Water/Alchy installed
Water/Alchy installed I have yet to tune the car but am running on 93 and alchy. The car is super rich and is loading up real bad. It loads up then goes then loads up some more toward the top end. Car is sitting with the tune when I was running 100oct and 680rwhp. It has 15deg timing and was running rich off the charts when it made that power. When the car did go yesterday, playing with the alchy, it ran like a scalded dog. How many deg of timing should I be able to run now? It will be on my dyno and tuned middle to end of this week. Does the alchy and pump gas make it even fatter? This is all new to me, never played with the alchy? I know Rob Raymer can chime in on this one! Thanks guys.......................Angelo 
TECH Addict
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 2,659
Likes: 1
From: Bellevue, Wa
absoultely it makes it richer.
it's high octane fuel.
you will need to pull fuel via the PE vs RPM table or whatever table your using for fuel enrichment.
personally running that much boost I don't know if I would touch timing. Maybe 1 degree but that's it.
it's high octane fuel.
you will need to pull fuel via the PE vs RPM table or whatever table your using for fuel enrichment.
personally running that much boost I don't know if I would touch timing. Maybe 1 degree but that's it.
the turbobuick guys know alot about alki.
you should try www.turbobuick.com
oh and blackbird here has some know how of it too.
you should try www.turbobuick.com
oh and blackbird here has some know how of it too.
running alc inj means you can run more timing and more boost. adds octane
i would leave your timing alone.
i would up the boost level my 1 psi, log...and keep adding until the a/f gets to where u want it to be.
examples
base tune
13psi with pump gas only
alc + pump gas tune
15+ psi
so when you are cruising around...dont waste the alc...set the boost to 13psi.
when you are at a stop light and line up next to a bike...turn on the alc and turn up the boost...dont forget to turn on the alc
what mix are you using? 50/50?
50% denature alc/50% water
i would leave your timing alone.
i would up the boost level my 1 psi, log...and keep adding until the a/f gets to where u want it to be.
examples
base tune
13psi with pump gas only
alc + pump gas tune
15+ psi
so when you are cruising around...dont waste the alc...set the boost to 13psi.
when you are at a stop light and line up next to a bike...turn on the alc and turn up the boost...dont forget to turn on the alc
what mix are you using? 50/50?
50% denature alc/50% water
Originally Posted by SC-MECHAM-WS6
running alc inj means you can run more timing and more boost. adds octane
i would leave your timing alone.
i would up the boost level my 1 psi, log...and keep adding until the a/f gets to where u want it to be.
examples
base tune
13psi with pump gas only
alc + pump gas tune
15+ psi
so when you are cruising around...dont waste the alc...set the boost to 13psi.
when you are at a stop light and line up next to a bike...turn on the alc and turn up the boost...dont forget to turn on the alc
what mix are you using? 50/50?
50% denature alc/50% water
i would leave your timing alone.
i would up the boost level my 1 psi, log...and keep adding until the a/f gets to where u want it to be.
examples
base tune
13psi with pump gas only
alc + pump gas tune
15+ psi
so when you are cruising around...dont waste the alc...set the boost to 13psi.
when you are at a stop light and line up next to a bike...turn on the alc and turn up the boost...dont forget to turn on the alc
what mix are you using? 50/50?
50% denature alc/50% water
TECH Addict
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 2,659
Likes: 1
From: Bellevue, Wa
no reason not to run 100% alky if you want to. You will see the most benefit this way.
I ran a 50-50 mix because then it's not flameable and I am a sissy to chicken to cart around a flamable mixture in my rear hatch
I don't quite understand SC-Mecham's logic but here is mine.
I'm sure your system has an adjustable turn on point. If not it should. Set that a psi or two below where you would get in trouble without the alky and then tune the car.
What I mean by that is for example if you give it part throttle and only hit 5-6psi you probably don't need the alky to hit but if you got beyond that you would. So program the system to hit when you need it to, tune it, and be done with it.
Relying on adjusting your boost level and arming the alky, etc... is really over complicating things IMO.
I ran a 50-50 mix because then it's not flameable and I am a sissy to chicken to cart around a flamable mixture in my rear hatch
I don't quite understand SC-Mecham's logic but here is mine.
I'm sure your system has an adjustable turn on point. If not it should. Set that a psi or two below where you would get in trouble without the alky and then tune the car.
What I mean by that is for example if you give it part throttle and only hit 5-6psi you probably don't need the alky to hit but if you got beyond that you would. So program the system to hit when you need it to, tune it, and be done with it.
Relying on adjusting your boost level and arming the alky, etc... is really over complicating things IMO.
im pretty sure he sees full boost very fast with his turbo setup. where as with a sc car you can effectively set that 5-6psi and you have more rpm to play with.
MM did a 50/50 with his setup..
https://ls1tech.com/forums/forced-induction/179252-another-day-another-dyno.html
MM did a 50/50 with his setup..
https://ls1tech.com/forums/forced-induction/179252-another-day-another-dyno.html
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Originally Posted by Blackbird
absoultely it makes it richer.
it's high octane fuel.
you will need to pull fuel via the PE vs RPM table or whatever table your using for fuel enrichment.
it's high octane fuel.
you will need to pull fuel via the PE vs RPM table or whatever table your using for fuel enrichment.
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matt snow told me i wouldnt notice much between half and half and full meth.. other than you are using methanol up half as fast.. seems to be working fine for me.
adeeo did you buy a kit like my snow kit or build your own?
ya mine just comes on full force at a boost level set by my turbosmart.. but you can get an adjustable on point boost switch as well. if you set it too low you will get a bog.. or if you are spraying too much you will get a bog.
mine is set at 6psi right now to come on.. lower and it will bog.. higher and i worry about it not being fully on by the time i get over 12psi.
i have not attempted to run my timing up higher.. or turn the boost up higher.. it is just there for me to add octane and make the max power available any time i floor it rather than having to schedule a trip to get race gas.
if your compression is low as i assume it is i dont see why your timing needs to be that low anyhow.. my timing is at 24* through the range. what i would do if i were you is get back on the dyno.. leave the methanol right where it is at as far as pressure and nozzle size and tune your a/f back to where it should be.. say 11.3-5:1
you can spray full methanol on the dyno if you are looking for some breathing room during tuning.. good luck!
oh yea forgot to add, only made one pass this weekend.. was on 93 octane and 50/50 meth and tap water was a 10.6 at 137 on a 1.8 60'!
adeeo did you buy a kit like my snow kit or build your own?
ya mine just comes on full force at a boost level set by my turbosmart.. but you can get an adjustable on point boost switch as well. if you set it too low you will get a bog.. or if you are spraying too much you will get a bog.
mine is set at 6psi right now to come on.. lower and it will bog.. higher and i worry about it not being fully on by the time i get over 12psi.
i have not attempted to run my timing up higher.. or turn the boost up higher.. it is just there for me to add octane and make the max power available any time i floor it rather than having to schedule a trip to get race gas.
if your compression is low as i assume it is i dont see why your timing needs to be that low anyhow.. my timing is at 24* through the range. what i would do if i were you is get back on the dyno.. leave the methanol right where it is at as far as pressure and nozzle size and tune your a/f back to where it should be.. say 11.3-5:1
you can spray full methanol on the dyno if you are looking for some breathing room during tuning.. good luck!
oh yea forgot to add, only made one pass this weekend.. was on 93 octane and 50/50 meth and tap water was a 10.6 at 137 on a 1.8 60'!
12 Second Truck Club
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 5,574
Likes: 0
From: Sacramento, CA
Mine is triggered through the boost controller I believe. I also have a PAC module which varies the voltage to the pump depending on manifold pressure so I don't spray too much at low boost but get enough at high boost
I have the SMC kit with the base controller. Two ***** pump speed, low high ****. Pump speed for how hard the alchy hits and low high to where the alchy starts spraying. I see full boost when I floor it so I have it coming on early. It is preset for 12psi and I turn it 45deg counterclockwise for around 5psi to come on. I will post results and a graph when tuning is completed. I was under the impression I would have to add timing and pull fuel? Thanks
Originally Posted by Pro Stock John
MM how much has your tune changed with the alky from whatever equivalent race gas combo?
How are you folks trigger the alky, is it thru the Turbosmart?
How are you folks trigger the alky, is it thru the Turbosmart?
It also has a provision for using a 2 step or transbrake. When the 'staging' circut is connected to a ground signal, the system goes into a low output mode to fill the injection line and spray a very small amount, something like the pump at 2psi. When the ground signal is lost (circut open) the pump goes to high pressure.
I'm just finishing the wiring up in the next night or so, time to buy some meth
i have not changed the tune at all. the wideband corrects me up to 20% on the dfi so it is pulling the gasoline that i am adding with the methanol for me.
you can use any switch you want, hobbs type, wide open, rpm blah blah.. i used an output on my boost controller.
you can use any switch you want, hobbs type, wide open, rpm blah blah.. i used an output on my boost controller.
I run 100% meth and saw about 12psi on 93 octane with zero KR... my a/f was way low but the car doesn't seem to miss a beat. I left my timing and pulled some fuel via the PE but not enough. I never dynoed it like this.... but should have some numbers with my kit and the alky here by the end of the week I hope... gotta break this clutch in. I am running the SMC kit by the way.
Goodluck,
-Jarrod
Goodluck,
-Jarrod
I got the PAC kit, went with a 2 bar sensor since I don't forsee going higher with an incon kit. Razor is a good guy to work with. He will make custom length lines for your install as he did for mine.
I'm going to finish off (hopefully) the wiring tonight, and I'll snap some install pics and post here. I'm mounting the boost sensor, PAC controller and stuff in the glovebox for now.
I'm going to finish off (hopefully) the wiring tonight, and I'll snap some install pics and post here. I'm mounting the boost sensor, PAC controller and stuff in the glovebox for now.
10 Second Club
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,755
Likes: 2
From: Cincinnati, Ohio
Originally Posted by Fast Toys Performance Parts
For those of you running the SMC kit, where did you install the resevoir/pump etc? Any pics would be great!