From cam only to heads/cam (with nitrous)
I'm honestly thinking something is not right with this setup. Gaining 1/2 to MAYBE 1 car length from 60-110 after installing TFS 215s and rockers just doesn't make any sense to me. If it really picked up 40rwhp from where it was before, then I can't see the car gaining any less than a couple car lengths from where it was before on a run like that. If nothing else, it should have been pulling pretty good up top considering you supposedly have 30rwhp more than me (both SAE on dynojets).
I still want to get out and do a good pull from second to the top of 4th (first is never going to hook up this time of year) and see if the results are different.
The fact is on a hot, humid day at a slow track, my car traps 117. On a cold day at a fast track, it trapped 121. And those numbers are with the cutout open, which gains me 1 mph (a track tested 1 mph).
With the cutout closed (so 116/120 traps), you did not pull on me anywhere from 60-110 in the same gear, so there's no way you're going to trap higher than I did on similar days. The only thing that might help is that I was running bias-plies and if you run radials of the same height, you might pickup a mph over what I did at the same track in the same weather.
Based on all of that, those traps sound weak to me for a car that was already trapping 115-116 on a hot, humid day at a slow track. Obviously we'll have to get it to the track to test it out, but based on all the tests we've done and having recent numbers from my car, it looks like it only picked up about 1 mph from TFS 215s, which sounds wrong.
With the cutout closed (so 116/120 traps), you did not pull on me anywhere from 60-110 in the same gear, so there's no way you're going to trap higher than I did on similar days. The only thing that might help is that I was running bias-plies and if you run radials of the same height, you might pickup a mph over what I did at the same track in the same weather.
Based on all of that, those traps sound weak to me for a car that was already trapping 115-116 on a hot, humid day at a slow track. Obviously we'll have to get it to the track to test it out, but based on all the tests we've done and having recent numbers from my car, it looks like it only picked up about 1 mph from TFS 215s, which sounds wrong.
Last edited by PewterScreaminMach; Jan 25, 2010 at 08:46 AM.
theres to many varibles when doing highway pulls. youll see the gains at the track.
ron like i said before, you need to get a fast and bigger cam and then youll see the max gains w/ the heads
-brandon
ron like i said before, you need to get a fast and bigger cam and then youll see the max gains w/ the heads
-brandon
I agree that the track will tell the story one way or the other. I don't doubt that a FAST and bigger cam will gain, but I shouldn't need to gain more hp to see a difference from the HP I've already gained. Spring can't get here fast enough, haha.
I'm honestly thinking something is not right with this setup. Gaining 1/2 to MAYBE 1 car length from 60-110 after installing TFS 215s and rockers just doesn't make any sense to me. If it really picked up 40rwhp from where it was before, then I can't see the car gaining any less than a couple car lengths from where it was before on a run like that. If nothing else, it should have been pulling pretty good up top considering you supposedly have 30rwhp more than me (both SAE on dynojets).
But the next to nothing gain is what surprises me the most. I just don't understand how installing TFS 215s with rockers (coming from stock 241 heads and rockers) could net only a 1/2 to 1 car gain over where it was before.
And this is coming from a car that's notorious for making great power and backing up the numbers at the track (ScreaminRedZ's). Something seems wrong to me.
But the next to nothing gain is what surprises me the most. I just don't understand how installing TFS 215s with rockers (coming from stock 241 heads and rockers) could net only a 1/2 to 1 car gain over where it was before.
And this is coming from a car that's notorious for making great power and backing up the numbers at the track (ScreaminRedZ's). Something seems wrong to me.
On paper the tests we did should be pretty reliable. 4th gear is a 1:1 ratio, the cars have the same rear gear (4.10's), the tires are the same size (I know different brands might be slightly off even when rated the same size, but the difference should be negligable), the cars should be within 50 lbs of each other (I removed my rear seats and belts and my front swaybar, but I have the nitrous kit and I weight 20 lbs more than him). We even topped both cars off with gas before doing it to try and remove all variables. Also, the test was done several times to help eliminate a fluke run.
That being said, it's possible that somehow the test was flawed and that when we get a chance to do a good run through the gears I will pull, or at the track I will have picked up 3 mph. It's also possible that my car just isn't faster than his for whatever reason.
That being said, it's possible that somehow the test was flawed and that when we get a chance to do a good run through the gears I will pull, or at the track I will have picked up 3 mph. It's also possible that my car just isn't faster than his for whatever reason.
On paper the tests we did should be pretty reliable. 4th gear is a 1:1 ratio, the cars have the same rear gear (4.10's), the tires are the same size (I know different brands might be slightly off even when rated the same size, but the difference should be negligable), the cars should be within 50 lbs of each other (I removed my rear seats and belts and my front swaybar, but I have the nitrous kit and I weight 20 lbs more than him). We even topped both cars off with gas before doing it to try and remove all variables. Also, the test was done several times to help eliminate a fluke run.
That being said, it's possible that somehow the test was flawed and that when we get a chance to do a good run through the gears I will pull, or at the track I will have picked up 3 mph. It's also possible that my car just isn't faster than his for whatever reason.
That being said, it's possible that somehow the test was flawed and that when we get a chance to do a good run through the gears I will pull, or at the track I will have picked up 3 mph. It's also possible that my car just isn't faster than his for whatever reason.
I believe the last time we ran at LVD was a May rental and it was in the 80s and fairly humid. It might have been a little cooler in the morning. You were trapping 115 most of the day with one or two 116 passes? I don't exactly remember.
I'm thinking about putting my ET streets on the car so it'll hook up and then lining us up from at least a 2nd gear run. The taller tire will hurt me a little, but if the power is there it should still show up.
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We're gonna try and get it done in the next few days. I had the car out tonight with the 28" MT radials and it will hook fine in first, so we should be able to get a nice full run in.
Postponed. We got a ton of snow yesterday and the roads will be shitty for a while now, so I took mine off the road for the rest of the winter. If it doesn't sell first, we'll probably go back out early Spring when the weather warms up a bit and give it a shot.
Postponed. We got a ton of snow yesterday and the roads will be shitty for a while now, so I took mine off the road for the rest of the winter. If it doesn't sell first, we'll probably go back out early Spring when the weather warms up a bit and give it a shot.
I talked to the guys at Harris Speed Works and they said that I can safely lean it out (on the 100 shot) a bit via correct jetting size. I believe that I will be able to carry my 100 rwhp gains out to the top of the pull by doing this. I also want to get my 125 and 150 jets squared away and see what it puts down.
Just for the hell of it, I dynoed the car on another dynojet up here near me. The car made 424, then 422, then 424 back to back to back. Here's the graph for the best pull (best by about .5 hp, haha).
After comparing this one to PSM's (still a different dyno, but should be pretty comparable) it looks like the cars make similar power until about 5200 rpm and then mine starts picking up. If you look at his graph with the cutout open then he's definitely beating me under the curve. Looks like it's just a problem of my car being a torqueless wonder, haha. Hopefully my extra hp up top will allow me to run a better number at the track.
After comparing this one to PSM's (still a different dyno, but should be pretty comparable) it looks like the cars make similar power until about 5200 rpm and then mine starts picking up. If you look at his graph with the cutout open then he's definitely beating me under the curve. Looks like it's just a problem of my car being a torqueless wonder, haha. Hopefully my extra hp up top will allow me to run a better number at the track.
Last edited by ScreaminRedZ; Feb 4, 2010 at 03:43 PM.
I agree that the torque is low and I really think that's what's holding me back against my brother. The only thing they mentioned is that they recommend more cam and a FAST intake. Both of those mods always seem to gain more in the top end of the power curve though. I don't want to be making 450rwhp and 374 rwtq.
I wonder what the compression is with a stock bottom end, Trickflow heads milled to 59cc, and the GM MLS head gaskets?
I wonder what the compression is with a stock bottom end, Trickflow heads milled to 59cc, and the GM MLS head gaskets?
I agree that the torque is low and I really think that's what's holding me back against my brother. The only thing they mentioned is that they recommend more cam and a FAST intake. Both of those mods always seem to gain more in the top end of the power curve though. I don't want to be making 450rwhp and 374 rwtq.
I wonder what the compression is with a stock bottom end, Trickflow heads milled to 59cc, and the GM MLS head gaskets?
I wonder what the compression is with a stock bottom end, Trickflow heads milled to 59cc, and the GM MLS head gaskets?
I agree that the torque is low and I really think that's what's holding me back against my brother. The only thing they mentioned is that they recommend more cam and a FAST intake. Both of those mods always seem to gain more in the top end of the power curve though. I don't want to be making 450rwhp and 374 rwtq.
I wonder what the compression is with a stock bottom end, Trickflow heads milled to 59cc, and the GM MLS head gaskets?
I wonder what the compression is with a stock bottom end, Trickflow heads milled to 59cc, and the GM MLS head gaskets?