Cutting out under WOT in boost areas
9 Second Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 13,616
Likes: 185
From: Norn Iron
mid 12's on very low boost wouldnt be a huge concern, although it isnt the done thing.
9's on any boost is rarely a good idea and could cause issues....especially as some widebands may not be set to actually give values much below a high 9, so it could be significantly richer which WILL cause problems.
9's on any boost is rarely a good idea and could cause issues....especially as some widebands may not be set to actually give values much below a high 9, so it could be significantly richer which WILL cause problems.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Likes: 1
From: Albuquerque, NM
Mid 12's afr is why it would cut out. thats too lean as stated above. As I'm reading the first few posts, I'm in awe that no one asked what your actual afr is.Until JoeNova stepped in. Are you actually logging it with a histogram in HPtuners with a wideband? You keep running that thing lean like that and you'll be picking up pieces of motor off the street! 11.8 is the leanest "safe" afr I'd run below 8 psi. I shoot for 11.5 above 8psi and 11.2 for 12psi and above. .020 gap might be a little on the tight side unless you are running higher boost.
Two most important things that I consider when tuning, correct AFR and not too high of timing.
Two most important things that I consider when tuning, correct AFR and not too high of timing.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Likes: 1
From: Albuquerque, NM
Mid 12 AFR on its own will not cause the "it totally cut out" level of misfire, unless knock control is stepping in and whacking a whole bunch of timing. It's not good, and certainly not recommended long term, but the AFR itself is unlikely to cause that kind of misfire.
On the other hand, he's stated that he's actually getting 9.5-10.8 in boost, which is probably rich enough to cause significant misfiring (or at least smoking like crazy).
On the other hand, he's stated that he's actually getting 9.5-10.8 in boost, which is probably rich enough to cause significant misfiring (or at least smoking like crazy).
first two files are what I logged with the 11.5 AFR. One is a cruising file and the other is the WOT file. No timing retard really from knock retard that I can see. and my knock sensors do work. Now the funny part is, that I made the changes according to my histograms, but I kept the percentage changed to less than the actual readout to try and keep from over shooting.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Likes: 1
From: Albuquerque, NM
So then.... After making the according changes to my tune based on the two logs I just posted, I cruised around for a few to let everything circulate and cycle etc. Then I did two more logs (one cruise and one WOT) and got almost the exact opposite readings as what I did before. Using a Innovate LC-2 using HP Tuners presets for logging. But even this lean.. and its still falling on its face. Now I did notice during the last two logs that my gas level had gone below a 1/4 tank, but I wouldnt see that being too much of an issue? Havent made any more changes since the first itteration this morning, but here is those two files I did last and Ill go ahead and post the tune again for you all to look at, thanks!
Last edited by Soupermn; Aug 16, 2019 at 05:39 PM.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Likes: 1
From: Albuquerque, NM
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Likes: 1
From: Albuquerque, NM
Ahhh gosh, I had the window open too long, so everything I just typed didn't go through, hahaha, computers.
SO, I set my Boost Enrichment to 1.0, my PE I set kind of gradual (as gradual as I could). My MAP enable is set to 75 KPA, throttle position is set to 90%. 0-800 RPM EQ is at 1.16 (12.6 AFR) , 1,200-2,000 RPM I set to 1.21 EQ (about 12.0 AFR) (Split the difference between 16 and 26) and 2,400 RPM + is set for 1.26 EQ (11.57 AFR). Does this seem safe? I have noticed going through all kinds of logs from the past that I have never really gone above 100 KPA below 2400 RPM and its generally around 2800 - 3200 RPM that I go above 100 KPA. Only if I brake boost it can I really see above 100KPA before 2400 RPM column.
Lemme know what you guys think!! I am so happy to have this resource available to me, power of teamwork right?? haha
SO, I set my Boost Enrichment to 1.0, my PE I set kind of gradual (as gradual as I could). My MAP enable is set to 75 KPA, throttle position is set to 90%. 0-800 RPM EQ is at 1.16 (12.6 AFR) , 1,200-2,000 RPM I set to 1.21 EQ (about 12.0 AFR) (Split the difference between 16 and 26) and 2,400 RPM + is set for 1.26 EQ (11.57 AFR). Does this seem safe? I have noticed going through all kinds of logs from the past that I have never really gone above 100 KPA below 2400 RPM and its generally around 2800 - 3200 RPM that I go above 100 KPA. Only if I brake boost it can I really see above 100KPA before 2400 RPM column.
Lemme know what you guys think!! I am so happy to have this resource available to me, power of teamwork right?? haha
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Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Likes: 1
From: Albuquerque, NM
Oh.. the gentleman before had stated to not do the BE just PE. And I'm in positive pressure by 2400 rpm. So wouldn't I want to be at my desired afr by then? Or are you saying do the small ramp up on PE then do the BE one level?
From my understanding reading the descriptions in the tune, is that PE and BE is an either/or function. So whichever one is the richest value, is the one is defaults to. Which would make sense to keep PE safe level that slowly ramps then BE one constant value? Except for higher boost, I guess?
From my understanding reading the descriptions in the tune, is that PE and BE is an either/or function. So whichever one is the richest value, is the one is defaults to. Which would make sense to keep PE safe level that slowly ramps then BE one constant value? Except for higher boost, I guess?
Last edited by Soupermn; Aug 17, 2019 at 01:46 AM.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Likes: 1
From: Albuquerque, NM
Set up two test tunes to try out. One is PE only slowing ramping up a nice smooth transition to full AFR. And the other has a slowly ramping PE and BE is set 0.01 higher.
Last edited by Soupermn; Aug 17, 2019 at 10:48 AM.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Likes: 1
From: Albuquerque, NM
My MAF table is untouched. I am SD tuned so I have never needed to mess with it since it is all disabled. And yes, when I first was driving the truck NA I tuned the VE then just transferred my table to the 2 bar when I upgraded. Had some interesting results today the PE only tune worked... once like a champ, didn't cut out, made it through the gears but was only able to get it the once. Post up here in a bit with the run I did get that was good. I'm getting to the point where I may just revert back to my stock tune, reset everything up and just start with the basics again. There has to be something I fucked with that I dont remember that's bending me over right now.
Revert to stock/OL
And dont mess with anything but the BRAF and tune tune tune the VE until I'm comfortable its repeatable until 100 kpa, then start getting into boost.
Thoughts?
Revert to stock/OL
And dont mess with anything but the BRAF and tune tune tune the VE until I'm comfortable its repeatable until 100 kpa, then start getting into boost.
Thoughts?
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Likes: 1
From: Albuquerque, NM
Right? so here is the one time it "worked" this morning, everything seems decent except I maxed out @ 110kpa.... thats not right lol. so 2ish lbs of boost and i dont cut out... great lol. but here is the tune file and log as promised. I will save this tune in case anybody comes up with an idea. But I will be re doing a factory tune and starting over from scratch. Please let me know what you all think about this new log and tune, and as well if someone would chip in a little later and check out my do over and lemme know what you all think!
if you have fuel then the next thing i'd look at is spark. what plugs and gap? what does a fresh plug look like after a hit? are you logging knock retard?
i'm sorry i cant look at those tunes & logs, looks like youre on the newest version of HPT doesnt play nice with my v3.36
i'm sorry i cant look at those tunes & logs, looks like youre on the newest version of HPT doesnt play nice with my v3.36
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Likes: 1
From: Albuquerque, NM
if you have fuel then the next thing i'd look at is spark. what plugs and gap? what does a fresh plug look like after a hit? are you logging knock retard?
i'm sorry i cant look at those tunes & logs, looks like youre on the newest version of HPT doesnt play nice with my v3.36
i'm sorry i cant look at those tunes & logs, looks like youre on the newest version of HPT doesnt play nice with my v3.36
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Likes: 1
From: Albuquerque, NM
Here is my stock tune file:
Only thing that isn't stock on the file so far is:
BRAF
Injector Control
Knock Recovery rate/Burst
Gear ratio final ratio
Limiter
VATS
PRNDL
will update a little later once I set it up for OL, SD, etc.
Only thing that isn't stock on the file so far is:
BRAF
Injector Control
Knock Recovery rate/Burst
Gear ratio final ratio
Limiter
VATS
PRNDL
will update a little later once I set it up for OL, SD, etc.
9 Second Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 13,616
Likes: 185
From: Norn Iron
But the fact you say you're only seeing 110kpa, or 120kpa.....are you sure the map sensor has been calibrated correctly within your ecu ?
Hang on.....when you're saying 120-140kpa, are you saying that is boost pressure or you're saying it's 20-40kpa above atmosphere (ie NA)??? If you're only making 2 psi of boost no wonder stuffs off. Afr too rich, probably not enough timing and plugs/gap too cold. If 140kpa is boost disregard.