when is a deka 80 truly done on e85
when is a deka 80 truly done on e85 a few of us are running deka 80s on e85 and have pushed them pretty hard my buddys Camaro runs 9.30 at 145@ 3500 weight with 120ish DC. and it is still nice and fat 11.0 afr gas scale. and he is at 50 psi base so we can turn it up to 57 lbs and get more yet.
I run about 100/110 DC on them in the nova and I can literally add fuel to my table until I dround it out and it will burble.
I know 100% is 100% but if they keep giving why not run them. I see guys push them but I feel we are to so where do they get unreliable? thanks.
I run about 100/110 DC on them in the nova and I can literally add fuel to my table until I dround it out and it will burble.
I know 100% is 100% but if they keep giving why not run them. I see guys push them but I feel we are to so where do they get unreliable? thanks.
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a few of us are running deka 80s on e85 and have pushed them pretty hard my buddys Camaro runs 9.30 at 145@ 3500 weight with the injectors static open. and it is still nice and fat 11.0 afr gas scale. and he is at 50 psi base so we can turn it up to 57 lbs and get more yet.
If I run them static open in the nova, I drown it out and it will burble.
If they keep giving, why not run them? I see guys push them but I feel we are to so where do they get unreliable? thanks.
If I run them static open in the nova, I drown it out and it will burble.
If they keep giving, why not run them? I see guys push them but I feel we are to so where do they get unreliable? thanks.
ok I see your point but why do they continue to act exactly the same from 80 to 100% dc as they do from 100 to 120% dc.
this is what I'm trying to say if I make a run at 11.3 afr on e85 at 22 psi boost and the dc is in the 117 range and go to the fuel table and add 4 numbers to the table and it goes to 10.7 afr why did that add fuel if they are static?? I ask that because that is what we are doing and it keeps getting richer.
if I'm at 100 dc on the nova and ad 10 numbers to my fuel table it will go to 10.0 afr and slow down a half second or more.
I'm not arguing we don't all need bigger injectors I'm sure we do. but what accually limits the injector from adding fuel. what is the 100%% value based off of.
this is what I'm trying to say if I make a run at 11.3 afr on e85 at 22 psi boost and the dc is in the 117 range and go to the fuel table and add 4 numbers to the table and it goes to 10.7 afr why did that add fuel if they are static?? I ask that because that is what we are doing and it keeps getting richer.
if I'm at 100 dc on the nova and ad 10 numbers to my fuel table it will go to 10.0 afr and slow down a half second or more.
I'm not arguing we don't all need bigger injectors I'm sure we do. but what accually limits the injector from adding fuel. what is the 100%% value based off of.
Originally Posted by yenkomike
ok I see your point but why do they continue to act exactly the same from 80 to 100% dc as they do from 100 to 120% dc.
this is what I'm trying to say if I make a run at 11.3 afr on e85 at 22 psi boost and the dc is in the 117 range and go to the fuel table and add 4 numbers to the table and it goes to 10.7 afr why did that add fuel if they are static?? I ask that because that is what we are doing and it keeps getting richer.
if I'm at 100 dc on the nova and ad 10 numbers to my fuel table it will go to 10.0 afr and slow down a half second or more.
I'm not arguing we don't all need bigger injectors I'm sure we do. but what accually limits the injector from adding fuel. what is the 100%% value based off of.
this is what I'm trying to say if I make a run at 11.3 afr on e85 at 22 psi boost and the dc is in the 117 range and go to the fuel table and add 4 numbers to the table and it goes to 10.7 afr why did that add fuel if they are static?? I ask that because that is what we are doing and it keeps getting richer.
if I'm at 100 dc on the nova and ad 10 numbers to my fuel table it will go to 10.0 afr and slow down a half second or more.
I'm not arguing we don't all need bigger injectors I'm sure we do. but what accually limits the injector from adding fuel. what is the 100%% value based off of.
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Joined: Sep 2014
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ok I see your point but why do they continue to act exactly the same from 80 to 100% dc as they do from 100 to 120% dc.
this is what I'm trying to say if I make a run at 11.3 afr on e85 at 22 psi boost and the dc is in the 117 range and go to the fuel table and add 4 numbers to the table and it goes to 10.7 afr why did that add fuel if they are static?? I ask that because that is what we are doing and it keeps getting richer.
if I'm at 100 dc on the nova and ad 10 numbers to my fuel table it will go to 10.0 afr and slow down a half second or more.
I'm not arguing we don't all need bigger injectors I'm sure we do. but what accually limits the injector from adding fuel. what is the 100%% value based off of.
this is what I'm trying to say if I make a run at 11.3 afr on e85 at 22 psi boost and the dc is in the 117 range and go to the fuel table and add 4 numbers to the table and it goes to 10.7 afr why did that add fuel if they are static?? I ask that because that is what we are doing and it keeps getting richer.
if I'm at 100 dc on the nova and ad 10 numbers to my fuel table it will go to 10.0 afr and slow down a half second or more.
I'm not arguing we don't all need bigger injectors I'm sure we do. but what accually limits the injector from adding fuel. what is the 100%% value based off of.
However and whatever it seems like, 120% DC is functionally the same as 100%.
The only way I can think of anything more than 100% DC making any difference is if there's a bridge in the time space continuum and the ECU is capable of taking advantage of it by importing time from an alternate reality. Outside of that, there is no possible way to have 120% of a minute occur in a minute... at 120% DC the injectors would have to be open for 72 seconds in 1 minute. Obviously impossible.
I wonder what's up with your deal. You're not a crack smoker... are you? LOL J/K
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the car is a micro squirt they all are. I just checked my setup and it is correct
364 ci
8 cylinder
80.0 lb injectors
9.7 afr
my understanding is 100% duty cycle is not based on 100% open all the time but based on intake valve cycle events or a equation like that I'm going to google this **** right now and see what I find.
I'LL BE BACK. LOL.
364 ci
8 cylinder
80.0 lb injectors
9.7 afr
my understanding is 100% duty cycle is not based on 100% open all the time but based on intake valve cycle events or a equation like that I'm going to google this **** right now and see what I find.
I'LL BE BACK. LOL.
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TECH Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2015
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From: Pittsboro, IN
the car is a micro squirt they all are. I just checked my setup and it is correct
364 ci
8 cylinder
80.0 lb injectors
9.7 afr
my understanding is 100% duty cycle is not based on 100% open all the time but based on intake valve cycle events or a equation like that I'm going to google this **** right now and see what I find.
I'LL BE BACK. LOL.
364 ci
8 cylinder
80.0 lb injectors
9.7 afr
my understanding is 100% duty cycle is not based on 100% open all the time but based on intake valve cycle events or a equation like that I'm going to google this **** right now and see what I find.
I'LL BE BACK. LOL.
yes looking on line I find that duty cycle is the amount of time the injectors have to open and close in relation to rpm of the engine as there is only so much time in between injector pulses to open and close again
so I looked up an injector duty cycle calculator and they all say I'm around 64%
I looked at my log and found it said 124% dc at 6000
I was at 12.89 ms pulse width. then it occurred to me my micro is a batch fire firing twice per cycle. so that explanes it to an extent. so instead of having two injector pulses per cycle it is trying to fire two but there is not enuff time so it is opening and not closeing for the second pulse but seeing I'm not out of time in the cycle when I add numbers to the table it is in effect holding the injector open longer at the beginning of the first cycle and longer at the end of the second cycle thus explaning why I still get more fuel even though I'm at 124%
I might be a crack smoker but that is how I see it .LOL..
so I looked up an injector duty cycle calculator and they all say I'm around 64%
I looked at my log and found it said 124% dc at 6000
I was at 12.89 ms pulse width. then it occurred to me my micro is a batch fire firing twice per cycle. so that explanes it to an extent. so instead of having two injector pulses per cycle it is trying to fire two but there is not enuff time so it is opening and not closeing for the second pulse but seeing I'm not out of time in the cycle when I add numbers to the table it is in effect holding the injector open longer at the beginning of the first cycle and longer at the end of the second cycle thus explaning why I still get more fuel even though I'm at 124%
I might be a crack smoker but that is how I see it .LOL..
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...if I make a run at 11.3 afr on e85 at 22 psi boost and the dc is in the 117 range and go to the fuel table and add 4 numbers to the table and it goes to 10.7 afr why did that add fuel if they are static?? I ask that because that is what we are doing and it keeps getting richer.
if I'm at 100 dc on the nova and ad 10 numbers to my fuel table it will go to 10.0 afr and slow down a half second or more...
if I'm at 100 dc on the nova and ad 10 numbers to my fuel table it will go to 10.0 afr and slow down a half second or more...
Are u running water/meth injection? I had my 80lbers up 180% Dc and afr was fine. Could I add more fuel and richen it up ......not sure. I'm spraying 2 - 14 jets in a 5.3 at 20psi+. I think that is getting me a little farther. Lol
I'm adding to fuel table 1 when I was running one 380 fuel pump it whould hold good afr to about 13 psi at that point my numbers at 200 kpa and 250 kpa were in the upper 120 range at 6000 rpm I added the second pump and when I made a pass it was super rich above 10 psi boost telling me I was running out of pump and crutching it farther by holding the injector open. so I started pulling fuel 6 numbers at a time until I got back to my 10.9 to 11.3 happy zone. at that point I was about 105% dc after pulling numbers in the fuel table down to about 107 or so in the same 200 and 250 kpa zone.
so in other words I'm at 100% or above but can still ad fuel to a 6.0 until it goes rich enuff to miss at 15 psi boost.
so in other words I'm at 100% or above but can still ad fuel to a 6.0 until it goes rich enuff to miss at 15 psi boost.
TECH Regular
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I'm adding to fuel table 1 when I was running one 380 fuel pump it whould hold good afr to about 13 psi at that point my numbers at 200 kpa and 250 kpa were in the upper 120 range at 6000 rpm I added the second pump and when I made a pass it was super rich above 10 psi boost telling me I was running out of pump and crutching it farther by holding the injector open. so I started pulling fuel 6 numbers at a time until I got back to my 10.9 to 11.3 happy zone. at that point I was about 105% dc after pulling numbers in the fuel table down to about 107 or so in the same 200 and 250 kpa zone.
so in other words I'm at 100% or above but can still ad fuel to a 6.0 until it goes rich enuff to miss at 15 psi boost.
so in other words I'm at 100% or above but can still ad fuel to a 6.0 until it goes rich enuff to miss at 15 psi boost.
tuner studio data log shows d/c and pulse width. and as far as I can tell the engine and injector characteristics are correct. this is not the only car all 5 cars I have tuned with a micro and batch fire will continue to add fuel after 100% d/c all the way to 130% without an issue .
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tuner studio data log shows d/c and pulse width. and as far as I can tell the engine and injector characteristics are correct. this is not the only car all 5 cars I have tuned with a micro and batch fire will continue to add fuel after 100% d/c all the way to 130% without an issue .
well that's the issue being it has 4 pulses per cycle 2 per bank firing batch . throws a curve to the whole duty cycle issue.
if I go to a duty cycle calculator and use 6000 rpm for speed and my pulse width of 12.89 ms it shows 64% roughly half my logged duty cycle.
but what I don't know is that the pulsewidth for eachs pulse of the two or is that the pulse width for both pulses?
if I go to a duty cycle calculator and use 6000 rpm for speed and my pulse width of 12.89 ms it shows 64% roughly half my logged duty cycle.
but what I don't know is that the pulsewidth for eachs pulse of the two or is that the pulse width for both pulses?
talked to a very nice tech guy at efisource and was told that as long as I can add numbers to the fuel table and it gets richer that I am not out of injector yet. he also said the required fuel numbers are a pre set of values and that is where the precieved duty cycle comes from. he said once I max the injector I will not be able to control the afr from slowly going lean at rpm but to make sure the fuel pressure is rising at that time as not to mistake a maxed out injector situation with a maxed fuel pump issue.so just add numbers and fuel pressure until I cant any more then its time for bigger fuel components.