What do you think? Direct port meth injection
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What do you think? Direct port meth injection i have a weiand manifold that i havent installed yet, so i was thinking of getting it machined for like a direct port nitrouse system but instead using meth i know there are companies that sell the whole manifold block kit with the nozzles and distribution block so would it be worth going that route or just getting the convetional one nozzle before the throttle blade kit let me know whats ur opinion on aither kit... thanks
ohh and the car is a rear mount T76 on 8psi
just use one solenoid and meth?
ohh and the car is a rear mount T76 on 8psi
just use one solenoid and meth?
Sounds like a cool idea. Meth distribution between cylinders would be a lot better, so in theory you could use the meth as a higher % of your overall fuel. Without indiv. cylinders being rich/lean I mean.
Get a big meth tank.
Get a big meth tank.
I have been asking the techs at Snow this same question for awhile now. I have access to a stock Ls1 intake that I was going to put 8 nozzles in so that I could ensure every cylinder was getting the same amount of methanol and I could also really crank it up. They keep saying their nozzles are so good that I don't need to do this.
I disagree. But what has kept me from doing it is figuring out how to detect if one of the 8 nozzles is clogged...I could realy tear some stuff up and I would never know it. I don't think one nozzle would reduce the flow enough for Snow's flow jobby thing to sense.
At least now if I am not getting methanol, I can tell since their are only two large nozzles in it...and my WB would be way lean.
I disagree. But what has kept me from doing it is figuring out how to detect if one of the 8 nozzles is clogged...I could realy tear some stuff up and I would never know it. I don't think one nozzle would reduce the flow enough for Snow's flow jobby thing to sense.
At least now if I am not getting methanol, I can tell since their are only two large nozzles in it...and my WB would be way lean.
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yea i understand the cloggin thing but i dont think it would clogg i mean you got 250psi running through it and its pure because the system is not open but if it did then yea id be screwed but would that be a slim to no chance of it getting clogged?
You need to pre-filter for crud before the hi-pressure pump then run a couple fine filters in parallel for purity w/o restriction. If you had a wideband on each bank, a problem would show itself if you were datalogging or had an alarm set. It's all do-able, you just have to add in the right support systems to make it safe.
And you might consider using E85 instead of meth - it's a lot less corrosive, maybe cheaper, and easier to get in a lot of places. Still has the solid alky payoff.
Jim
And you might consider using E85 instead of meth - it's a lot less corrosive, maybe cheaper, and easier to get in a lot of places. Still has the solid alky payoff.
Jim
my main thought on doing this was this...
think of running a 2nd sent of fuel injectors (basically what you are talking about doing) but leaving those 8 injectors on at all times...you would have WAY to much meth in any given cyl at any given time. You would have to find a way to control the meth injectors in a similar fashion as your fuel injectors. With injecting the meth all before the throttle body you can pump a ton in an the cyl's that need it take it with the air, it also gives the alcky a chance to evap and cool the air longer.
Thanks just my thoughts
think of running a 2nd sent of fuel injectors (basically what you are talking about doing) but leaving those 8 injectors on at all times...you would have WAY to much meth in any given cyl at any given time. You would have to find a way to control the meth injectors in a similar fashion as your fuel injectors. With injecting the meth all before the throttle body you can pump a ton in an the cyl's that need it take it with the air, it also gives the alcky a chance to evap and cool the air longer.
Thanks just my thoughts
Why??? What would the point be other than fueling? The methanol will drop the intake temps down some, but no sensors will not pick that up. Since you or the car does not know what the drop in the temps would be, it would be guessing, and wrongly, in respect to the amount of timing to pull and fuel to add based on the intake temps. You really show give the car every chance/opportunity to know what is actually happening by setting things up so that all the sensors can be used 100%.
The whole point of a DP system is to deliver a large amount of fuel and/or 'oxygen' to the cylinders equally. If you are wanting the DP system for that, rethink things. It would be far cheaper and 100000% more reliable to get the correct size fuel pump and injectors to have the fueling.
The whole point of a DP system is to deliver a large amount of fuel and/or 'oxygen' to the cylinders equally. If you are wanting the DP system for that, rethink things. It would be far cheaper and 100000% more reliable to get the correct size fuel pump and injectors to have the fueling.
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Good points by all.
I wanted the DP system so I could raise the percentage of Meth to pump gas at WOT...more so than I am at now. I am spraying close to 170ish#'s/hr now....if memory serves.
I guess the real way to do this is a second fuel system with rails/injectors/tank/etc as others have suggested...I was just thinking I could do it cheaper (provided it's somewhat safe) in the short term and long term (meth cost per gallon versus 116oct or the like) with methanol and Snow equipment.
I wanted the DP system so I could raise the percentage of Meth to pump gas at WOT...more so than I am at now. I am spraying close to 170ish#'s/hr now....if memory serves.
I guess the real way to do this is a second fuel system with rails/injectors/tank/etc as others have suggested...I was just thinking I could do it cheaper (provided it's somewhat safe) in the short term and long term (meth cost per gallon versus 116oct or the like) with methanol and Snow equipment.
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ls1/ls6 intake has gotten a rep for some cylinders running leaner than others. If the intake is sending more air to some cylinders than others....meth injected via the intake tubing should counteract this by adding more meth to those same "lean" cylinders
Oops, I think we are confusing eachother. I am running pump gas with 11psi...so that is why I am running methanol injection...because the alternative would be race gas all the time. I though you were saying to ditch the meth kit and just up the fuel system....which in my case wouldn't do me any good.
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yea im only running 8psi 60lbs injectors on a stock LS1 with springs only so i guess that would be overkill and also like metioned before i wouldnt know the temp drop from the meth so i kinda makes sense now that it might not be worth it unless it was an all out drag car mine is a DD car so ya nm
If you want more meth, just add a second nozzle if you dont already have one. That should be plenty of meth for 8 psi. I am using Alkycontrols dual nozzle kit with 18+ psi on my 402. No detonation here. I hear that since the air is being forced in FI cars, the methanol will be prety evenly distributed.
Yup reason i run about 325 lbs a hour of meth though 2 huge nozzles. 14.5 of boost stock timing and pump gas.
Never thought about it like that cable...think I will just drop the DP idea.
Dang...my hero! What size nozzles? Pump psi? 1/4" tubing still or larger main line?
Dang...my hero! What size nozzles? Pump psi? 1/4" tubing still or larger main line?
I have one 10 lb per hour and one 15 rated at 100 psi. So at 200 psi they 20 and 30 lbs. Was running two 15lbs but had a hard time tuning it and line pressure dropped to much for my liking.
System is a alky control kit. I tell every one this is the only kit to buy I forget the owners name but he help me alot with the kit to make sure it was perfect. Stock line i believe Line to pump is like 1/2 inch to nozzles 1/4.
Car off and set up pump pushes 198 psi at my redline. With the car runnning im getting 218 psi at but here the catch (yes i rated meth a little lighter cause its 6.6lb at 20c) safely margin for me
218psi with13.8-14 volts to pump minus 14.5 psi of boost = 203.5psi x(10lb+15lb@100)= 50.75gph x 6.5lb per gal =329.875
Playing around i did a 0- 200 mph pull in a 3850lb car . stock bottom end held full boost in 4 th 5th and 6th clutch start to slip and i believe the meth held the engine together. but i did drain my tank little more then half way
System is a alky control kit. I tell every one this is the only kit to buy I forget the owners name but he help me alot with the kit to make sure it was perfect. Stock line i believe Line to pump is like 1/2 inch to nozzles 1/4.
Car off and set up pump pushes 198 psi at my redline. With the car runnning im getting 218 psi at but here the catch (yes i rated meth a little lighter cause its 6.6lb at 20c) safely margin for me
218psi with13.8-14 volts to pump minus 14.5 psi of boost = 203.5psi x(10lb+15lb@100)= 50.75gph x 6.5lb per gal =329.875
Playing around i did a 0- 200 mph pull in a 3850lb car . stock bottom end held full boost in 4 th 5th and 6th clutch start to slip and i believe the meth held the engine together. but i did drain my tank little more then half way
Last edited by BigRich954RR; Dec 17, 2008 at 09:44 PM.
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just for informatiuon the WRC rally teams run indavidual water injection per cylinder (they are not allowed to run meth) to make sure they can push the engines as hard as they can safely!
I think it would work with meth, but you wouldn't get as much of the cooling effect as spraying a little up stream...
Chris.
I think it would work with meth, but you wouldn't get as much of the cooling effect as spraying a little up stream...
Chris.
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I have one 10 lb per hour and one 15 rated at 100 psi. So at 200 psi they 20 and 30 lbs. Was running two 15lbs but had a hard time tuning it and line pressure dropped to much for my liking.
System is a alky control kit. I tell every one this is the only kit to buy I forget the owners name but he help me alot with the kit to make sure it was perfect. Stock line i believe Line to pump is like 1/2 inch to nozzles 1/4.
Car off and set up pump pushes 198 psi at my redline. With the car runnning im getting 218 psi at but here the catch (yes i rated meth a little lighter cause its 6.6lb at 20c) safely margin for me
218psi with13.8-14 volts to pump minus 14.5 psi of boost = 203.5psi x(10lb+15lb@100)= 50.75gph x 6.5lb per gal =329.875
Playing around i did a 0- 200 mph pull in a 3850lb car . stock bottom end held full boost in 4 th 5th and 6th clutch start to slip and i believe the meth held the engine together. but i did drain my tank little more then half way
System is a alky control kit. I tell every one this is the only kit to buy I forget the owners name but he help me alot with the kit to make sure it was perfect. Stock line i believe Line to pump is like 1/2 inch to nozzles 1/4.
Car off and set up pump pushes 198 psi at my redline. With the car runnning im getting 218 psi at but here the catch (yes i rated meth a little lighter cause its 6.6lb at 20c) safely margin for me
218psi with13.8-14 volts to pump minus 14.5 psi of boost = 203.5psi x(10lb+15lb@100)= 50.75gph x 6.5lb per gal =329.875
Playing around i did a 0- 200 mph pull in a 3850lb car . stock bottom end held full boost in 4 th 5th and 6th clutch start to slip and i believe the meth held the engine together. but i did drain my tank little more then half way
damn 0 to 200mph pull that must have been fun