02 SOM SS

Saturday I got the TCI Competition Series 4200 2.85 installed. Guess what.....initial impressions from those who rode in the car before and after including myself is that it is much more efficient. The converter that came out was a Yank PT4500 2.5, which I liked obviously, but it had some issues I already found not to be present in the TCI. Plus the Yank was a borrow deal. Thanks Loco.

Now the good stuff.

The TCI in probably 20 miles has not had lock up issues at all. In fact, it locks very fast and smoothly. I waited for it to lock at speed and then tried to see how much throttle it would take before it unlocked, and I was shocked. Also, it has not had a single shutter what so ever.

Based on some friends being in the car with the Yank, the unsolicited responce was thet the car felt stronger. Maybe due to the efficiency of the TCI, or also the lower stall. TCI took their CS4500 and tightened it up a few hundred, which in my case has seemingly proven to be the hot set up. On the street it is noticably tighter than the Yank was, but in the same token it hits like mad if you stall it at all.

I'm not by any means downing Yank, plus I'm a fat verter newbie. I just like the feeling and smoothness the TCI has shown in just a few hours of messing around. The proof will be at the track, where we'll see if the seat of the pants was correct or not.

Just some FYI <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="gr_images/icons/cool.gif" />

<small>[ February 11, 2003, 10:02 PM: Message edited by: 02 SOM SS ]</small>

2001 Pewter WS6

iTrader: (43)

Can't wait to see how it does. Keep us posted.

02 SOM SS

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by 2001 Pewter WS6:
<strong> Can't wait to see how it does. Keep us posted. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I will for sure. My next track session will be at SLP Customer Appreciation Day in Ennis Tx. next weekend.

Side Note...My best time is with TM killing my 2-3 shift bad. I think there is at least 2 tenths still in the ECM, which I'm having Ed Wright handle tomorrow.

I just want to see how it 60's. My previous best 60 on Hoosier 26x9.0x15 was 1.60 with bone stock suspension minus sway bar.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

<small>[ February 09, 2003, 12:11 PM: Message edited by: 02 SOM SS ]</small>

Colonel

"I waited for it to lock at speed and then tried to see how much throttle it would take before it unlocked, and I was shocked."

That is a matter of PCM programming only (clutch slippage withstanding.) You can make it stay locked at %100 throttle if you want.

SuperZ28

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Colonel:
<strong> "I waited for it to lock at speed and then tried to see how much throttle it would take before it unlocked, and I was shocked."

That is a matter of PCM programming only (clutch slippage withstanding.) You can make it stay locked at %100 throttle if you want. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">OK, time for my stupid question of the day....if an A4 makes more power with the converter locked, is there a way, either by PCM or a lockup switch, to keep the converter locked when you race during WOT? if so, is there any downside to do this?

hope that makes sense <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

finalymodded

part of your question is answered in the reply above yours and the rest would have to be the torque multi would be less. Newbie answer here tho. I am sure if i am wrong someone will jump in. Believe me if you want some one to post on your post just say something wrong. lol

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

SuperZ28

good point, I guess I had a brain fart and missed it <img border="0" alt="[bang head]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_banghead.gif" />

I guess my real question would be is there any extra strain on the tranny by locking it up during WOT? I would assume if it's easy and safe to do, a lot of A4 would do so and get the extra 15-20 rwhp that can be had by locking the converter....

Kevin Winstead

Super,
That's not a stupid question at all. Many racers do lock their converter at WOT. The downside is that this really takes it's toll on your torque converter clutch. You can order a high stall converter with a larger diameter clutch or multiple clutches and will be able to safely lock your converter at WOT. It's usually worth .1-.2 tenths and 2-4 mph through the quarter.
Take Care,
Kevin

Loco

Good luck Kurt. If your TCI gets better results than my Yank TP, I'm selling my Yank and getting a TCI. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> This will be a perfect comparison btw the Yank and TCI. Post the results. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="gr_images/icons/cool.gif" />

<small>[ February 11, 2003, 06:00 PM: Message edited by: Loco ]</small>

2000SILVERTA

I just got my TCI CS4400(4500). All I can say is this thing rocks. No probs whatsoever yet. Track times coming in 1.5 weeks, I cant wait!

I might have to try this converter lockup trick too. Sounds very interesting..............

SuperZ28

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Kevin Winstead:
<strong> Super,
That's not a stupid question at all. Many racers do lock their converter at WOT. The downside is that this really takes it's toll on your torque converter clutch. You can order a high stall converter with a larger diameter clutch or multiple clutches and will be able to safely lock your converter at WOT. It's usually worth .1-.2 tenths and 2-4 mph through the quarter.
Take Care,
Kevin </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">thanks for the info...I was under the impression that the extra stress would be put on the tranny, not the converter....
So if I was going to do this, would I need to send my converter back for a rebuild?

thanks again
Alex

2001 Pewter WS6

iTrader: (43)

Kevin, Is the Competition 4400 converter built for this?

02 SOM SS

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Colonel:
<strong> "I waited for it to lock at speed and then tried to see how much throttle it would take before it unlocked, and I was shocked."

That is a matter of PCM programming only (clutch slippage withstanding.) You can make it stay locked at %100 throttle if you want. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I wish I had any kind of programming at all to accomplish that. I just as of yeaterday got Ed Wright's program. No real diff in lock up holding ability at all. The Yank came unglued at any press of the throttle. This one will hold alot longer before unlocking.

Is this something I should have Ed reprogram into the PCM? I never though of asking him.
Over.... <img border="0" alt="[evil]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_devil.gif" />

Is this cool with the competition series verter Kevin? I'm going back to Ed tomorrow. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

<small>[ February 11, 2003, 09:13 PM: Message edited by: 02 SOM SS ]</small>

broke7

Im in the market for a verter. Although I have 2.73's. Im not too worried about the "loose" feel as long as it performs under WOT. Would the CS4200 be OK for me?

I am going to be spraying a 100 shot right now on a basically bolt on 99 Z-28 a4, although I am going all motor setup later on this year w/ s2 heads and cam.

Inputs?

Who has the best price on the 4200?

Kevin Steele

Broke7,
I recommend the SSF3500 for your application. It'll pick you up nicely on motor and on N2O as well. It'll work even better once you do the heads/cam package.

SuperZ28, 2001Pewter, 02 SOM SS,
We don't recommend locking the standard competition converter at WOT, because of the additional stress on the lockup clutch. We're looking at offering a WOT large diameter clutch as an option.

Kevin
TCI Automotive

broke7

Thanks for the advice.

The 3500 is the 2.5 STR correct. Someone else had mentioned that verter also as a good.

Sorry for highjacking the thread.

Plum Crazy Rob

iTrader: (3)

The point that the converter comes unlocked when you're pressing on the gas on a stock computer has nothing to do with the converter itself...its a setting in the PCM based on throttle/load/speed (and can be changed with LS1edit, or Ed Wrong can do it) - You're probably now at a differnt point in the table now because of the differences in stall.

hope that helps!

02 SOM SS

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Plum Crazy Rob:
<strong> The point that the converter comes unlocked when you're pressing on the gas on a stock computer has nothing to do with the converter itself...its a setting in the PCM based on throttle/load/speed (and can be changed with LS1edit, or Ed Wrong can do it) - You're probably now at a differnt point in the table now because of the differences in stall.

hope that helps! </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I disagree. I had no programming whatsoever when I swapped converters. I don't disagree with the logic of how the lockup is controlled by the computer, but my opinion and experiences I posted in this thread where not changes after I had any programming done. The TCI held lock much much better in town, driving normally, then the Yank did. Also, the TCI has had zero shutter problems, again, no changes or any programming whatsoever in the computer when this became apparent on the first 10 minutes of driving.

I'm sure I'm not the only person to attest to these differences between verter manufacturers. I am not trying to say that I can almost full lock the verter at WOT or even close, I'm simply stating that for daily driving, without any change via programming or any programming at all for that matter, that there is a noticable difference in the manners of there two verters. I happen to like the difference's enough to share them.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

Colonel

The computer controls the converter lockup command...period. The converter has NOTHING to do with that decision making (it doesn't *think*.)

But...the converter can physically slip. This is not to say that the converter clutch isn't still in the engaged position, it's just that the clutch can't physically hold the strain without slipping. From this we can also get the infamous converter shutter though it doesn't necessarily have to shutter to be slipping. A change of converter can certainly cure this problem.

The PCM is programmed for converter lockup by gear and throttle position v/s MPH. Anyone who has played around with it on LS1Edit can attest to that.

<small>[ February 14, 2003, 10:16 AM: Message edited by: Colonel ]</small>

Bear

iTrader: (1)

I don't want to hijack this thread, but I have a TCS Phoenix 4400 stall w/2.7 str being installed as we speak. I currently run a Vig 3600 so I am expecting a world of difference between the two, both in drivability and performance. I expect to see some more looseness, but I am hoping to gain 2-3 MPH on the top end. I think we should try to keep some type of record of all these NEW 4400 vertors that are more efficient and such. Good Luck with the TCI. I got this from Mikey at Rapid Motorsports. I am a Guinnea Pig of sorts. Oh Well. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />