also, a very important reason why i personally am looking at getting an STS is because they are completely smog legal. who wants to have to take off a supercharger or another turbo and have to put it back to stock every 2 years? NOT I! but i didnt look to see where you lived so this may or may not be a problem for you.

 

im stuck in the predicament too.. i was thinkin d1sc, but after reading about the damn leaky head untis, intercooler suckin, then they fixed "all their" issues, i have to admit i was still convinced after reading that i dont really care if they solved their probs. they lost me in the mix, so Bob, iwas told it would (d1sc) have insufficientflow on my 418 build.. i was thinkin the tti 80 race kit... whats the verdict? dammmmmmmmit!

 

Ive made a big thread before on S/C vs Turbo..... and it seems like turbo is a better route. More pwoer on less boost, no belt slippage/oiling, etc. Plus the whoosh sounds way cooler and sounds stock in low RPMs. I dont no if i oculd stand that constant whistle from the D1SC, its rpetty loud. cool, but would get to me after a while. Plus i saw a vid of a D1SC ls1 vs an STS ls1 on same psi and that made my turbo decision a little easier.

 

Check the vid again. The turbo car had gears and some other mods over the blown car.

I've seen stock bottom end, stock head, LS1s put down 575rwhp with a P1SC on pump gas in Arizona.

 

Check it; a guy in our club made 623ish with a P1, g5x3 cam, electric water pump, QTP headers, stock heads (minus springs and pushrods), stock bottom end.... but his car is a freak anyway.... He ran high 10.40s (M6!), and ran all this season (LOTS of passes).... You think that HP is pushing it for a stock bottom end? Well those passes were all made on a stock M6 and stock 10 bolt with DRs.


Since video was mentioned, here's a link to a vid of some passes at MIR from the ls1tech race. It was hot as ***** that day, I got mad sunburn on a frshly shaven head.... VIDEO: http://www.fastrides.com/forums/4048/ShowPost.aspx

That said, I'm still in the turbo crowd...

 

My thoughts (for what they are worth), after having a pot of coffee...

If a large cube engine is going to be used, and an ATI ProCharger were to be used, I would opt for an F series blower. Is it a completely direct bolt on? No, but it isn't that hard to do, and it is capable of propelling you into having to have a 10 point roll cage and a serious chassis build.

I would not use an STS kit for a big cubic inch (over 382 cubes) engine unless you went larger than the GT67 turbo option.

The ATI ProCharger D-1SC is very capable of putting your car into the nines, if your chassis is built to handle the power. KP and others have proven this.

For those people who are going to stay relatively stock, the ATI ProCharger P-1SC is 50 state legal, and is a very good supercharger.

Senses dull with age, and what seems fast for a 40yr old seems slow for a 70yr old... Bob

 

A video should not sway your decision. Waaaay too many factors to be considered.

 

I agree 110%, I was just firming up the point that the previous poster had made...




....and pimping out muh vidz

 

All I gotta do is look at the dynograph's of the two, and turbo becomes the easy choice.

 

tti is what im prolly gonna throw on my build...

 

procharger has been good to me ...my vote is procharger

 

I have one of each basically I am running a pti turbo on one of my trucks and a procharger on the other and The torque comes in fast and sharp with the procharger but as soon as the turbo spools it is right there with it. For top end with the right cam you can't beat a procharger. But you do run out of air with them just as you do with a turbo. However a D1sc would make you pretty happy. You can also do a procharger setup consierably cheaper with less maintence especially with an 'sc blower than you can with a turbo. You won't have to deal with the oiling issues or plumbing. For ease of install go procharger bang for your buck. For something a little more trick go turbo.

 

Both can make great power. I chose Procharger because I don't like the lag of the turbo's. It's all in what kind of powerband you want. I like more low-end to mid-range power that's why I said SC and the fastest car I've been in was Procharged and I loved it, instant power and pulled hard through the powerband.

 

The lag of turbo's? HUGE misconception... I can't believe some people still believe this.

This has been discussed so many times... There is NO WAY an ATI or Vortech will peak out their power earlier than a normal sized turbo. I've been seeing too many dynographs lately. Peak boost at redline vs. peak boost at ~2500-4500 rpms... How is the former going to make more power lower in the RPM range than the latter? No one has proved this possible. Even when comparing to rear-mount, the rear mount turbo provides more torque and SOONER.

The LS1 Magnacharger, being a Roots, DOES make sweet curves and DOES peak out some sweet torque down low, but not for the F-body unfortunately (Well, without some rigging)... and I hear they run out of breath early (only good for ~500 rwhp).

I love blowers, I'd buy the Procharger myself, but come on... everyone has to know what they have... Of all our FI set-ups for LS1's, ATI/Vortech need the highest RPM's for their power than STS and the front-mount turbo's... unless maybe you're runnin a 100+ sized turbo on a 346 stock displacement or something.

 

I've been in some turbo cars and all I'll say is that when the gas was mashed there was lag, from personal experience. It's hard to call it a misconception if I've felt it myself. I understand that different sized turbos and blowers with different amounts of boost will act differently but this is just what I've experienced.

 

I'm not going to start posting 15 dynographs like I did in another thread a week ago discussing this with another Procharger guy. The title of that thread looked like this one, containing the words "turbo" and Procharger" I believe. It was some good reading to clear this up. Look it up if you have time.

Bottom line... I don't know how you can possibly, on a street LS1, screw up a set-up that you can feel what you felt. Nonetheless, the "average" turbo set-up makes FULL BOOST at ~3200 RPM. All ATI's make full boost at redline. Now, for an FI LS1 motor relying on boost for its power over 300 rwhp, how in God's green earth will the ATI have more power lower in the RPM range? I've been in Procharged LS1's myself. Fast! No doubt, but LAG all the way to redline, totally linear LAG, just gradual. The turbo comes on quicker when it does, A GOOD THING. Therefore, the point where it comes on and wasn't on before that is what you might be feeling as LAG because it gets your attention, even though the ATI is lagging all the way to redline, but it's gradual and you think the ATI has no lag, thus, the misconception I was referring to. I'm not against blowers at all. It's be nice if we finally got a Kenne Bell or something for our F-body's one day.

 

Turbo=higher RWHP
Turbo=better MPG
Turbo=no parasitic loss of HP
Turbo=no belt slippage
Turbo=less maintenance
Turbo=nothing beats its sound when its spooling

 

bboyferal...finally i've seen some one realy expain the diffrence between power and spool time/boost, thats kinda ther reason im goin with a turbo right now i'l have 10psi at 3200 insted or 3 in a pro charged car...and thats not to much lag cuz with a stall converter dont u leave the line at about ur stall speed soo thats prety much no lag..just traction problems haha...butg i do like blowers soo my dads car has a ATI on it and its a fun to drive cant wait to race him with my car soon

 

Check out what I made with less... Clicky

Hairdryers are for women. :p

 

The P1 is your SC's little brother. What will be impressive is if you can keep yours together as long.