Advice for a 600rwhp turbo setup?
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From: Jacksonville, FL
Advice for a 600rwhp turbo setup? - RX7/LS1 hybrid Hey,
Basically, I miss my old turbo setup. Nitrous is a lot of fun, but it doesn't compare to the feel and fun factor of a turbo. I'm still learning about ls1s and piston engines in general. They are definately a bit different than the rotaries I'm used to building and blowing up.
I have a few ideas, but really need a lot of direction. I'm looking to make around 600rwhp and need advice from those of you who have done it. Obviously since the ls1 is in my rx-7, a custom kit will be fabbed.I just pulled the engine on saturday with plans to prepare it for boost.
Here's what I'm thinking.
A set of low compression forged pistons, arp rod bolts, and stock rods. From what I've read the stock rods appear to be strong enough. Anyone else have a different opinion?
I'm thinking about maybe a t-66 if I have room. Any advise here?
Are there any limitations with ls1edit that I should be aware of? How much boost will the stock map sensor read? I'm assuming 14psi or so.
How much boost will it take to reach around 600rwhp?
The car currently weighs in at 2700lbs with half a tank of gas. I'm planning to add a roll bar along with the turbo setup. Hopefully the end result will be 2900lbs at most.
At the momment I have 4.10 gears. I'm in the process of hunting down an autmatic 3.9 rear end. This is the best I can do for gearing unless I want to buy aftermarket 4.33's or 4.7's which obviously aren't going to help. My only other option is to fab in a different rear end that has a wider gear selection. Since I want to keep my IRS, this will require a lot of bling, so take into mind that for the momment I'm stuck with 3.9's. and around a 26 inch tall tire. Traction is currently no issue, the car will dead hook from 45mph on the bottle, but I'm concerned with the short gearing and the turbo.
Sorry for the novel.
Thanks!
Basically, I miss my old turbo setup. Nitrous is a lot of fun, but it doesn't compare to the feel and fun factor of a turbo. I'm still learning about ls1s and piston engines in general. They are definately a bit different than the rotaries I'm used to building and blowing up.
I have a few ideas, but really need a lot of direction. I'm looking to make around 600rwhp and need advice from those of you who have done it. Obviously since the ls1 is in my rx-7, a custom kit will be fabbed.I just pulled the engine on saturday with plans to prepare it for boost.
Here's what I'm thinking.
A set of low compression forged pistons, arp rod bolts, and stock rods. From what I've read the stock rods appear to be strong enough. Anyone else have a different opinion?
I'm thinking about maybe a t-66 if I have room. Any advise here?
Are there any limitations with ls1edit that I should be aware of? How much boost will the stock map sensor read? I'm assuming 14psi or so.
How much boost will it take to reach around 600rwhp?
The car currently weighs in at 2700lbs with half a tank of gas. I'm planning to add a roll bar along with the turbo setup. Hopefully the end result will be 2900lbs at most.
At the momment I have 4.10 gears. I'm in the process of hunting down an autmatic 3.9 rear end. This is the best I can do for gearing unless I want to buy aftermarket 4.33's or 4.7's which obviously aren't going to help. My only other option is to fab in a different rear end that has a wider gear selection. Since I want to keep my IRS, this will require a lot of bling, so take into mind that for the momment I'm stuck with 3.9's. and around a 26 inch tall tire. Traction is currently no issue, the car will dead hook from 45mph on the bottle, but I'm concerned with the short gearing and the turbo.
Sorry for the novel.
Thanks! Last edited by 1point3liter; Mar 30, 2004 at 12:06 AM.
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One one thing I forgot to mention. Due to my limited gearing, I really want to spin this engine as high as possible. 6800rpm maybe?
I'm currently running a TR224 112 cam. I would imagine that a spit pattern cam with a high LSA would be preferable. Anyone have a recommendation?
I'm currently running a TR224 112 cam. I would imagine that a spit pattern cam with a high LSA would be preferable. Anyone have a recommendation?
there was a guy in columbus that put a supercharged ls1 in his 3rd gen rx7, but he doesnt get online that much.
anyways first off.
the T66 probably wont be big enough, id use a T76 should be good to go for 600rwhp
pumbing would be some work for you as i dont know how much room you have with the ls1 in your rex, unless you already have it in there.
as for edit, you should be fine with it at 600rwhp after a little more then that the factory MAF meter can only read 60lbs/min so its hard to get past that point with out a piggyback
for your cam the 224 would do ok but id go with a higher lsa like 114-116 instead of the 112.
what tranny are you using?
anyways first off.
the T66 probably wont be big enough, id use a T76 should be good to go for 600rwhp
pumbing would be some work for you as i dont know how much room you have with the ls1 in your rex, unless you already have it in there.
as for edit, you should be fine with it at 600rwhp after a little more then that the factory MAF meter can only read 60lbs/min so its hard to get past that point with out a piggyback
for your cam the 224 would do ok but id go with a higher lsa like 114-116 instead of the 112.
what tranny are you using?
for your CR what octane do you want to use
id perfer something close to 9:1, but i use 94 octane.
if you want to lower the octane requirements you could go lower, but ofcoarse you be a bit more laggy till boost, and spool time be shortened.
id perfer something close to 9:1, but i use 94 octane.
if you want to lower the octane requirements you could go lower, but ofcoarse you be a bit more laggy till boost, and spool time be shortened.
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From: Jacksonville, FL
Originally Posted by smokinHawk
there was a guy in columbus that put a supercharged ls1 in his 3rd gen rx7, but he doesnt get online that much.
Originally Posted by smokinHawk
the T66 probably wont be big enough, id use a T76 should be good to go for 600rwhp. plumbing would be some work for you as i dont know how much room you have with the ls1 in your rex, unless you already have it in there.
Originally Posted by smokinHawk
as for edit, you should be fine with it at 600rwhp after a little more then that the factory MAF meter can only read 60lbs/min so its hard to get past that for your cam the 224 would do ok but id go with a higher lsa like 114-116 point with out a piggyback
Originally Posted by smokinHawk
what tranny are you using?
Originally Posted by smokinHawk
for your CR what octane do you want to use
id perfer something close to 9:1, but i use 94 octane.
if you want to lower the octane requirements you could go lower, but ofcoarse you be a bit more laggy till boost, and spool time be shortened.
id perfer something close to 9:1, but i use 94 octane.
if you want to lower the octane requirements you could go lower, but ofcoarse you be a bit more laggy till boost, and spool time be shortened.
What pistons are most people using? Do you see a problem with me using stock rods with arp rod bolts instead of a forged set? Do I need to oring my block or consider 6.0L truck heads?
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Nice project, I like the RX7/LS1 hybrid.
My responses:
I make 746rwhp on 17 lbs of boost on a forged 9:1 348ci:
stock crank
3.905 -8.6cc Diamond Pistons
6.0 ported heads, 2.02/1.57 valves, flow 300/225 at 600 lift
230/236 FMS/ Cam Motion cam, 115 LSA, 3.5 degrees of overlap @ .050
Eagle 6.125 rods, ARP rod bolts, L19's
H11 custom head studs
6.0 MLS head gaskets
1.7 Y/T rockers
-I would run aftermarket rods but thats' me
-I have yet to see a turbo setup that made power to 6800 rpms
-I'd look for less gear see above
-600rwhp, 9:1 compression, ported heads, I'd say 10-12 psi depending on how efficient the combo is
My responses:
I make 746rwhp on 17 lbs of boost on a forged 9:1 348ci:
stock crank
3.905 -8.6cc Diamond Pistons
6.0 ported heads, 2.02/1.57 valves, flow 300/225 at 600 lift
230/236 FMS/ Cam Motion cam, 115 LSA, 3.5 degrees of overlap @ .050
Eagle 6.125 rods, ARP rod bolts, L19's
H11 custom head studs
6.0 MLS head gaskets
1.7 Y/T rockers
-I would run aftermarket rods but thats' me
-I have yet to see a turbo setup that made power to 6800 rpms
-I'd look for less gear see above
-600rwhp, 9:1 compression, ported heads, I'd say 10-12 psi depending on how efficient the combo is
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Verdad Gallardo Thread Starter
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From: Jacksonville, FL
John,
Thanks, it's a fun car. Hopefully I'll have it back together soon.
So you really feel that I'll need heads to make around 600rwhp at 9:1 compression with lets say a t-76 / .96 exhaust? When is hp dropping off rpm wise for the majority of turbo ls1s?
What about people using water/alcohol injection? I would imagine they are able to run more boost safely and make higher numbers without heads.
Thanks, it's a fun car. Hopefully I'll have it back together soon.
So you really feel that I'll need heads to make around 600rwhp at 9:1 compression with lets say a t-76 / .96 exhaust? When is hp dropping off rpm wise for the majority of turbo ls1s?
What about people using water/alcohol injection? I would imagine they are able to run more boost safely and make higher numbers without heads.
you wont need heads but they'll help make about 40 hp. lets just say it won't hurt to do heads you may want to run arp head studs and o ring the heads for insurance to keep em from lifting.
do a search on rob raymer's car he has run alcohol injection he is pretty much the turbo guy here on this forum. also harlan who has a tt solid roller setup knows a lot too. both guys make power in the 700's
at 600 rear wheel that car should fly and be scarey fast. hope ya got a full cage in that thing.
do a search on rob raymer's car he has run alcohol injection he is pretty much the turbo guy here on this forum. also harlan who has a tt solid roller setup knows a lot too. both guys make power in the 700's
at 600 rear wheel that car should fly and be scarey fast. hope ya got a full cage in that thing.
You don't need heads to make 600rwhp.
I have not seen a turbo LS1 stock cube setup make power over 6400 rpms. I think all of them that I have seen have peaked below 6200.
I have not seen a turbo LS1 stock cube setup make power over 6400 rpms. I think all of them that I have seen have peaked below 6200.
There so many ways to do it. Many are right, right?
I would use forged rods, since you want the extra strain of autocross, which stock rods can handle the 600rwhp level, but not for extended periods of time, IMO.
Gearing also, might want to come down if you could. Heads, you could do a set and would require a little less boost.
Interesting project. Good luck.
I would use forged rods, since you want the extra strain of autocross, which stock rods can handle the 600rwhp level, but not for extended periods of time, IMO.
Gearing also, might want to come down if you could. Heads, you could do a set and would require a little less boost.
Interesting project. Good luck.
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My advice for you is this:
Bring us the car, motor, some Bud Light, and a little paper. And don't forget we already need a cage.
I'll make that thing faster than you'll ever need to go. Oh yeah - found enough pieces to put together a quality T72 or 76, so that's one part of the puzzle in place.
I too would like to hear from a few more of you guys that have put together GenIII turbo engines, specifically regarding cam selection, valvetrain components, and what kind of bottom end work was done/which parts were used. TIA
Tracy G
Bring us the car, motor, some Bud Light, and a little paper. And don't forget we already need a cage.
I'll make that thing faster than you'll ever need to go. Oh yeah - found enough pieces to put together a quality T72 or 76, so that's one part of the puzzle in place.I too would like to hear from a few more of you guys that have put together GenIII turbo engines, specifically regarding cam selection, valvetrain components, and what kind of bottom end work was done/which parts were used. TIA
Tracy G
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From: Jacksonville, FL
Originally Posted by Speedfab
My advice for you is this:
Bring us the car, motor, some Bud Light, and a little paper. And don't forget we already need a cage. I'll make that thing faster than you'll ever need to go. Oh yeah - found enough pieces to put together a quality T72 or 76, so that's one part of the puzzle in place.
I too would like to hear from a few more of you guys that have put together GenIII turbo engines, specifically regarding cam selection, valvetrain components, and what kind of bottom end work was done/which parts were used. TIA
Tracy G
Bring us the car, motor, some Bud Light, and a little paper. And don't forget we already need a cage.
I'll make that thing faster than you'll ever need to go. Oh yeah - found enough pieces to put together a quality T72 or 76, so that's one part of the puzzle in place.I too would like to hear from a few more of you guys that have put together GenIII turbo engines, specifically regarding cam selection, valvetrain components, and what kind of bottom end work was done/which parts were used. TIA
Tracy G
lmao... I wasn't exspecting to see you posting here. I'm motivated. Hopefully it won't take me too long to come up with the funds to piece it together. I'll give you a call tomorrow. Thanks.
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Originally Posted by Got Me SOM
you wont need heads but they'll help make about 40 hp. lets just say it won't hurt to do heads you may want to run arp head studs and o ring the heads for insurance to keep em from lifting.
I do currently have a set of ARP head studs. O-ringing may be worth while. I thought most people o-ringed the block not the heads. I could be wrong... I'm used to dealing with rotards.
Originally Posted by Got Me SOM
at 600 rear wheel that car should fly and be scarey fast. hope ya got a full cage in that thing.
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Originally Posted by Pro Stock John
You don't need heads to make 600rwhp.
I have not seen a turbo LS1 stock cube setup make power over 6400 rpms. I think all of them that I have seen have peaked below 6200.
I have not seen a turbo LS1 stock cube setup make power over 6400 rpms. I think all of them that I have seen have peaked below 6200.
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Originally Posted by CAT3
There so many ways to do it. Many are right, right?
I would use forged rods, since you want the extra strain of autocross, which stock rods can handle the 600rwhp level, but not for extended periods of time, IMO.
I would use forged rods, since you want the extra strain of autocross, which stock rods can handle the 600rwhp level, but not for extended periods of time, IMO.
QUOTE=CAT3]Gearing also, might want to come down if you could. Heads, you could do a set and would require a little less boost.
Interesting project. Good luck.[/QUOTE]
Gear wise... I'll just have to deal with the 3.9's for now. Once I get her up and running I'll just have to drive through it and find a solution later.
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Originally Posted by Pro Stock John
To be ubercheap I would reuse the stock rods.
You will need a significant compression drop to do 600rwhp on pump gas.
You will need a significant compression drop to do 600rwhp on pump gas.
So you're thinking more along the lines of 8.5:1 or even lower?
Which pistons would I need for 9:1 with 5.7L heads? Are there pistons available that can lower the compression even lower without 6.0L liters heads?
Thanks again to all of you. This boinger piston stuff is a lot different than the rotard triangle crap I'm used to playing with.
