AFR 205s, Futral F13 cam, Fast 90/90, M6 Where's the HP & Tq? graph here
03-09-2008, 10:06 PM
#21
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I will give my results but I am curious now...when I blew the #7 piston had a misfire obviously. I did a CC test and got these results cold motor, obviously looking at the #7.
1 225
2 223
3 227
4 222
5 230
6 228
7 175 piston had small chunk out of it
8 227
#7 piston
This was with AFR 205's with 62cc chambers from TR (new) .045 cometic gasket and TR 224/224 0.563/0.563 113.5 LSA
Seeing your results has me confused...
1 225
2 223
3 227
4 222
5 230
6 228
7 175 piston had small chunk out of it
8 227
#7 piston
This was with AFR 205's with 62cc chambers from TR (new) .045 cometic gasket and TR 224/224 0.563/0.563 113.5 LSA
Seeing your results has me confused...
Last edited by ExceSSive; 03-09-2008 at 10:25 PM.
03-09-2008, 10:11 PM
#22
cranking test One may want to specify the procedure for the 'correct' way to do a cranking compression test. There are many variables that can skew peak numbers as some of you know, but others may not. Same goes for leaking an engine. What about a simple power balance test, or verifying vacuum readings? Is anyone using a psi transducer for testing in the plug hole such as one from ATS or SenX?
Here are some basic rules I teach my guys to use on the cranking test.
1. install a fully charged jump box onto the battery (cranking speed makes a difference)
2. all plugs out and throttle plate wide open (need to have good airflow throughout)
3. 5 needle bounces or puffs and then stop (the more you crank the more you get, consistency matters)
4. PAY ATTENTION TO THE FIRST PUMP, if you don't get at least50 psi, release the gauge and start over. DO NOT count a partial pump of say 20 psi and use this as starting point. Make sure all first pump starting points are equal - critical!
And also note, a cold engine will make less pressure.
I haven't gone through actually measuring PEAK cranking on mine, although I will, but the easier tests I made verified a 'sealed' engine and most importantly a balanced engine. I am at a rock steady 14" at an 800 RPM hot idle with the 224/230 114lsa installed @ 113 icl XE-R camshaft.
Here are some basic rules I teach my guys to use on the cranking test.
1. install a fully charged jump box onto the battery (cranking speed makes a difference)
2. all plugs out and throttle plate wide open (need to have good airflow throughout)
3. 5 needle bounces or puffs and then stop (the more you crank the more you get, consistency matters)
4. PAY ATTENTION TO THE FIRST PUMP, if you don't get at least50 psi, release the gauge and start over. DO NOT count a partial pump of say 20 psi and use this as starting point. Make sure all first pump starting points are equal - critical!
And also note, a cold engine will make less pressure.
I haven't gone through actually measuring PEAK cranking on mine, although I will, but the easier tests I made verified a 'sealed' engine and most importantly a balanced engine. I am at a rock steady 14" at an 800 RPM hot idle with the 224/230 114lsa installed @ 113 icl XE-R camshaft.
03-10-2008, 06:09 AM
#23
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One may want to specify the procedure for the 'correct' way to do a cranking compression test. There are many variables that can skew peak numbers as some of you know, but others may not. Same goes for leaking an engine. What about a simple power balance test, or verifying vacuum readings? Is anyone using a psi transducer for testing in the plug hole such as one from ATS or SenX?
Here are some basic rules I teach my guys to use on the cranking test.
1. install a fully charged jump box onto the battery (cranking speed makes a difference)
2. all plugs out and throttle plate wide open (need to have good airflow throughout)
3. 5 needle bounces or puffs and then stop (the more you crank the more you get, consistency matters)
4. PAY ATTENTION TO THE FIRST PUMP, if you don't get at least50 psi, release the gauge and start over. DO NOT count a partial pump of say 20 psi and use this as starting point. Make sure all first pump starting points are equal - critical!
And also note, a cold engine will make less pressure.
I haven't gone through actually measuring PEAK cranking on mine, although I will, but the easier tests I made verified a 'sealed' engine and most importantly a balanced engine. I am at a rock steady 14" at an 800 RPM hot idle with the 224/230 114lsa installed @ 113 icl XE-R camshaft.
Here are some basic rules I teach my guys to use on the cranking test.
1. install a fully charged jump box onto the battery (cranking speed makes a difference)
2. all plugs out and throttle plate wide open (need to have good airflow throughout)
3. 5 needle bounces or puffs and then stop (the more you crank the more you get, consistency matters)
4. PAY ATTENTION TO THE FIRST PUMP, if you don't get at least50 psi, release the gauge and start over. DO NOT count a partial pump of say 20 psi and use this as starting point. Make sure all first pump starting points are equal - critical!
And also note, a cold engine will make less pressure.
I haven't gone through actually measuring PEAK cranking on mine, although I will, but the easier tests I made verified a 'sealed' engine and most importantly a balanced engine. I am at a rock steady 14" at an 800 RPM hot idle with the 224/230 114lsa installed @ 113 icl XE-R camshaft.
I thought the temperature of the engine made a difference in the numbers. I did the test myself, so it was hard to watch the gauge while I was cranking, but I try to keep the cranking constant, it was about 5 revolutions. I guess I should try it again with some help so I can watch the gauge. I have a optimum battery so the cranking speed was constant.
03-12-2008, 07:52 PM
#25
Hey Brian, I agree 100%, and so did the owner. I have made over 415rwhp through an unlocked stalled auto with those heads, g5x1 on a 112 (not THAT much different than the F13) and an ls6 intake.
Last edited by Frost; 03-26-2008 at 04:26 PM.
05-05-2008, 07:46 PM
#26
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UPDATE
Well just finished pulling the heads because I'm in the process of returning the car back to near stock, I found out that 4 of my cylinder walls are gouged and scored, almost from like a cracked ring or something, and hte #7 piston has metal embedded in it, so I guess this would explain the metal I found in my oil filter a few weeks ago. Needless to say, it's not tuner or head related, it's motor related. Picked up a LS6 shortblock from a friend of mine so I'll be putting that in the car, it will be just a cam only block though, AFR's are off and for sale.
Well just finished pulling the heads because I'm in the process of returning the car back to near stock, I found out that 4 of my cylinder walls are gouged and scored, almost from like a cracked ring or something, and hte #7 piston has metal embedded in it, so I guess this would explain the metal I found in my oil filter a few weeks ago. Needless to say, it's not tuner or head related, it's motor related. Picked up a LS6 shortblock from a friend of mine so I'll be putting that in the car, it will be just a cam only block though, AFR's are off and for sale.
05-05-2008, 07:58 PM
#27
UPDATE
Well just finished pulling the heads because I'm in the process of returning the car back to near stock, I found out that 4 of my cylinder walls are gouged and scored, almost from like a cracked ring or something, and hte #7 piston has metal embedded in it, so I guess this would explain the metal I found in my oil filter a few weeks ago. Needless to say, it's not tuner or head related, it's motor related. Picked up a LS6 shortblock from a friend of mine so I'll be putting that in the car, it will be just a cam only block though, AFR's are off and for sale.
Well just finished pulling the heads because I'm in the process of returning the car back to near stock, I found out that 4 of my cylinder walls are gouged and scored, almost from like a cracked ring or something, and hte #7 piston has metal embedded in it, so I guess this would explain the metal I found in my oil filter a few weeks ago. Needless to say, it's not tuner or head related, it's motor related. Picked up a LS6 shortblock from a friend of mine so I'll be putting that in the car, it will be just a cam only block though, AFR's are off and for sale.
don't you dare sell those heads.
See you at the meet on weds.
...j/k 
05-05-2008, 09:20 PM
#32
UPDATE
Well just finished pulling the heads because I'm in the process of returning the car back to near stock, I found out that 4 of my cylinder walls are gouged and scored, almost from like a cracked ring or something, and hte #7 piston has metal embedded in it, so I guess this would explain the metal I found in my oil filter a few weeks ago. Needless to say, it's not tuner or head related, it's motor related. Picked up a LS6 shortblock from a friend of mine so I'll be putting that in the car, it will be just a cam only block though, AFR's are off and for sale.
Well just finished pulling the heads because I'm in the process of returning the car back to near stock, I found out that 4 of my cylinder walls are gouged and scored, almost from like a cracked ring or something, and hte #7 piston has metal embedded in it, so I guess this would explain the metal I found in my oil filter a few weeks ago. Needless to say, it's not tuner or head related, it's motor related. Picked up a LS6 shortblock from a friend of mine so I'll be putting that in the car, it will be just a cam only block though, AFR's are off and for sale.
05-06-2008, 07:12 PM
#33
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This makes me curious. Was the engine examined any during the head swap? The comments about low power with both sets of heads makes it sound like the problem was pre-existing. However, badly scored cylinder walls should have been obvious when swapping from the TEAs to the AFRs.
