Tainted

iTrader: (9)

this makes 0 sense to msot of us. i aint ehard about a gen 6 yet.

links pics confirmed yes or no?

97ta383

iTrader: (5)

I do agree that the reason people buy a car like a camaro ss is for that v8 feel and sound. No doudt GN were wicked and i love the turbo 6 but not in a camaro or vette if they want to make a car like that do it with a different car. I think it would be cool to have a turbo 6 as an option though like in the 350 to 380hp range and 2 v8s first in the 450 to 480hp range the big one in the 550hp. With all this new tech why cant they make the v8s more efficent with direct injection or somthing. So yea pretty much a camaro isnt a camaro without a v8 in the line up if gm doesnt feel the same they should just kill it off again imo.

johnlv6

iTrader: (3)

I can't imagine that government motors has done much thinking on a replacement for the current Camaro when it took them ~seven years to pop out a replacement for the 4th gen.

JD_AMG

1.) I don't think a turbo V6 would fit under the hood of a cobalt size car (consider the turbo(s), piping, intercooler(s) and the extra bulk from it being DOHC...) An LSx type engine would be smaller, lighter, cheaper and just as powerful.
2.) Good luck getting the car to cost $25,000 with a 400hp+ turbo 6. Take a look at what kind of power cars in the $20-30K range make...

Now not to swing on the nuts of the designers, but they are only working with what they have. GM doesn't currently have the money for a whole new platform like that, let alone a whole new (expensive) engine and drive train.

I agree, and thats exactly why GM has stuck with their pushrod V8s, they are smaller, lighter, and cheaper than the OHC engines they compete against while also making more power.
There is a reason you see people swapping in LSx's in every car now adays instead of the other way around.
Below is a picture of the VQ35 (Nissan 3.5L V6) next to an LS2. Do you see what Im saying now?

Giddswat

iTrader: (13)

I was just stirring the pot a little.
I do think that weight reduction will be the next factory performance goal, and direct injection will be a big player in the next few years.

That is a cool picture of the Nissan V6 and the LS motors, that Nissan motor looks like ****.

Birdcountry02

It sounds like you described in the first paragraph what Dodge was trying to do with the SRT-4. I don't believe the automakers can squeeze not only 425 hp into a compact car with only 2800 lbs, but do it for 25k and give a factory warranty on top of it. On paper, yes it sounds like a good idea, but turning that into something in the real worlds probably not possible. Also think about all the safety standards, EPA standards and all the other bullshit requirements they have to meet. GM is already ahead of the curve offering a V6 with a power and mileage combo. Look how Ford's scrambling to try and outdo it because of how well its percieved in the publics eye, and Dodge is completly in the dust in this one probably never catching up. Remember, it's a Camaro. Not a Camaro STI or Camaro Evolution. The car has a heritage, and that's what people will want from it.
Dodge is one of the only ones that comes to mind that had a car with a heritage, threw it out the window and still made a great seller out of it (Charger) Why butcher the new Camaro by trying something new and maybe hitting or maybe missing horribly? GM is keeping Buick solely for its sales in China(from what I can understand), why not try and make that unappealing brand something to want by offering a 2012 Buick Grand National? Then again, thats all my opinion. Sorry for the long *** post

Tainted

iTrader: (9)

i think whatever the future holds they better start shaving off weight. it doesnt matter how much power you add if they keep adding more **** to weigh it down

Birdcountry02

True. Look at the Challenger. That pig needs a diet bad. Especially since the 2010 Mustang will have similar hp and probably like 300-500 lbs less

UltraZLS1

iTrader: (13)

From the looks of the sales they do not need to do anything different.

Selling over 100k cars in a year, in an economy like this, is nothing short of amazing.

JL ws-6

iTrader: (50)

First thing they need to do with the camaro, is put a solid 12 bolt axle in it and ditch the POS IRS. That's #1, #2 they need to stop putting 14 computers in the car, ditch the drive by wire and all the other computrized crap, That alone will pull 200 lbs out of the car, and make it easy to work on. The use of alum or carbon body panels, also would be a good move.

Camaro Junky

What he said ^

Darksol

Are you aware not everyone buys a Camaro to go down a 1/4 mile and some want to enjoy the ride on the road? IRS is perfect for 98% of buyers who won't spent all of their free time modding and worrying about dialing in a solid axle. And somehow I doubt the lines of code needed to control a throttle by wire set up is very heavy. I would blame things like the onstar system and the comical 21 inch wheels. And I'm sure a Camaro made of carbon fiber or aluminum would be cost effective.

JL ws-6

iTrader: (50)

I forgot one other thing, brakes that will clear a 15 inch wheel front and rear. If the smaller diameter doesn't give the needed braking capability, put another piston in the caliper! The 21 inch wheels are fine, they leave us room for a 30 inch drag radial or a 29.5 slick, that's fine, wheel cutouts are perfect sized... they just need to put a brake on that will clear the average 15 inch drag rim. Hell put 2 small calipers on if that's what's needed to get the desired braking.

99Tara, I have a couple contacts at GM, and one thing that they have gotten alot of flack about IS THE IRS. People DON'T WANT IT. They had it on a gto and have it on the vette, this car, from what the GM contact I have told me... is what the public wants so they can go have fun, beat it up, etc, and not worry about it BREAKING. And the public, also wants to MOD it and make more power.

That's what his general consensus was, and that's coming from someone in GM racing... I think he has a pretty good handle on what the publie wants.

Cheaper price, a solid axle (12 bolt), and not so much in the computer department.. they want an available cloth seat stripper, with the biggest motor that GM can stuff in it.

Sure the lower end cars will always sell, but from the performance side, that's what the publie wants.

Look @ ford, they put the IRS in the 03 and 04 cobra only to dump it as soon as the new body style came out. Think about it... they wouldn't have tossed all that R&D if it was what people wanted.

JD_AMG

Or better yet just change out the brakes since you are going backwards on the engineering put into the car by drag racing it anyway.
The Camaro is now designed as a world class car, not a boring strait-line-only car. If you want to make it into a one trick pony go right ahead, but don't bitch at the engineers for making it good at performing more than just in a strait line.

Funny, its seems one of the only things the Mustang gets flack about now-adays is the fact it doesn't have IRS, while its competitors do.
Worry about breaking? Like the stock solid axles in the 4th gens? No thanks, give me a properly designed IRS any day of the week. So far its lasted with WAY more power than the 10 bolt ever has.

Im going to highly disagree. Maybe some of the hardcore drag racing community wants that, but everyone else would rather have better ride and handling with IRS.

A weak attempt and a poor example of an IRS. Ford went back to a solid axle because of cost.

Darksol

If the damn thing didn't weigh 4000lbs it wouldn't need the huge breaks.

This makes no sense to me as the Corvette rears don't get swapped out for 12 bolts. Sounds like the IRS is fine as long as its well designed and the car isn't pushing 2 tons so hard.

I somehow doubt the guy in G.M. racing is aware of what is working for dealers, focus groups, and the people who will be driving this car on a daily basis. Why would he? Hes in racing not sales.

Sounds like a drag pac is a better choice here rather than a solid axle in every car. I don't doubt some would sell but not at the pace the current version is.

Again I point to the vette and then to the current Cobra. Which one is selling better??

The zeta platform is designed from the get-go as a IRS platform. Changing it for one car in North America would have made no sense and it would not have helped get the car out any faster and it took long enough to come out. But if the guy in G.M. racing thinks it makes sense, maybe he should ask Scott Settlemire? He has a better feel of what the public wants I would think.

JL ws-6

iTrader: (50)

Think what ya want, there's a 12 bolt/solid axle coming in the near future, may hit this model, may wait for the next revision, but it's gonna be back in the car. When it happens I'll dig this thread back up and make a point that I told ya so.

oddwraith

iTrader: (1)

Yeah not everybody drag races their car, and EVERYBODY who buys a new Camaro is going to appreciate the new IRS as a daily driver. I believe most of them are destined as daily drivers first, then drag cars etc second. From what I've heard the new SS handles great and is no longer the laughing stock of the world community when it comes to handling. Fourth gens weren't terrible at handling but they were nowhere near as crafty in slalom etc. A "track pack" would be a great addition to the 2011 camaro as an "option". Much like on the new stangs, and they do quite well performance wise with that option box ticked apparently. The GT500 was criticized for having a live axle instead of irs as well. Depends on what you want, but technology sells, and so does a well rounded vehicle imo.

Rodimus_Prime

The eco boost v6 is coming to the mustang and likely at power levels higher than the new 5.0 is making. Most of you are stuck living in the past, V8s are not the way of the future. Let us also not forget that the fastest f-body ever made until the slp firehawk was in fact a turbo 1989 V6 Trans Am. It took GM 13+ years to make a V8 powered car run the same speed as an engine basically unchanged from 1986.

I'll take my turbo V6 over almost any V8 powered Trans Am because its faster and in most cases BY FAR. Hell theres 4 cylinders GM makes now that have comparable numbers to the LS1 in HP and torque. Some of my friends with cobalts are making close to 400whp/420ish tq with little more than exhausts and tunes. The only thing a V8 has that's desirable anymore is sound.

Dont get me wrong theres almost nothing I want more than a 2010 Camaro SS but theres no way in hell it needs to be 3800lbs

oddwraith

iTrader: (1)

I disagree so much that I don't know where to start. In fact, I won't waste my time on this one. To each their own

Rodimus_Prime

A Camaro made in 2010 should not weigh 3800lbs, maybe in 1980 I could see it. I'd rather see a V6 Turbo Camaro, than no Camaro at all, which is the reality if its V8 only. As long as its packing a punch I dont see what the problem is. Besides even the V6 model thats in there now outpowers everything made from about 1975-1992. If your going to talk about heritage, I don't think theres much to say for about half the cars history. I don't care how great it sounds a Carbed 350 cranking out 200hp is pathetic in any era.