LWCS561

iTrader: (1)

I think the avg of each is gonna be between 12.8 and 13.2...take each motor is different, with a few different amounts in hp, plus driver, and all the techical differences in each run, and i think thats what youll see. car and driver's seems a little more realistic..imo

MannyO

I agree. The only thing I was blown away with was them claiming that the New 5.0 would dominate the Shelby Mustang that is priced at 50k. Thats like an SS pimp smacking around a Vette. I'm talking about stock. So people don't get all crazy with the mod's list.

enginjoe

iTrader: (11)

If the runs weren't on the same day with the same driver, then any comparison must be taken with a grain of salt.

Facts are the Mustang is lighter, has better gearing and has around the same power as the Camaro. On the same day at the same track, with the same driver, it will win against the SS.

Now, when the modding starts we'll see what happens...

rayhawk

Another thing to remember is that the performance testing is being done with the 3.73 rear end on the Mustangs, but of course, they will not all come with that gear. I am curious to see how much of a difference there is between the 3.23 and the 3.73 gear equipped Mustang. Not that Ford will ever give a 3.23 car to a magazine anyway, I guess we have to wait until they hit the street.

big dave

Owning both an lt1 and ls1 f-body, I can still say I'm not a GM loyalist. I believe in getting the most bang for my buck. Back in the late 80s and early 90s, I was a mustang fan. When I bought my lt1 back in '95, it offered the best bang for my buck. Now, I think the new stang will have the upper hand...both power wise and performance wise.

I'm still struggling to like the new camaro, from certain angles something just doesn't look right. The new stang and challenger pull off the retro theme much better IMO.

As for performance, I think the mustang will hand the new camaro it's ****...Someone here said that he isn't concerned about how it handles and how the interior looks. You'll be surprised how many people get swayed one way or another just by one small detail.



As for how the mustang responds to bolt-ons, we'll have to wait and see. I'm just glad that ford stepped up to the plate when it had to. They didn't abandon it's pony car fans the way gm did after '02. THAT left an extremely bad taste in my mouth.

Ford may not have had the fastest cars out there in the years the camaro/firebird were gone but, who were they competing against? Now they have a war back on it's hands and it looked like they showed up well armed.

What will chevy do to respond? They better hurry because it looks like the performance revolution may be short lived. The next generation cars may have to depend on v6s and turbos to make their power...maybe even hybrids.

I, for one, am happy the war is back on. It's like the 90s - 2000s all over again.

old_goat

Outside of owning a G8 GXP versus what you own, I swear I could have written this. I feel the exact same way, and I did own a 1987 and 1989 5.0 Mustang.

bww3588

iTrader: (49)

of course ford is going to have the upper hand, it got a redesign after the Camaro. as soon as GM does a redesign on the Camaro, GM will have the upper hand. thats the way it works. its a one-upper deal. you make this, i make that only better. the only problem is it took ford for ******* ever to get this concept. ford was on the right track with the 5.0 in the 80's/90's then failed with the 4.6, realized how they failed and strapped a blower (read "bandaid") to it...now they are finally realizing that they need to step up the N/A game and did. next year, GM will come ahead, then back to Ford...thats competition and what drives prices down.

durrettcustoms

iTrader: (2)

Thats the funniest most biased article Ive ever read. One thing I will say is at least fard is trying to compete with Chevy with a n/a motor and no supercharger.

Which brings another thought to my mind PLEASE GM BUILD A SUPERCHARGED CAMARO Z28 or at least LS7 powered!!!!!

bww3588

iTrader: (49)

GM would be stupid not to put the LSA in the Camaro next year. they have the car and the engine, why not?

Master8ter

I've been the local Mustang guru for years around here. I'm just a fountain of useless information regarding the 2005+ GT's and GT500's. I even installed the first privately owned Whipple charger on a S197 platform in the US. That said, here's what I know.

The new 5.0 is 11:1 compression - but it runs on 87oct. While all the GM guys here are mentioning how that compression is not blower friendly, that first sentence fact is crucial.
The DOHC variable cam setup in the new 5.0 can actually regulate the compression ratio internally. By changing the timing between the intake and exhaust valves in relation to the piston in the cylinders, the engine will change compression to best suit the conditions and octane. Once the tuners get hold of the ability to manually program this setting, the possibilities will be huge.

I know for a fact that FRPP already has a 535hp(crank) Whipple charger package for this car - with a full factory warranty. This kit is also offered on the 2011 Shelby GT350 from Shelby America. Dustin Whipple has made no secret of the fact that the full on aftermarket model of this kit will be over 600hp right out of the box. With this information, we know that the programming of the cams are coming into play in changing the compression to be more boost friendly. We just don't know how yet.

Now lets talk the unanswerable question - mod for mod
<$1500 - I see both cars being about the same hp; intake, exhaust, tune - just the basics usually yield around 60-70hp

The problem is this is where the mod similarities end. For GM LS engine owners, next comes a cam, maybe some light head work, usually totaling another $2k or so. Mustangs just can't compete price wise. They can make the same #'s, but it would cost twice as much at least. For that reason, most mustang owners go straight to NoS, blowers, and turbos are really growing in popularity in the mustang community.

Of course the ford guys will always play the GT500 mod card, where you get nothing but tire shredding hp and tq for only $6k (kenne bell). Absolutely retarded power. Makes for a great dyno queen, takes a lot of work to actually be able to plant that power though.

Me, I may get yet my 4th Mustang in the coming years. I prefer the lighter weight, and the better ability to shred that weight. Many ford guys with S197's were able to get their cars to a 3250lb weight using aftermarket weight saving parts and pulling stuff like OEM seats and spare tires. Others were even able to get under 3k lbs by going to extremes. Trust me, you can definately feel the difference between something 4000lbs and something 3250lbs as your driving. Being that these cars are almost identical except for the drivetrain, it should be no problem in these either.

bww3588

iTrader: (49)

smartest statment in this thread....^^^

rayhawk

The only thing I would disagree with is the new 5.0 running on 87 octane. Like almost any modern car, the engine will run on 87 by pulling timing, but power will be reduced. The engine is rated on premium, as far as I know. All the variable valve timing in the world won't increase the displacement of the engine, which is the primary limitation of the motor. Not that it wont be badass with a supercharger, just that it will remain a step below a 6.2L LS3 with a similar setup.

As for the weight, it is not terribly difficult to shed serious weight on the Camaro either, but the Mustang will remain ahead in that battle assuming equal weight loss methods.

ss1129

iTrader: (16)

I agree, dropping weight if trying to build a drag car wont be hard. I dropped 100lbs by adding headers, removing mufflers, removing the resonator adding a CAI and ditching the engine covers. Remember you still have 20's on the Camaro and 19s on the mustang...which was probably weighed without the brembo upgrade and 18"s instead of the upgraded 19s. Dont forget those extra airbags and door and roof supports that the camaro has for the 2012 saftey standards that the mustang is still lacking.

In the end, when you opt for the 4 brembos with 19" wheels the weight gap is going to close, and close pretty quick. Id venture to say that the camaros stock cast manifolds, with 4 cats 1 huge resonator (if you have the l99) 2 small resonators (ls3) and two huge fish tank mufflers offer a larger weight loss than the mustangs stock headers and cat back. Then you throw some 18"s on the camaro and your right in the ball park of Mustang weight. Drop those extra airbags (if your that type of guy) and the engine covers and it will keep creeping up. Dont forget the Camaro is a big car.

Oh and if you care about mgp, dont expect the advertised mpg with the 3.73. I think it will be business as usual at the track. Your going to see a lot more bolt-on Camaros at the track (are there any camaros without bolt-ons?) running against 2011 Mustangs and Id say they will win a majority of the time. Id venture to say a tune alone would even things up.

Dark SS

iTrader: (6)

Great post. I think some one did a weight comparison of stock exhaust vs. LT's and after market cat-back on an LS3 and the savings were over 75 lbs. Swap to 18"s and V6 brakes and that will be good for over 100lbs. Not to mention that's unsprung weight. I think you will see a lot of weight reduction on the Camaro in the upcoming years. Should be fun to watch at the tracks.

got-a-ls1

iTrader: (12)

i know it was posted a bit ago but... lol... now lets see it on the street. seriously that was a pointless post. Like saying a 5.7 liter engine can make 850 horsepower in nascar. who cares what a race built engine can make. your not putting it on the street in a full weight car.

bww3588

iTrader: (49)

i agree...that engine you posted in the dynograph made 500 RWHP at 8000RPM...that is totally useless in a street car.

BlackNiteWS6

iTrader: (2)

Motor Trend has always been kissing Fords *** for years. They know damn well the new Camaro is a way better car, a more anticipated car, and solidly built and powerful car, but what do those retards choose a car of the year? The Ford freaking Focus???? A cheesy looking econo car that looks as exciting as their magazine. I doubt they even tested the '11 GT. They just looked at it for awhile, drank a few cups of coffee and quote what times they got. They have no credibility i my eyes. Christ they chose the 1993 Ford Probe GT that got canceled cause it was junk and didn't sell. They choose it over the new 1993 LT1 Z28. Thats when i knew they had their noses too far up Ford's back end So everyone got similar times for the GT except for who? Oh yeah must be Motor "Bad" Trend.

UltraZLS1

iTrader: (13)

Edmunds only got a 13.0 with the GT also. Same time it got for the camaro.

Motor trend also ran a 12.8 the first time with the stang.
They then imrpoved to a 12.7 against the camaro, but then ran the worst time yet in the camaro at a 13.1 when against the mustang. All I could do was laugh.

kinglt-1

iTrader: (26)

Uh gm does not offer the l99 in the SS... That engine is only offered in the RS a6. ALL SS cars got the ls3 w/ m6. That being said, Id much rather have a G8 GXP over the camaro anyday. Might aswell have 4doors if your buying a heavy azz car... not to mention the gxp has much nicer interior imo.

kinglt-1

iTrader: (26)

Wow That v6 mustang is impressive to say the least!! Goin by that vid the 308hp it put down was to the wheels... but Goin by its trap of 102, id say its actually 270whp, still great power tho. I also agree with master8ter;s post. The technology in this new 5.0 is more than most know. lets sit back and see what this new little powerplant can do in the right hands. With the adjustable cam phasing, this engine can taylor it's power curve on the fly basically. Thats how they are making this kind of power and still producing great tq. Basically fords version of hondas v-tec. this new 5.0 puts down 250wtq at around 2500rpm, wich is alot of tq for a mod motor... Im tired of hearing all these excuses about the new camaro being heavy because of new safety standards bla bla. Well tell me how Ford got away with producing a 3500-3600lb car for 2011. Im sorry but 3900lbs w/ two doors is rediculous, thats all! Other than that I like the Camaro. I think this is going to come down to what a guy is looking for out of a car. If I was looking for a fun street car with no intentions of doing alot of mods, id say the Mustang takes the cake. Although if I was looking for a car to mod the hell out of, I think the camaro would be a better choice.