scale than a 13-second A4 though <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> . BTW, Chimps have been into space and should be smart enough to floor a gas pedal (with blocks of course). haha, what is harder, learning sign language or pressing a gas pedal?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">But, I love racing a M6 Hot Rod because their is not very many people that can drive a stick and win bracket racing.

For now, I am going to stay with the stick. Iam a different breed of cat. I love to be different</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Damn right Coach! I love this hobby, but I also think the challenge of doing what you stated is what I enjoy the most. I've had a ton of hobbies in the past, and I've found I'll get bored pretty quickly if there isn't a challenge. It does feel pretty good knowing that very few people could pilot your car down the track and run a similar or better ET in it than you can. With a fully-automatic car, anyone with the same weight can run your best ET. The car isn't picky about who smashes its gas pedal.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Im still confused on this ****, most of the beasted out trannys are automatics, you shift them ALL, does that not take skill?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yep, it sure does! I wish Raughammer would reply and give you his opinions on switching from a fully-automatic 4L60E to his new Transbrake equipped, manual valvebody TH400. Having to actually DO something in the driver's seat was driving him mad at HRP last time. Its a LOT more work when you have to watch the tach, pull your own gears, and set your own launch rpm.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Some of us non-driving sissies actually go for money.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Money is good. If that is your sole motivation with the sport, then you should definitely remove as many risks as possible and reduce the challenge as much as possible in order to achieve your goals. But, tell the truth, you've spent more on this hobby than you have won so far. You should have never raced and came out ahead if it was just for the money <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

All in fun guys <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

Linear Velocity

iTrader: (1)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by AlienDroid:
<strong>so why did rob raymore's auto run a 9.xx at 13x with a 1.5x 60' and harlan run a 10.0x at 14x with a 1.4x 60'?

What happened, harlan ran a better 60' and a faster mph, but still didn't beat Rob. Might have something to do with the shifting ehh?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yeah...no. Considering that Rob Raymer is putting more hp to the groud than Harlan I'd say it's more a testament to Harlan's driving skills. Both are different cars with great setups. Both Rob Raymer's is a 375 Iron Blcok with a beeffy T-75 turbo, Harlan is still running those 2 small T25 turbos on basically just heads/cam (built 348). Both cars have a lot more in them, it'll be fun to watch them run.

Trevor @ Texas Speed & Perf.

iTrader: (3)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Nine Ball:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Some of us non-driving sissies actually go for money.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Money is good. If that is your sole motivation with the sport, then you should definitely remove as many risks as possible and reduce the challenge as much as possible in order to achieve your goals. But, tell the truth, you've spent more on this hobby than you have won so far. You should have never raced and came out ahead if it was just for the money <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

All in fun guys <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Sure, I've spent a LOT more on drag racing than I've won, and that's how it is for the majority of drag racers. If I/we were solely in it for money, we'd all be racing $2,000 beaters that are consistently slow. Half of the fun is going fast, but that's just the addiction. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> My point is that when there's some real money up for grabs you get into a whole different ballgame of racing. Jump into the super pro class, and you'll see what I mean. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> That was a HUGE eye-opener for me! I was a casual foot-brake bracket racer until I bought my '67 Chevy II. Once I stepped up to a bigger class with added competition, .530 lights were no longer winning rounds. Just run super pro once, and you'll see the skill that I'm talking about.

all in fun here, too <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_cheers.gif" />

Trevor

ROB'S SS

what impresses me the most is this topic is 4 pages long and hasnt been locked yet. when everyone watches there p's and q's, it makes for fun reading and debating

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I was a casual foot-brake bracket racer until I bought my '67 Chevy II. Once I stepped up to a bigger class with added competition, .530 lights were no longer winning rounds. Just run super pro once, and you'll see the skill that I'm talking about.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">LOL! You forget which track I call home Trevor. Houston Raceway Park isn't po-dunk backwoods racing on bracket days. On Wednesdays there are two footbrake classes, the "street" class where "casual footbrakers" tend to run, and then there is the Sportsman class. This is the class where the serious boys play. I've been beat quite a few times by cars running their dial in perfectly on a low low .5X light. When there are not events to attend, where do you think these bracket racing pros play? The sportsman class is basically a 9-second to 11 second class. Most of the cars are sponsored by local shops and engine builders. Stock Eliminators even enter this class. Thats just Wednesday. On Saturdays at HRP, the big bracket points events happen. We are talking 90% trailer queens built for one purpose - to bracket race. I've won those events also, and they pay pretty well for a weekly event.

Come on down on a Saturday, any Saturday when HRP bracket season is in full swing and let me know how easy it is to win. HAHA!

Tony

y2khawk

iTrader: (5)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by AlienDroid:
<strong>so why did rob raymore's auto run a 9.xx at 13x with a 1.5x 60' and harlan run a 10.0x at 14x with a 1.4x 60'?

What happened, harlan ran a better 60' and a faster mph, but still didn't beat Rob. Might have something to do with the shifting ehh?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">OH cheap shot!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

I'll be the first to admit, I shift SLOW!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

Nor do I power shift, might be part of the reason I've gotten away with abusing my T56 like I have.

I make up for lacking shift speed w/ more power <img border="0" alt="[devil]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_devil.gif" />

Nine Ball

iTrader: (38)

Hey Harlan, adding more power also seems to be both of our answers when it comes to our fat hog raceweights.

You know what would be really cool? A 9-second all motor pass with a T56. I don't have the will to gut my street car, so that will take someone crazy like Gordon or Coach to accomplish <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

-Tony