Let me first say that this piece isn't for everybody.This is designed for high end race engines.There will be some things that are a compromise as with any other race part.

Nothing against any other main girdles out there-they are great pieces and do as they are intended-this just takes it a step further.This piece mechanically locks the bottom end of the entire engine together.As fireball said-it spreads the load out on a greater area.Basic triangulation.

I have built 1500hp ls engine with no main girdle-like i said before there are alot of variables when deciding if you need this or not.
This does drop the oil pan approx .180 as well as the oil pump pickup in internal pickup engines.as far as the bell housing bolting up to the oil pan-you really shouldn't be running as stock pan at this level anyway+most guys are running a glide or th400.the support come with the fasteners as well as being line bored-so the mains will be ready to go-no additional machine work needed.

Once again it's not for everyone-if you are looking for the best possible insurance again main movement in an ls block-this is it.If you think something less expensive will get the job done-great.

 

The big issue I have seen over the last 2 years is you will only get 1/2 the story out of engine builders and that is to be expected because they will protect their engine program. Everyone I have talked to over the last couple years has stated that they have had issues with the mains moving on these high HP engines. Guys have tried a couple of different things to get the motors to "live" but at the end of the day they need to be serviced once or twice per season. When Shawn and I started the 2nd round of the engine program we said we wanted 2 things. First, we wanted the motor to be reliable and have the ability of going a full season WITHOUT needing to be serviced. Two, we wanted to make 2300-2500hp without losing any reliability.

So rewinding back a couple years, Kurt Urban was the first guy to break 200mph with an LS based motor. The guys @ W2W did countless hours of testing different types of support systems and only found one type that worked and kept the mains from moving. First came dowel pins, than a 2nd friction surface, than a mechanical key'd bottom. The system that they sold was an in-house deal also on the same type of mechanically key'd deal. Adding another "friction surface" was not enough to strengthen the bottom end of the block to prevent the block from distorting and the mains moving around. They also found the only solution was to mechanically lock everything together.

As far as the oil pan && bolt holes, you are not going to use a factory oil pan at this level so the bolt holes are not of concern. I can't think of anyone BESIDES a viper owner that would even try to lay down 1500-2000hp in a manual transmission application. I can't imagine why anyone would want something other than an automatic in something with that much power. At this power level your probably giving up almost 3/4 of a second to a full second between a M/T and A/T.

And as far as Ronnie duke, what was his service schedule? Could he go a full season? Was the bottom end moving? How did his bearings look on the service? Now you know he runs it, what was the result?

As far as the Dowel, with this system you don't need to dowel the mains to work correctly but it is good cheap insurance. And FYI My mains are not dowel'd. So the comparison is $1400 vs the $839. I looked at the DM main girdle but for my build it just didn't get the job done and after talking to some of well respected guys in the LS world, it would have HELPED but not solved the problem. This system is more than a bolt on deal, everything is machined so it locks the bottom end together.

On the DM performance girdle, how much movement does the main girdle have when you set it into place before you torque down the bolts? I would assume there is some movement since there is clearance between the pan rails and the girdle and the studs have to have some type of clearance? That movement will allow the block to twist and flex no matter how much you torque the bolts to. IMO there is no comparison between the two, as they are apples and oranges.

 

ok phil. you still need to add 150 t yours or take off 150 off of mine

" spend 389 plate + 200 studs + 150 line hone + 100 for dowel. well that is 839" both have line hone. cant get away from it.

 

Talk about beating a dead horse...give it a rest.

 

$150 for what? The line hone is included in the price($1400)

 

Hey man,if you don't like the price-that's cool,just don't buy it.

 

good call. sorry i didnt see that they included it.

and shawn it isnt that i dont like the price. well honestly free is always the best. but you have a great looking piece. i just wanted to compare girdle to yours. i got a build coming up and was thinking of doing girdle again. but we will see how yours go.

also will you sell it with out machine work. like just the plate and studs?

 

The kit does not require special main studs and as far as buying the plate outright. You can ask shawn, I seem to have connections everywhere including machine work. I would not buy the plate because to correctly install the plate you need a CNC mill with the correct program. For you to take your block to a machine shop, have them charge you to make a dxf file and do all the necessary machine work to make it fit correctly would cost more due to the time involved in making the file.

 

CNC in house.
and the plate is .18 think. so the stock arp studs will work?

 

Who said the plate was .18 thick? If you have a CNC why not make one yourself, why would you have even brought the DM Girdle?

 

I think this thread is going in the wrong direction.I hope everybody understands I'm just trying to bring a better product to the table for the ls engines.I do not mind constructive criticism whatsoever so i appreciate any input-positive or negative-lets just keep it constructive.

I really hadn't though about selling it separately due to the fact that the tolerances need to be held pretty tight that pretty much only a cnc will get the job done.If installed improperly it will do more damage than good.I suppose i may sell them to some approved installers that i feel has the capability to install these properly.

It does take longer inner studs-i have the proper stud kit with the proper nuts for these-the current nuts in the arp stud kits will not fit properly.
and the plate is actually 3/8'' thick

 

sorry shawn had said that the oil pan drop dwon .18 so i just figured the plate was .18 think

and i understand that shawn. so 1400 all machine and 100 for pin.

 

There is actually a step in the plate,i'll try and get some pics of the top side later,but it actually sits down in the block,it's about .180 thick at the pan rails.
anyway yes,it's 1400 installed with all parts and an extra 100 if you want pin installed between the bottom on the cap and the block-i consider this extra because the lsx,c5r and ls7 blocks are allready dowelled there.

 

Looks good Shawn..

 

Nice piece Shawn, I think it looks to be great product and service at more then a fair price. We do the something along those lines in house here too! I think people are getting away from the point of this being a high end race piece and not something for run of the mill 900hp builds.

 

Looks very nice, and a little familiar! It looks like we think a little alike......


Kurt

 

:b ang::ban g:

 

I think we got a couple of thoughts going in the same direction.