Gentlemen,

I have attempted to remain patient the past few days, but enough is enough. The rules are set. There is no debate. If your car fits into to guidelines presented and you come to race, fantastic. If your car does not fit or you choose not to participate, then that is fine also. See you at NPR!

Thanks

Jay Billingsley

 

For the guys that are arguing that all of the non-stock suspension equipment we use (welded sway bars, short TAs, no tranny mounts for TAs, relo brackets) are allowed in everyone elses "Stock Suspension" racing classes, do you know why they part have been allowed???

Bzzzzzzz times up.

They are allowed because they were all in use on the cars at the time that the original ruling bodies were formed. So they were allowed inorder to create the fields required to support a multiple race event season. A race class can't succeed if there are not enough cars to run eliminations.

Kinda sounds familiar doesn't. Seven Car field hmmm...., needs an 8th to make it a class.

As for the silly chicken stuff... at 8.54 seconds... there's not a lot of time to be scared of much of anything except making sure your but doesn't face the crowd when you get out of the car just in case the depends in the suit don't hold up.

Rick

 

Why do you think everyone has been screamin' for pics?????? The people that make the rules are trying to see the suspension set-up so they can make a ruling on the set-up. No pictures so far. Once again I think ARE would rather not come to the race so it's easier to just to be disqluaified. There is NO QUESTION of if they can race the Thunder Shootout, so it's not like a wasted trip and they still get to run anyone they want in grudge racing and they will run most of the same cars in Pro Outlaw. The question is do they really want to prove a point or not? It's up to ARE.

 

If you read back to one of Jay's posts he outlines that WE need them, and ARE doesn't because they have lowered the rear of the car more.

 

You might as well put an * next to the record like they have in baseball for an anomaly/extinuating circumstances. For that matter, since "Stock-Suspended" is so open to discussion, put an * next to all the records. JUST COME DOWN AND RACE!!

 

Warbird there would be no race because Brian pulled it all together.

I see and hear about most big dawg entrants wanting field parity, and nobody has asked for additional weight penalties for C5R heads or 15 degree SBC heads. By the looks of things ARE would win if they participate, they have the entire field covered. FWIW if other guys like Judson etc., had relo'd suspension he would be subject to the same rules...

 

i have been on the back bumper twice this year already while trying to sort the suspension out without even making a good full pass, and got kicked out of a local track for nearly taking the wall out several times after breaking the steering rack on landing. wheelie bars are needed on these cars for safety, they are not there so much for a competitive advantage

 

wa wa wa.....i've never seen so much whining.

This is why f-body racing goes no where. All of you who say that welded sway bars, wheelie bars, rod end control arms, etc etc aren't stock suspension you had better start looking around.

Most other classes that are going 8s or better allow wheelie bars (100lb weight penalty usually). Only one i know that doesn't is pro extreme street.

*shrug*

 

How many oil pans and k-member fixes did Baxter go through before the bars were not an "option" anymore? I know there is a host of guys on this board who have experienced the same thing. Doing those wheelies is a crowd pleaser but the crowd isn't fitting the bill for broken parts and undies

 

not only are the big wheelies costly to the owners (my broken parts list from the landings is half a page long), but they can be very dangerous for the track and spectators. on my last stand the car got on the bumper hard enough to lift the left tire and cause the car to turn towards the wall. i was lucky enough to feel that it was turning and drop it hard as soon as it did, but things like that could easily result with a car going into or even over the wall. wouldnt be the first time its happened, and im sure these guys dont want it happening at their events.

and besides, how did wheelie bars get involved in this whole pointless debate anyways? oh yeah... by the 11 second guy swinging off ARE's nuts

 

You are missing the point jerkoff, I just want to see them race.

The wheelie bar question was brought up before I mentioned it. I just re-asked the question that Madman didn't initially answer.

 

Sorry to hear you ring the bell on it Jay.

Ohh well,... sounds like all the guys with these killer wheel stands that don't like them just got their next suspension mod advice for free in this thread anyway. Admit ARE has the right fix. Screw the ohhh so stock wheelie bars, move your LCAs in an 1" and slam the car down and ride it out of the hole. That will solve the debate for the 2004 schedule.

Rick

 

not sure if you are being sarcastic or not, but it is more involved than just moving the LCAs in more than an 1". Mounts have been moved and re-welded and if they moved the shocks in as well they'd have to move the mount on the body as well. Not to mention the sheetmetal work on the inner wheelwell.

if you were being sarcastic, ignore

 

Madmen
sent the check out today for the EastSide Car
home of the fastest correct suspension Ls1 in the world :p

 

my comment is this being old school enthusiast from 94' ...... Please come together and make a solid decision on what is stock suspended..."stock style" is along the same lines as "like in design" sounds familiar... I run stock pickup points less torque arm only, and a wolfe antiroll (why thats a arguement i havnt a clue) but aftermarket torque arms were necessary long before ls1 even came to be.. lets look at whats necessary antiroll, torque arm ..thats pretty much a given ...next would be 10" measured tread width.. stock pickup points and location for springs and lca's... ok so some fudge that a bit i can live with it...mini tubbed /notched frame rails ??? I'd say once at that extreme you've basically even thrown stock style out the window... wheelie bar??? who cares most have pull pins and they are only used really to tune the suspension till they can be removed..I know thats why i have them and most others do to..once they are comfortable their car isnt gonna come down bust their wallet all to hell ..I guarantee most will pull back off for a real street 10" tire class... having read most all of this thread ,I think ..lol I do see some siding going on,which i understand... I wasnt gonna post at all but my own car is heading in the realm of these 8 sec cars soon...so I asked myself how would i feel If i had a non cut axle tubes 10" tire stock wheel wells and ran a good 8 sec pass ...would i feel slighted being out ran by a mintubbed car ?? I'd have to say yes..I can assure everyone I'm not siding either way..stating general opinion ....out here on the east coast I can tell you any quick8-16 real street 10" tire event doesnt allow any frame notching,must have oem glass ,carpet two seats ,no 4 link,gm manufactured tranny's etc etc ...So i guess theres other issues that lay down along side just suspension...we could sit here and debate engine,cowl (lmao) ,tranny's,heads the list goes on and on ...most the big time guys know when they stepped over the line of what exceptable its whether they stand up and admit they should be classed differently is the question no matter what aspect of the f-bodyracing we discuss...I'm forevered loved on this board so i expect punches thrown so let me bow out for a moment and let the bell ring atleast

 

how long has the ARE car been running the suspension they have now? if they have been running it for a long time i dont see why they need to change it. i know the rules are set but a big dawg class is a big dawg class (run what you brung and hope you brought enough) and has an ls1 in it. i see how people have been saying "we have been running shorter t/a's and welded sway bars etc etc" how long as ARE been running their suspension like this? they didnt change it to give them an advantage for this race.

 

Ken I would like to correct you on something,I stand behind nobody and never said running 8s is easy.Also my statement was not referring to you.I know you have went 8.93 and currently hold 2nd place on the LS1 powered list.That is an accomplishment in itself.I met your crew at BG and was impressed with your car and that tow rig/setup you have.It is frustrating to see a friend of mine who happens to have the fastest LS1 excluded from a race with the fastest 4th gen F-bodies.I guess if I owned a shop I would'nt want one of my competitors too beat me with a real or unreal advantage.Trust me if ARE finishes my car I will be there and will be competitive with most of the seven cars entered so far.I can't wait to see what 8s are like.

 

Noyzee you still running 12s with that 511rwhp turbo car .I don't mind taking some grief from Ken,he actually owns a fast car,you don't.Work on those underachieving times for your setup and get back with me.

 

I'll say again that the Shootouts need to adopt a uniform set of rules on the various classes. These rules need to be consistent from race to race and should be published and distributed to the racers. Otherwise, this kind of confusion will arise in the future.

Maybe we need to organize an association (such as NMCA and NMRA have done) so as to bring better clarity and identity.

 

422 SS
sorry the problem is we talk to a keyboard and not in person
we are all very passionate about some kind of racing deal next year
and trying to get our point across.
Thats why we need to get a bunch of people together at thunder and talk face to face about this .
again sorry for being a d*ck