How to build boost at the line?????
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How to build boost at the line????? If you are on a pro tree, where you can't expect your competition to stage after you. Beside if you do it right you are only supposed to light one light up and then let the other person stage before you light the second light up. I have a customer that is looking to buy one of the turbo kits that are out right now. My ? is how in the world to you spool up a turbo in the amount of time that the pro tree comes on. 1.5 secs at the most. I have heard of some mustang guys pulling a crap pile of timing, on the brake and the 2-step, out in order to fire on an open exhaust valve thus spooling the turbo in a fraction of the time. Is there anything that anyone knows about for a f-body??? This is a list of what he has: He had a P1SC
382
blower cam 224/228
CNC 6.0 hoggged out heads from Pete at CNC
TSP lid
stock maf
LS6 intake
ASP pulley
TH400 with stock 1st gear and a T-brake
PI 4000 converter
373 gears in a 12 bolt
He sold the procharger, and is now wanting a turbo. Not a street setup either. It is going to be a full out race car that is seldom driving on the street. At least a 76MM.
Can anyone help me out here? I am in the process of building my own T76 kit for my car and was wondering the same thing. Any help would be awesome.
382
blower cam 224/228
CNC 6.0 hoggged out heads from Pete at CNC
TSP lid
stock maf
LS6 intake
ASP pulley
TH400 with stock 1st gear and a T-brake
PI 4000 converter
373 gears in a 12 bolt
He sold the procharger, and is now wanting a turbo. Not a street setup either. It is going to be a full out race car that is seldom driving on the street. At least a 76MM.
Can anyone help me out here? I am in the process of building my own T76 kit for my car and was wondering the same thing. Any help would be awesome.
Rossler makes a trans that alters the pressure in the converter to "loosen it up" to raise rpm then put the load back to leave the line. First you should try just stepping on it against the brake to see how long it takes.
The timing retard on two step works great on a stick car, its very common.
Kurt
The timing retard on two step works great on a stick car, its very common.
Kurt
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The car has a 2-step and a T-brake. I still don't know if the car is going to build to maximum boost in less then 2 secs. Here in Dallas I see alot of people in the mustangs having a hard time at the line building boost in time. GN's have the biggest issue with it. The light will be completely green and they are still at the line building enough boost to leave as hard as possible. I just thought there was a module to do this like the mustang guys have. They are not building 25lbs of boost in 1 second without there retard box. I don't think this F-body is going to build 15lbs of boost that fast either. We have yet to get it on the car so I am not for sure on this how it is going to work. Plz anyone else have any imput. I know there has to be somebody with knowledge out there for turbos on full out race F-bodies trying to make 1000rwhp and 1000lbtq in a matter of 1.5 seconds. Does anyone know what I am saying here or what? I think the 2-step is going to build the same amount of boost in the same amount of time as a T-brake would without a 2-step and vise versa. The 2-step is used to allow the converter to be flashed on take off and still have the gas on the floor(I.E. better 60ft). I am just wondering if this is going to be near fast enough. We are talking 1.5 seconds before the pro tree falls. That is pretty fast. The only reason I ask is because there are so many people having problems with that in many different vehicles around DFW area. Any more insight would be very helpful
Thx
C. J.
Thx
C. J.
you dont want full boost off the line just like 4-6 psi. you are going to have a hard time getting htat car to hook with 25 psi right off the line. With a tansbrake or a 2-step you could easily builid like 5-10 psi.
If you run much more than that you are going to hurt the ET or blow the tires.
this is how I see it, if you are set to run 20 psi and you boost to 10 off the line that give you a chance to build another 10 psi. if you leave at 20 then you are going to need to shift real soon, the BOV will empty the system and you have to build al that boost up again.
rob raymer said that if he built more than like 6 off the line all he would do is blow the tires out from under the car (dont quote this is from memory)
oh one more thing, i am in your aera does chris R have alot of experience with tunning FI cars?? I am going to either have your or Sean F tune the car just curious
thanks
ed
firebird455@onebox.com
If you run much more than that you are going to hurt the ET or blow the tires.
this is how I see it, if you are set to run 20 psi and you boost to 10 off the line that give you a chance to build another 10 psi. if you leave at 20 then you are going to need to shift real soon, the BOV will empty the system and you have to build al that boost up again.
rob raymer said that if he built more than like 6 off the line all he would do is blow the tires out from under the car (dont quote this is from memory)
oh one more thing, i am in your aera does chris R have alot of experience with tunning FI cars?? I am going to either have your or Sean F tune the car just curious
thanks
ed
firebird455@onebox.com
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From: Germantown, MD
Are there any 2-steps out there other than Harlan's? Not knocking the guy or his product, just curious what other units might be out there.
Also can someone explain why a 6 speed would retard timing off the line to build more boost? Wouldn't retarding the timing hurt you through the run or is there a way to adjust it on the fly?
Mike
Also can someone explain why a 6 speed would retard timing off the line to build more boost? Wouldn't retarding the timing hurt you through the run or is there a way to adjust it on the fly?
Mike
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Originally Posted by buschman
Are there any 2-steps out there other than Harlan's? Not knocking the guy or his product, just curious what other units might be out there.
Also can someone explain why a 6 speed would retard timing off the line to build more boost? Wouldn't retarding the timing hurt you through the run or is there a way to adjust it on the fly?
Mike
Also can someone explain why a 6 speed would retard timing off the line to build more boost? Wouldn't retarding the timing hurt you through the run or is there a way to adjust it on the fly?
Mike
On a automatic the engine is not freewheeling so this concept will probably not work. If you lower the timing the engine just gets lazy which gets you less boost or slower build up. There are no set "this will work" ways with a auto. Some people use a back cut stator in the converter to loosen it up at low speeds, then they brake torque the car in the first light to get some spool up before they roll in. Cars that do this you will sometimes notice a set of calipers per wheel in the rear to give them extra holding power. The problem with this method is when other people see you doing this they wait to stage last and your converter burns down waiting for them on boost.
In the end all that matters is "turbo's rock" but they are sometimes hard to work with. If it was easy everyone would have one!
Kurt
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Verdad Gallardo TECH Fanatic
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 1,220
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From: Germantown, MD
Well I have a blower, so I guess the point is moot for my own car. But just for education, what component allows you to retard your timing and put it back to normal when the clutch is engaged?
Mike
Mike
I would listen to Kurt on this one. Guy has driven lots of fast cars and knows what it takes to go fast.
From watching Mike Brown (9-second Incon car), he has never been able to get oof the line with more than about 5 pounds of boost. He will just nuke the tires if he goes any higher. His suspension is set up pretty well, but it certainly isn't "all out race" set up, so he could prolly go a little higher. Trubos make so much torque that the tires just have a hard time.
Here is a pic launching at a really good track (Norwalk) with only 5lbs of boost:
From watching Mike Brown (9-second Incon car), he has never been able to get oof the line with more than about 5 pounds of boost. He will just nuke the tires if he goes any higher. His suspension is set up pretty well, but it certainly isn't "all out race" set up, so he could prolly go a little higher. Trubos make so much torque that the tires just have a hard time.
Here is a pic launching at a really good track (Norwalk) with only 5lbs of boost:
Originally Posted by buschman
Well I have a blower, so I guess the point is moot for my own car. But just for education, what component allows you to retard your timing and put it back to normal when the clutch is engaged?
Mike
Mike
My personal favorite is FAST system with nitrous enable but no nitrous on the car. This allows you to retard timing and add fuel if you want based on when clutch switch is closed.
Kurt
Originally Posted by blackz93
doesnt most cars twist to the passenger side rear tire...looks funny to me!
On The Tree
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Posts: 181
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From: Land of no Drag Strip
The trick is to have the car almost spooled up when you cross the frist beem. Then setoff the second beem, on the trans-brake and floored as fast as you can. Most guy's will just pull in stage and then start to spool up the turbo. Go watch a pro5o race and watch the outlaw cars run.
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Thx for the help guys. I have heard alot of this from some people that I have talked to personally. In my car I will be able to spool alot more then 5psi because I have a PG with a 1.76 1st gear and a 28in tall tire which will allow me to use the converter way for effecientally then most people. I will probably have to go with a 29in tall tire. The car I was trying to get info on is on a TH400 which is still going to be able to use the 28in tall tire and maybe get up to 8-10psi.
From everyone on here and everyone I have talked to (alot of mustang owners). This is the proper way to do it. Pull into the first light brake stalling it up pretty high, then click the second light and onto the brake as soon as possible. I am sure I will beable to spool plenty, I mean it is not like I have 106mm turbo or anything. Thx for the help guys and I will soon see some of you at the track. I just ordered my LS1speed fuel system 3 days ago. It should be here the middle of next week.
From everyone on here and everyone I have talked to (alot of mustang owners). This is the proper way to do it. Pull into the first light brake stalling it up pretty high, then click the second light and onto the brake as soon as possible. I am sure I will beable to spool plenty, I mean it is not like I have 106mm turbo or anything. Thx for the help guys and I will soon see some of you at the track. I just ordered my LS1speed fuel system 3 days ago. It should be here the middle of next week.
The yellow car above has a Rossler built TH400, Midwest 3400 stall, manual valve body, and 28" tall tires. He can spool as high *** he wants to. Point is, he can't. Most tracks won't hold the power off the line using the transbrake. Good luck 
Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Reckless
The yellow car above has a Rossler built TH400, Midwest 3400 stall, manual valve body, and 28" tall tires. He can spool as high *** he wants to. Point is, he can't. Most tracks won't hold the power off the line using the transbrake. Good luck
Thx, I will need it I am sure. I am not ?ing anyone's ability to launch a car.
This is my customer's car TH400 w/brake,with 373 gears and a 28in tall tire.
My car's new setup is PG stock 1st gear w/brake, with 373 gears and a 29in tall tire. My goal is 8.99
