Went to the dyno..
08-11-2006, 02:08 PM
#22
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When my old 422ci NA setup had crank problems it was the reluctor wheel free wheeling on the crankshaft. The crank sensor is designed to monitor the speed of the teeth on the reluctor wheel. So if the reluctor wheel moved out of range, the pcm would receive a weird count (measurement, whatever), and then shut off. The result would be continued fueling but with no spark... So there would be a big backfire. Sometimes the car would still be running but not most of the time.
If I were you, I'd get a set of TR7's, gap them at .027-.030, and get a set of truck coils and wires. Might solve the problem if it's ignition, and you can take it off your list. You should run truck coils anyway if you are shooting for high HP numbers.
If I were you, I'd get a set of TR7's, gap them at .027-.030, and get a set of truck coils and wires. Might solve the problem if it's ignition, and you can take it off your list. You should run truck coils anyway if you are shooting for high HP numbers.
08-11-2006, 02:26 PM
#23
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Originally Posted by Pro Stock John
If I were you, I'd get a set of TR7's, gap them at .027-.030, and get a set of truck coils and wires. Might solve the problem if it's ignition, and you can take it off your list. You should run truck coils anyway if you are shooting for high HP numbers.
Educate me. Truck coils have a hotter spark?
08-11-2006, 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted by DarkblueTA
Educate me. Truck coils have a hotter spark?
Both are more than enough for 1000 hp...
To put it into perspective, the mod motor COP setups are only 25 mj, and they push over 800+ hp with no problems.
08-11-2006, 09:49 PM
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Originally Posted by MIGHTYMOUSE
ok so on the way home from dinner i turned off he cam sync error test and first time on it the car didn't backfire. that is good 
but i would still like to know why i got the error and what I can do to correct it.
but i would still like to know why i got the error and what I can do to correct it.Not much you can do if the falling edges are close together except advancing cam or switching to external reluctor wheel like mine and then you have infinite adjustment.
But if it works, who cares?
08-12-2006, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by MIGHTYMOUSE
i had to set my cop to 364 to get my bs3 timing value to match actual timing measured at the crankshaft
I think when the gap is too close either way is when people are running into problems with the cam sync error stuff...only 4 degs of separation is probably the culprit.
If you do the bs3 procedure on finding the COP value, at what point does your cam signal go to zero in relation to TDC and where does your crank signal go to zero in relation to TDC also.
For example, my cam falls off right at TDC and my crank falls off at 6 degrees aTDC so I put 354 into the COP cell.
08-12-2006, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by MIGHTYMOUSE
i just put the cop at the value that put the actual timing = target timing advance in bs3.
08-12-2006, 02:31 PM
#32
I've had the same problem with my bs3. my crank angle was 364 also. John told me to override the cam sync test and it should fix the problem. it does fix the problem to a point.
it is my understanding that the cam sync is needed to sync the injection up with the number one cylinder. as soon as this syncs up on starting, it is not needed anymore. my car loses the signal at around 4500 rpms and backfires too. the band aid for this is to start the car, THEN override the cam sync test. it's a pain in the butt, but it works. that way you allow the crank and cam to sync up, but you don't let it have the chance to screw things up on a pass or dyno pull later.
if I simply start the car with the cam sync test already ovrerridden, sometimes it doesn't run right. sometimes it's sluggish and no cam lope tells me that I need to turn the override off, let the cam sync and then turn the override back on. if the cam was out of sync when you do this, the engine and tach will shut off for a split second and then come right back on. the car will then run properly with the cam sync test overridden untill you shut the ingition switch off.
the cam will be degreed this time and I am hoping that this will solve my problems with this.
it is my understanding that the cam sync is needed to sync the injection up with the number one cylinder. as soon as this syncs up on starting, it is not needed anymore. my car loses the signal at around 4500 rpms and backfires too. the band aid for this is to start the car, THEN override the cam sync test. it's a pain in the butt, but it works. that way you allow the crank and cam to sync up, but you don't let it have the chance to screw things up on a pass or dyno pull later.
if I simply start the car with the cam sync test already ovrerridden, sometimes it doesn't run right. sometimes it's sluggish and no cam lope tells me that I need to turn the override off, let the cam sync and then turn the override back on. if the cam was out of sync when you do this, the engine and tach will shut off for a split second and then come right back on. the car will then run properly with the cam sync test overridden untill you shut the ingition switch off.
the cam will be degreed this time and I am hoping that this will solve my problems with this.
08-14-2006, 07:34 AM
#34
any new info guys?
maybe my misfire thing is my crank getting out from my cam and my injectors and plugs are firing at the wrong time, causing my power drop off
i'll have to do one pass on the dyno with the synch on and one with the synch overrided and see if a clean pass with it on is worth more hp than off or something.
maybe my misfire thing is my crank getting out from my cam and my injectors and plugs are firing at the wrong time, causing my power drop off
i'll have to do one pass on the dyno with the synch on and one with the synch overrided and see if a clean pass with it on is worth more hp than off or something.
08-14-2006, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by sr71
I've had the same problem with my bs3. my crank angle was 364 also. John told me to override the cam sync test and it should fix the problem. it does fix the problem to a point.
it is my understanding that the cam sync is needed to sync the injection up with the number one cylinder. as soon as this syncs up on starting, it is not needed anymore. my car loses the signal at around 4500 rpms and backfires too. the band aid for this is to start the car, THEN override the cam sync test. it's a pain in the butt, but it works. that way you allow the crank and cam to sync up, but you don't let it have the chance to screw things up on a pass or dyno pull later.
if I simply start the car with the cam sync test already ovrerridden, sometimes it doesn't run right. sometimes it's sluggish and no cam lope tells me that I need to turn the override off, let the cam sync and then turn the override back on. if the cam was out of sync when you do this, the engine and tach will shut off for a split second and then come right back on. the car will then run properly with the cam sync test overridden untill you shut the ingition switch off.
the cam will be degreed this time and I am hoping that this will solve my problems with this.
it is my understanding that the cam sync is needed to sync the injection up with the number one cylinder. as soon as this syncs up on starting, it is not needed anymore. my car loses the signal at around 4500 rpms and backfires too. the band aid for this is to start the car, THEN override the cam sync test. it's a pain in the butt, but it works. that way you allow the crank and cam to sync up, but you don't let it have the chance to screw things up on a pass or dyno pull later.
if I simply start the car with the cam sync test already ovrerridden, sometimes it doesn't run right. sometimes it's sluggish and no cam lope tells me that I need to turn the override off, let the cam sync and then turn the override back on. if the cam was out of sync when you do this, the engine and tach will shut off for a split second and then come right back on. the car will then run properly with the cam sync test overridden untill you shut the ingition switch off.
the cam will be degreed this time and I am hoping that this will solve my problems with this.
08-15-2006, 09:48 AM
#36
i managed to slide in a few minutes with jonh this morning on the phone
he said if you are running the synch correction you will get a backfire while the computer finds the first crank tooth again, but after that power should be as good as usual.
he said if you have sync overrided then it will not backfire but if a crank tooth gets missed, then your injector and ignition timing will be retarded for the remainder of the run, and get worse the more teeth are missed on the crank
said this normally happens around 4k on an ls1 due to a harmonic
also said it could certainly be caused by my loose timing chain, or a retarded camshaft
i'm going to dyno soon, maybe saturday where i do back to back with synch off and then on, and if it makes more power with synch on (and deal with the backfire) then will look at replacing the timing chain or revise sensor location
he said if you are running the synch correction you will get a backfire while the computer finds the first crank tooth again, but after that power should be as good as usual.
he said if you have sync overrided then it will not backfire but if a crank tooth gets missed, then your injector and ignition timing will be retarded for the remainder of the run, and get worse the more teeth are missed on the crank
said this normally happens around 4k on an ls1 due to a harmonic
also said it could certainly be caused by my loose timing chain, or a retarded camshaft
i'm going to dyno soon, maybe saturday where i do back to back with synch off and then on, and if it makes more power with synch on (and deal with the backfire) then will look at replacing the timing chain or revise sensor location
08-15-2006, 10:35 AM
#37
Originally Posted by sr71
it is my understanding that the cam sync is needed to sync the injection up with the number one cylinder. as soon as this syncs up on starting, it is not needed anymore. my car loses the signal at around 4500 rpms and backfires too. the band aid for this is to start the car, THEN override the cam sync test. it's a pain in the butt, but it works. that way you allow the crank and cam to sync up, but you don't let it have the chance to screw things up on a pass or dyno pull later.
if I simply start the car with the cam sync test already ovrerridden, sometimes it doesn't run right. sometimes it's sluggish and no cam lope tells me that I need to turn the override off, let the cam sync and then turn the override back on. if the cam was out of sync when you do this, the engine and tach will shut off for a split second and then come right back on. the car will then run properly with the cam sync test overridden untill you shut the ingition switch off.
if I simply start the car with the cam sync test already ovrerridden, sometimes it doesn't run right. sometimes it's sluggish and no cam lope tells me that I need to turn the override off, let the cam sync and then turn the override back on. if the cam was out of sync when you do this, the engine and tach will shut off for a split second and then come right back on. the car will then run properly with the cam sync test overridden untill you shut the ingition switch off.
08-15-2006, 10:35 AM
#38
oops forgot to add this.
did you find that your commanded and actual ignition timing did not match before?
Originally Posted by Boostaholic
Well I changed the COP and it revs in my driveway now, I'll test drive it on the street when traffic dies down a bit.
