BCNUL8R

iTrader: (2)

Procharged coyote vs procharged LS both motors pushed until catastrophic failure.

ls3fox

Ls FTW

3 window

iTrader: (1)

I’m an LS GUY, but hp/ci earns street credit.

j-mart32

iTrader: (4)

Did they say stock head bolts and that’s why it blew? Jeesh

BCNUL8R

iTrader: (2)

I don't know about street credit when you use it as an excuse for losing. I don't know anything about coyote engines, but from everything I've read apparently they are a lot more expensive to build. Street credit is usually gained by winning with less $$$ invested as you can see by the popularity of junk yard engine racers.

BCNUL8R

iTrader: (2)

Full details of the LS build are in this video and the host even questioned the stock head bolts while the parts were all laid out. They were fine to over 1500 hp at 6500 rpm and would have won with that number. It didn't push water until over 1700 hp way over spinning the blower. Being a competition and not being sure what number to beat they were probably going to keep pushing till it broke either way.

LLLosingit

iTrader: (4)

Not to most people , Max HP is usually king no matter what size the engine is. I would be more impressed if the Coyote didn't have more valves per cylinder and the Coyote fans would prefer they both be the same size engines, Both are capable of making big power but there isn't a way to compare them on equal footing and what do you compare? It's obvious that the Coyote will make more power per CI because of it's valve configuration yet the LS is king at HP per junkyard $, If I were to do it again I wouldn't waste the money building another aftermarket LS, I'd go right to a big cube big block, 600ci or larger.



My cousin has a street driven 70 Camaro with BBC that's over 1,000hp naturally aspirated. He was going to add a blower on it but decided he'd just drive it as is until it needs freshened up then change pistons. He could easily hit 1,500+ A big inch engine through 4" exhaust is music to my ears, No small block compares.

47ford

No replacement for displacement...... but if your broke and have kids a turbo is the next best thing

sxc Z28

LS is superior to the mod motor. Results and crying from the losing side are to be expected.

TT427

iTrader: (1)

That test was broke before it was started. Vastly different engine sizes, using different blowers is a joke and using headbolts lmao just fuqtard brlliance right there. I don't care about engine size it is a direct benefit of the platform imo, just not so different if using different superchargers. Competition proves nothing that way, Whats an F1X or F1A realistic capability? Morris has the X as 1700 on his sight... Twin turbo of 7675 or bigger would make more sense to be a competition of which is better. Not fixed rate limited flow superchargers.

3 window

iTrader: (1)

I agree, they’re obviously not the apples to apples. IMO opinion it’s more impressive to see a 330” engine make 900hp than a 540” engine do it, for example.

jimmyg

They each had 15k to build the engine , blower etc . They had to sleeve the coyote. They could've made it bigger ci , but I'm not sure how much u can with that platform .

LLLosingit

iTrader: (4)

I'm a diehard GM guy, Literally own 5 Chevy trucks and my wife also has her own Silverado and Trailblazer......but the LS in no where near advanced as the mod motor is, If it came down to same cubic inch engines and same blower the mod motor would win every time.
The junkyard LS price plus durability/power and compact size compared to other makes is what made it as popular as it is today, Technology wise it's just a revised small block chevy and not that noteworthy.

If you put 15k into a BBC build you would make quite a bit more power than either of those engine.

BCNUL8R

iTrader: (2)

With a $15g limit for the engine alone that's hardly a junk yard build. We just saw that at the $15g price point the LS is far superior than the coyote. At what price point do you feel that the more advanced coyote catches up to the dinosaur LS?

LLLosingit

iTrader: (4)

I didn't call it a junkyard build lol, I said the LS appeal is it's smaller size and ability to make big power from a junkyard engine. When it comes to actually building the engine in the article there is no way me or you could do it for 15k, It would be closer to 30k when it was all said and done. They did not include machine work costs or labor as part of the budget. The Coyote as has been pointed out on another forum could be built as tested for closer to 20k because the cost to sleeve the block was included in the build. The coyotes heads and valve train are more than capable of making big power with very little work, DOHC 4-valve heads are far superior to pushrod 2-valve heads...there is no doubting that. Yes at 15k and with the rules being what they were the LS was a better engine but again it wasn't because the LS was a superior design it was due to the rules. The coyote also broke before the got a full pull done, It most likely would have still lost but the results would have been closer.
Like I said, I'm a diehard Chevy guy but can't deny that the DOHC 4-valve heads are head and shoulders above the LS design.
If there were no budget and purely set by both engines having to be the same cubic inch then the coyote would have made more power simply because 4-valve heads and 4 cams are really that much better. But then everyone would say it was unfair because the coyote now has the advantage because the LS has 2-valves and pushrods and they would be right!

BCNUL8R

iTrader: (2)

The LS is all I know I'll admit that. I think the simplicity of it has value. The ability for the single guy in a garage to make big power with it for less money has value. The ability to get more cubic inches cheaply has value with over 400 cubic inches being easily obtained on a budget (408 lq block for example).

I don't know how common valve train issues are for the coyote engines at higher horsepower or rpms, but assuming it's not all that uncommon either. Basic stuff like oem timing set, ls7 lifters, and trunnion upgraded rockers proved a simple, effective, budget friendly combo that worked beyond 1550 hp.

The coyote has the head flow advantage which is certainly a big deal, but at what expense? A complicated expensive engine that seems to have valve train reliability issues with big power/rpm?

A couple things could have happened here...first they could have quit around 1600 hp with the LS and won this competition easily and still been running while the coyote was broke well before it ever got close to that number...Or they could have used head studs and made the 1780 hp number and still been running. A lot of what if's I know and the coyote side has some what if's as well. We'll see what happens when they fix the motors and both run the f1a-94. In that scenario I expect the peak numbers to be very close, but the LS to make way more torque at lower rpm while the coyote again wins the power per cubic inch.

I've been beat by a coyote mustang at the track so I respect them. It was my first year back racing after a long hiatus and only owning the car for a year. I'm on a stock bottom end LS1 so not the latest and greatest stuff in the ls world either. Last year was kind of a wake up call as far as how fast everyone is now, but it will just push me to learn and improve.

sxc Z28

So do you want less cubes or more cubes? You cant seem to make up your mind.

The LS has the capability to add cubes at a reasonable price the mod motor doesn't. Those crying CID are really saying lets dumb down the LS to make it a real comp. Think about that.

truckdoug

iTrader: (25)

gotta say that coyote sounds ******* great

LLLosingit

iTrader: (4)

I can't comment specifically on the Coyote durability but have experience with racing microsprints , They run a small 600cc engine so they are able to turn more RPMs but if they can turn over 17,000rpms with DOHC 4-valve head and do it reliably lap after lap then it can be done. OHC heads have been around forever and so have 4-valve heads, They weren't always reliable but as technology has improved so has the reliability and with advent of independent variable valve timing they have the potential to make huge power while being fuel efficient and drivable but will also cost more. If you want to see what money is no object will get you take a look at the Bugatti Chiron's engine , 8L 16 cylinder 4-valve and 2-stage 4 turbo setup. It make 1,500hp and is smooth as butter.

Neither, I have no doubt that the LS can make power cheaper than the Coyote and if you read my posts I said exactly that. Comparing these two engines is like comparing apples to oranges, They both have their pluses and minuses. The DOHC head with 4-valves is a major plus but the ability add cubic inches to the stock block is a huge negative. On the other hand the LS is cheap and durable and compact and makes great power easily. That does not mean it's a better engine by definition. I have a fully forged 408 and the only left stock is the block, Even the main caps are aftermarket, If I had to do it all over again I would probably just spend the same money on a BBC and make considerably more power (almost double the torque) I wouldn't trade my LS engine for 2 coyote engines, They are large not easy to work on and they are made by ford but they deserve respect. Soon enough you'll see GM turning to smaller cubic inch OHC turbo charged engines for all their models.

TT427

iTrader: (1)

That's cuz everyone gets a star a trophy a hug or taken for ice cream anymore for being a loser or coming in second. What's supposed to be "even" or "fair" about 2 completely different platforms? Good point low tech ls needs dumbed down even further... Meanwhile for a few hundred more use the tall deck block and do 474-488 cubes and still be as "small" as the Slowyote. I mean for all the crying it's not like the ls platform was completely taken advantage of here.