procharged f1 ls2 killed the thrust bearing
10-30-2011, 06:33 PM
#22
I know some guys are going to tell me I built it to loose for aluminum but the mains where 2.8-3.0 and the rods where 2.5-2.8 thats the reason I went straight to 20/50
when I was building this engine I put the oil pan level and measured out 8.5 quarts would fit in the pan with out touching the crank, with no oil in the galleys or top of the engine, I dont think I was causing any aeration problems??
when I was building this engine I put the oil pan level and measured out 8.5 quarts would fit in the pan with out touching the crank, with no oil in the galleys or top of the engine, I dont think I was causing any aeration problems??
10-30-2011, 07:20 PM
#23
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I wouldn't think the stock oil pickup tube or weight of oil used would have been a problem. I say this because some of the first scanner logs on this build the oil pressure held good pressure throughout the rpm range.
Last edited by DevonsZ; 10-30-2011 at 07:43 PM.
10-31-2011, 08:35 AM
#25
I had this exact same thing happen on a 406SBC. Happened twice.....the first time it happened the counter weights of the crank hit the block webs just like yours did. What a mess. Turns out it was shotty machining work that caused it. The mains were way out of alignment.
11-02-2011, 10:10 PM
#26
There is a lot going on here. I saw the thread in the tranny section and came to take a look.
First, the rotating assembly clearances seem a full number large to me. But, I do not build engines that see big boost at high rpm. However, I have built more engines than I can remember. And those specs are large in my opinion.
Second, the 1/4" gap between the converter and flexplate needs to be shimmed to 3/16".
Third, the only way you can have a converter / tranny issue causing your problem is to have too much converter charge pressure. Meaning, the pressure going into the converter overcomes the engine oil pressure. Now, I've seen this in different combinations over the years. But never have I seen it happen with a 65e. And I build many of them each month. I have locked the line pressure at 225 psi in nitrous engines and have not seen that issue. I have Powerglides in Pro Mods and heavy door cars that make 298 psi line pressure and do not see that issue.
Fourth, I have never seen a Yank converter fail in such a way that it causes thrust issues. Dave builds a nice piece.
And finally to answer your question directly... the pressure you are wanting to measure is the tranny to cooler pressure. That will tell you what your converter charge pressure. The fluid enters the converter and then goes directly to the cooler. I cant say as I've ever concerned myself with that pressure in my testing on a 60 series unit. But, I have measured it in powerglides when I am fine tuning a certain combination. I would say that if you are seeing anything over 65psi to the cooler then you have the potential to overcome engine oil pressure.... makes sense right? Well... keep in mind I have much more pressure than that in much more powerful combinations that make much less engine oil pressure than I am shoving into the converter and those engines are living fine.
What flexplate are you running?
Who did the machine work on that motor and how many boosted applications have they set up?
After seeing the pics, my professional opinion is you have a wimpy flexplate or some crummy engine machine work. But I could be wrong.
g
First, the rotating assembly clearances seem a full number large to me. But, I do not build engines that see big boost at high rpm. However, I have built more engines than I can remember. And those specs are large in my opinion.
Second, the 1/4" gap between the converter and flexplate needs to be shimmed to 3/16".
Third, the only way you can have a converter / tranny issue causing your problem is to have too much converter charge pressure. Meaning, the pressure going into the converter overcomes the engine oil pressure. Now, I've seen this in different combinations over the years. But never have I seen it happen with a 65e. And I build many of them each month. I have locked the line pressure at 225 psi in nitrous engines and have not seen that issue. I have Powerglides in Pro Mods and heavy door cars that make 298 psi line pressure and do not see that issue.
Fourth, I have never seen a Yank converter fail in such a way that it causes thrust issues. Dave builds a nice piece.
And finally to answer your question directly... the pressure you are wanting to measure is the tranny to cooler pressure. That will tell you what your converter charge pressure. The fluid enters the converter and then goes directly to the cooler. I cant say as I've ever concerned myself with that pressure in my testing on a 60 series unit. But, I have measured it in powerglides when I am fine tuning a certain combination. I would say that if you are seeing anything over 65psi to the cooler then you have the potential to overcome engine oil pressure.... makes sense right? Well... keep in mind I have much more pressure than that in much more powerful combinations that make much less engine oil pressure than I am shoving into the converter and those engines are living fine.
What flexplate are you running?
Who did the machine work on that motor and how many boosted applications have they set up?
After seeing the pics, my professional opinion is you have a wimpy flexplate or some crummy engine machine work. But I could be wrong.
g
11-02-2011, 11:33 PM
#28
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I had a thrust bearing failure exactly like this. My other bearings were not trashed and my counter-weights were dragging on the block. You may have had other issues.
11-03-2011, 08:44 AM
#30
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Was there any debris noticed in the oil before it got to this point? I had severe thrust bearing wear a couple years ago and it turned out to be the rear crank thrust surface wasn't polished properly. It was a pain in the *** identifying the root cause of the problem.
11-03-2011, 07:53 PM
#31
everybody that has posted on this I appreciate it very much.
the flex plate is a tci, this is the third converter I have used from dave and they have all been flawless. I use all 6 points on the converter
the line pressure on the tranny exceeding the oil pressure in the engine make good sense if that is the case.
On the engine... I built it myself, I built a couple bbc with decent boost numbers and had pretty good luck.
On the clearances for this engine I was always taught if you build it tight everybody will know(BOOM) if you build it loose you will only know... not in this case...
this engine only had 800miles on it, (200 break in) (oil change) then 600 of them where wot racing, it was actually going to get changed that weekend. the break in oil was clean..
this block did have a main alignment issue when I tried to put it together, I would torque down the number 2 main cap and the crank would lock, it was lined bored and after that everything turn smooth on the build.
the flex plate is a tci, this is the third converter I have used from dave and they have all been flawless. I use all 6 points on the converter
the line pressure on the tranny exceeding the oil pressure in the engine make good sense if that is the case.
On the engine... I built it myself, I built a couple bbc with decent boost numbers and had pretty good luck.
On the clearances for this engine I was always taught if you build it tight everybody will know(BOOM) if you build it loose you will only know... not in this case...
this engine only had 800miles on it, (200 break in) (oil change) then 600 of them where wot racing, it was actually going to get changed that weekend. the break in oil was clean..
this block did have a main alignment issue when I tried to put it together, I would torque down the number 2 main cap and the crank would lock, it was lined bored and after that everything turn smooth on the build.
11-12-2011, 08:34 AM
#33
"this block did have a main alignment issue when I tried to put it together, I would torque down the number 2 main cap and the crank would lock, it was lined bored and after that everything turn smooth on the build."
Did you check the mains for runout?
Did you check the mains for runout?
