Procharger guys - Help
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 61
Likes: 22
Procharger guys - Help So we just finished the new set up and dropped it off to have it tuned. The set up consists of the following:
- 421ci iron block (made 500rwhp N/A on 91)
- Stock ls3 heads
- fast 102/102
- 1 7/8 headers to cutout
- 6 speed transmission
- NEW D1X head unit with helical gears
- 8" crank pulley and 3.85" head unit pulley (spinning roughly 55,000rpm)
- red race BOV
- 10 rib with "new" auto tensioning bracket
- FMIC
- e85 fuel
- chris1313 dual 525 set up and new PTFE lines (-8an feed and return)
The set up only made 7 psi with no filter on the front of the head unit and 4 psi with a turbo guard on it.
Tuner is very credible and knows his stuff. He checked it over as well and couldn't find any leaks or belt slip. Made 710/650 when it was all said and done.
Anybody have any insight or thoughts on this? What have you guys made with your setups and what do they consist of? Thank you in advance!
- 421ci iron block (made 500rwhp N/A on 91)
- Stock ls3 heads
- fast 102/102
- 1 7/8 headers to cutout
- 6 speed transmission
- NEW D1X head unit with helical gears
- 8" crank pulley and 3.85" head unit pulley (spinning roughly 55,000rpm)
- red race BOV
- 10 rib with "new" auto tensioning bracket
- FMIC
- e85 fuel
- chris1313 dual 525 set up and new PTFE lines (-8an feed and return)
The set up only made 7 psi with no filter on the front of the head unit and 4 psi with a turbo guard on it.
Tuner is very credible and knows his stuff. He checked it over as well and couldn't find any leaks or belt slip. Made 710/650 when it was all said and done.
Anybody have any insight or thoughts on this? What have you guys made with your setups and what do they consist of? Thank you in advance!
Last edited by ws6-formula; May 2, 2023 at 08:49 AM.
I wouldn't worry about a boost number and would only focus on the power numbers. You should be able to make 800 with that blower on e85 though. Big cubic inch motor with good flowing heads and exhaust are going to make more power with lower boost. What are your cam specs? Too much overlap and the wrong valve events could be a problem. What is your peak timing? What is your static compression ratio?
I agree about ignoring a boost number, but dang that badass blower spinning at 55k rpm should be making way north of 800. Yes check for back pressure from intercooler. Also what are cam specs? A dedicated blower cam? If not maybe it's bleeding off boost with excessive overlap? Can you post dyno chart? Any rubber powder residue around the belt and pullies?
My car with a baby cam made over 800 with a standard D1SC spinning around 58k with small ls2 heads, air filter, aster 8 rib belt huge intercooler on 93 pump. You're setup is better on all areas so should be making quite a bit more than mine. Got to figure this out!
My car with a baby cam made over 800 with a standard D1SC spinning around 58k with small ls2 heads, air filter, aster 8 rib belt huge intercooler on 93 pump. You're setup is better on all areas so should be making quite a bit more than mine. Got to figure this out!
Spin it harder and make more power. The X series need to be spun a bit more, slap a 3.4 on there and rev it 7000 RPM. The power level you are at make sense with how hard you are spinning it. The D-1SC makes more midrange power being spun slower, so don't try to compare to that blower.
Nearly impossible to trouble shoot on the internet and it's even less possible without every single detail of the combination. Before I sold my D1x and upgraded to the F1a-94 I was spinning the D1x to 68k so 55k isn't spinning the blower fast enough on that big cubic inch motor.
Last edited by BCNUL8R; May 3, 2023 at 08:12 PM.
It made 500 rwhp N/A and now at only 7 psi of boost on a D1X it's making 710 rwhp, well that lines up with what I would expect to see and doing simple math it checks out also. If you want more power you need more boost, E85 will support whatever you throw at it with that blower so crank it up.
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ketsup please That blower is rated for 1075hp so should be easy 900-1000 rwhp with drive train loss. But it won't get there because there's something wrong with the setup. Tell tale sign was 3 psi loss from a turbo guard? What would happen if you put a real air filter on it?
Comparison with my old setup:
++ 421ci iron block (made 500rwhp N/A on 91) vs 370ci iron block
?? Some cam vs Baby blower cam
++ Stock ls3 heads vs TEA cast LS2 215cc
++ fast 102/102 vs Fast 92
++ 1 7/8 headers to cutout vs 1 7/8 header with full exhaust to bumper
6 speed transmission vs same
-- 8" crank pulley and 3.85" head unit pulley vs 8.65 / 3.85" spinning 62k at 6800
red race BOV vs same
++ NEW D1X head unit with helical gears vs D1SC with helical gears
++ 10 rib with "new" auto tensioning bracket vs 8-rib Aster
-- FMIC vs 6" Shearer Big *** Intercooler
++ e85 fuel vs 93 pump and meth kit
++ No filter vs 90 degree elbow and large cone filter
This setup has 8 power advantages. Only advantages my setup have is the blower was maxed out and maybe the intercooler, yet his setup makes 100hp less with a blower capable of producing 150 hp more?
At 6800 the D1X is spinning 58k with the 3.85". It would take a 3.40" to get to 65k. No way it gains 200-300 hp on a pulley swap. But I'll eat my shoe if it does!
Comparison with my old setup:
++ 421ci iron block (made 500rwhp N/A on 91) vs 370ci iron block
?? Some cam vs Baby blower cam
++ Stock ls3 heads vs TEA cast LS2 215cc
++ fast 102/102 vs Fast 92
++ 1 7/8 headers to cutout vs 1 7/8 header with full exhaust to bumper
6 speed transmission vs same
-- 8" crank pulley and 3.85" head unit pulley vs 8.65 / 3.85" spinning 62k at 6800
red race BOV vs same
++ NEW D1X head unit with helical gears vs D1SC with helical gears
++ 10 rib with "new" auto tensioning bracket vs 8-rib Aster
-- FMIC vs 6" Shearer Big *** Intercooler
++ e85 fuel vs 93 pump and meth kit
++ No filter vs 90 degree elbow and large cone filter
This setup has 8 power advantages. Only advantages my setup have is the blower was maxed out and maybe the intercooler, yet his setup makes 100hp less with a blower capable of producing 150 hp more?
At 6800 the D1X is spinning 58k with the 3.85". It would take a 3.40" to get to 65k. No way it gains 200-300 hp on a pulley swap. But I'll eat my shoe if it does!
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I'd be curious of how low the compression ratio is on this setup as well as the cam specs like stated already. Also, how much timing at WOT?
Built and currently tuning a C6/M6 LSX 427, 9.82:1/D1X/3.4" pulley and it's currently making 12.5 PSI at 6800 rpm(Turbo guard stainless mesh screen). Apples to oranges comparison as this set up has Cathedral port PRC 247 heads/BTR equalizer 1 intake. 10PSI with the A&A dongle/ K&N filter. Will see what is does with the Turbo guard standard (larger hole) screen and 7k RPMS.
Built and currently tuning a C6/M6 LSX 427, 9.82:1/D1X/3.4" pulley and it's currently making 12.5 PSI at 6800 rpm(Turbo guard stainless mesh screen). Apples to oranges comparison as this set up has Cathedral port PRC 247 heads/BTR equalizer 1 intake. 10PSI with the A&A dongle/ K&N filter. Will see what is does with the Turbo guard standard (larger hole) screen and 7k RPMS.
I'm not sure why people are trying to make comparisons to their own combos, it's irrelevant. Between different dynos, differences in engines, etc there is nothing that is relative in that comparison.
The only relative comparison you can make is what his engine made N/A vs what it is making now on only 7 psi of boost. If there was something really wrong (boost leak, intercooler restriction, etc) it would not be a near perfect match doing the math on what 7 psi of boost should do on HIS engine. The most I've ever seen a D1X make (on a standard dynojet with no tricks) was about 950 rwhp and that was overspun slightly with a highly efficient A2W intercooler, and yes I know what they say it's rated at.
Moral of the story, spin it faster and see what happens and go from there because it's making exactly what it should be at only 7 psi of boost and if there was really something wrong you wouldn't see these results.
The only relative comparison you can make is what his engine made N/A vs what it is making now on only 7 psi of boost. If there was something really wrong (boost leak, intercooler restriction, etc) it would not be a near perfect match doing the math on what 7 psi of boost should do on HIS engine. The most I've ever seen a D1X make (on a standard dynojet with no tricks) was about 950 rwhp and that was overspun slightly with a highly efficient A2W intercooler, and yes I know what they say it's rated at.
Moral of the story, spin it faster and see what happens and go from there because it's making exactly what it should be at only 7 psi of boost and if there was really something wrong you wouldn't see these results.
I'm not sure why people are trying to make comparisons to their own combos, it's irrelevant. Between different dynos, differences in engines, etc there is nothing that is relative in that comparison.
The only relative comparison you can make is what his engine made N/A vs what it is making now on only 7 psi of boost. If there was something really wrong (boost leak, intercooler restriction, etc) it would not be a near perfect match doing the math on what 7 psi of boost should do on HIS engine. The most I've ever seen a D1X make (on a standard dynojet with no tricks) was about 950 rwhp and that was overspun slightly with a highly efficient A2W intercooler, and yes I know what they say it's rated at.
Moral of the story, spin it faster and see what happens and go from there because it's making exactly what it should be at only 7 psi of boost and if there was really something wrong you wouldn't see these results.
The only relative comparison you can make is what his engine made N/A vs what it is making now on only 7 psi of boost. If there was something really wrong (boost leak, intercooler restriction, etc) it would not be a near perfect match doing the math on what 7 psi of boost should do on HIS engine. The most I've ever seen a D1X make (on a standard dynojet with no tricks) was about 950 rwhp and that was overspun slightly with a highly efficient A2W intercooler, and yes I know what they say it's rated at.
Moral of the story, spin it faster and see what happens and go from there because it's making exactly what it should be at only 7 psi of boost and if there was really something wrong you wouldn't see these results.
Nic has been around the block a few times and is spot on. As I mentioned earlier in the thread, it just needs to be spun harder. Do not compare to the guy with a different procharger that is spinning it faster or anyone else for that matter. Put the 3.4 on with the right belt, spin it to 7000, and come back with results.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 61
Likes: 22
Hey guys thank you for all the replies! Sounds like it’s not super far off of where it should be. The cam was spec’d for the engine when it was n/a so I suspect that’s a little bit of the issue.
We are currently in the process of building a bad 408 for the car and the Frankenstein m311’s are already at my house ready to be set on that motor when it’s done. Then I will be ordering the pulley to spin the procharger wide open.
You guys think it’s okay to overdoing the d1x? I was going to order a 3.55 which would bring it right to that 62k range.
Regardless, lot of good knowledge and replies here so again, thank you. I will reply with the new numbers when it’s all done!
We are currently in the process of building a bad 408 for the car and the Frankenstein m311’s are already at my house ready to be set on that motor when it’s done. Then I will be ordering the pulley to spin the procharger wide open.
You guys think it’s okay to overdoing the d1x? I was going to order a 3.55 which would bring it right to that 62k range.
Regardless, lot of good knowledge and replies here so again, thank you. I will reply with the new numbers when it’s all done!
It's fine, most overspin by a solid 10% without issue. I am 10% over with an F1A-94 and there are zero signs of the torque falling off at redline so the blower is still efficient there. Just keep an eye out for belt slip but with the 10 rib I doubt you will run into an issue. I still strongly vote for a 3.4 by the way, that blower will take 68k all day.
Why build another motor and not just change the cam and pulley on the blower? That is probably all that is actually needed.
I don't think a cam swap is going to make enough of a difference to even make it worthwhile. The math seems pretty solid on it, just change the pulley and feed it. Those guards block a high percentage of airflow. The math on those, have been done before as well.
A cam swap is easy and could be well worth it especially if you start really pushing the blower. It may not be that bad of a centri cam as they aren't too picky, but without the specs it's hard for anyone to say.
I'd be curious of how low the compression ratio is on this setup as well as the cam specs like stated already. Also, how much timing at WOT?
Built and currently tuning a C6/M6 LSX 427, 9.82:1/D1X/3.4" pulley and it's currently making 12.5 PSI at 6800 rpm(Turbo guard stainless mesh screen). Apples to oranges comparison as this set up has Cathedral port PRC 247 heads/BTR equalizer 1 intake. 10PSI with the A&A dongle/ K&N filter. Will see what is does with the Turbo guard standard (larger hole) screen and 7k RPMS.
Built and currently tuning a C6/M6 LSX 427, 9.82:1/D1X/3.4" pulley and it's currently making 12.5 PSI at 6800 rpm(Turbo guard stainless mesh screen). Apples to oranges comparison as this set up has Cathedral port PRC 247 heads/BTR equalizer 1 intake. 10PSI with the A&A dongle/ K&N filter. Will see what is does with the Turbo guard standard (larger hole) screen and 7k RPMS.