ULTIMATEORANGESS

iTrader: (4)

i was going to ask this. also, HTF do they know if someone didnt break a window carefully leaving no glass behind. what a bunch of BS trying to prosecute without any real proof.

Empatho

iTrader: (16)

That sucks bro, but for every f-body owner out there its better if we don't show people on the internet how to break into our cars.

xephona

iTrader: (4)

Car was found in a ditch with skidmarks leading to it a few miles away, hence the idea that it was driven. As for people finding out how to do this, well.. its common knowledge here that you can reach in the glass with a stick to unlock the doors, i would expect that any video or something would be RARed and a link PMed to me or something to at least somewhat remain a "secret" though... a simple search of "locked out" leads to several posts on people explaining how to open the doors without a key.

pber13

if they actually try to bring charges against you for this, just call a major news outlet. a conservative one, like FOX, would just LOVE to show how a local government is trying to screw a hard working guy. This is a joke.

NC01TA

To the OP, thanks for the reply and at least the charges are misdemeanors but something is seriously amiss here. It doesn't matter if the town is 9,000 or 90,000 there are certain prosecutorial 'needs' to proceed with a trial and prove 'beyond a reasonable doubt'. I'm sure you were asked about spare keys and if someone else you know may have driven off with the car while you were in class. Were you protecting a buddy or is that the problem the investigators are having? What are the 3 counts of 'interfering' about? Again, what is the evidence on these three charges? Giving a true account of your whereabouts to police does not cause 3 counts to be brought against you. Again, something is seriously amiss here and I'd really like to hear the entire story.

xephona

iTrader: (4)

I was asked about spare keys, I showed them the set of keys still on my key ring, and the spare set hanging on the wall of my house. I was asked if someone else had access to the car, no one I knew of did. I had the car up for sale at the time, and handed over emails of anyone who inquired about it. The 3 counts of interfering are because the detective assigned to my case claimed I lied to him about not being involved after he spoke to the insurance investigator who said it was impossible to steal this kind of car, so they are attempting to charge me with interfering for every time that I spoke with the police regarding this (aka, every time they called me and asked if I was involved.) I was in class from 5pm til 9pm, with a signed report from my instructor saying that I never left the room, and video surveillance inside the building to back that up.. apparently that is not good enough for them. Standard legal requirements apparently don't apply in redneck little towns.

I will try to post a pic of the document of the charges, which makes absolutely no sense at all, and that was the ONLY thing that the judge needed to send it to trial.. its absolutely bogus.

98TAjwh

iTrader: (4)

what GM tech did they go to? GMgoodwrench? and if these cars are so impossible to steal, why do so many get stolen/broken into? these alegations are completely laughable, supposing your telling the truth.

98TAjwh

iTrader: (4)

for what it's worth i found a step by step guide to breaking into these cars in 10-15 seconds just by googling "how to break into a camaro"

Z Fury

iTrader: (1)

If I knew it would lock your case up, I would gladly drive up to Wisconsin and let you demonstrate the ease of breaking into the car. For some reason, I think your display would be used against you somehow (or worse, they'd try to pin it on me). Whoever at GM said the f-body windows do not flex is ******* stupid. My windows flex going through the dryers at the damn car wash.

NC01TA

Thanks again Xephona. Appreciate the response.

71novaguy

iTrader: (2)

that break in section is a good read

ULTIMATEORANGESS

iTrader: (4)

i suspect they think since you were trying to sell it you mightve had it stolen instead. still BS.


id like them to explain how other fbodies were stolen if these cars are impossible to break into. is there security cameras where you car was parked?

xephona

iTrader: (4)

Thats the beauty of it. There WERE cameras in the parking lot... but unfortunately they were damaged in a lightning strike the night before (now how in the world would anyone know that in order to plan this is beyond me), so there is no video evidence aside from myself not leaving the classroom til the end of class.

Pictures of the "probable cause" that led to this going to court, sorry I don't have a scanner... My name, and a "witness" for the prosecution's name have been poorly blacked out.

http://i35.tinypic.com/2qxc090.jpg
http://i35.tinypic.com/24qn8nd.jpg
http://i36.tinypic.com/2i78dg8.jpg

Some details involved in this reading that I didn't mention prior, a key was found on the floor when they retrieved the car, looked like a GM key with no resistor chip, and the black plastic removed from the base of it. Wires under the dash were cut, yellow ones... (for the airbag.. wtf?).

The statement about the GM tech is pretty much what I said earlier... cept he is poorly recalling when I went out and bought a blank key just for the resistor chip (I wanted keyless entry in my car several months prior to this incident, so I swapped out the BCM for one with keyless entry... and it was linked to a new chip obviously. Instructions about it that I wrote up are found here: https://ls1tech.com/forums/stereo-el...l#post10726798) The VATS system worked perfectly at the time that they tested it (2 days after the car was recovered and returned to me), when the car was found in the ditch, and towed to the police station for me to examine, the headlights were popped up and off.. first thing out of my mouth to the cop was.. "huh, battery is dead" and instantly got on my *** about how I would know that... I am sure anyone who has driven these cars at night ONCE realizes that those headlights will NOT go down and off until you hit that switch, and will drain the batt if you leave em on.. but OH NO, that doesn't make sense at all to the redneck cop.

Bastard had the ***** to call me up when I am on my way back to class a few days later and ask me to come down to the station and confess to stealing my own car.. I believe the way he put it was, "After speaking with progressive, it is obvious that you are lying to me, so I would like you to come down to the station and sign a confession, if you do.. I will make sure the DA is lenient with you on your charges. If you wish to continue lying to me about your involvement, don't bother coming in." Seriously? How the hell are you supposed to respond to a rigged *** question like that?

NC01TA

Thanks again for sharing. The affadavit is well written but the evidence is somewhat circumstantial at face value. Does probable cause exist? Yes, definitely, but even that is somewhat inconclusive and I'm surprised the prosecuting attorney didn't ask for further investigation and interviews. Maybe he did (and we aren't getting the full story) but your attorney should be aware of any other supplemental evidence against you. Will this be a jury trial or are misdemeanors handled by the judge in WI?? Jurors may empathize with you where the judge works every week with the same attorney and officers. You can see the problem here.

*** No way can I say guilty or not guilty without hearing everything but here is something to ponder that is not good, but is reasonable to many. This is almost a case where law enforcement has absolutely nothing to go on as far as leads or any other related incidents, which leads directly to you only. 1)No other similar thefts. 2)No suspects whatsoever. 3)Terrible timing with the e/mails and then the theft. Ouch! 4)The key (this is real bad for you). The insurance investigator's testimony will have a lot of weight. There are other things as well. I can see problems here. Also, I know you started this thread to see how someone can steal an F-body but it almost sounds like you are reaching, looking for other possibilities. This isn't good either. If you screwed up this is NOT the end of the world, certainly not with misdemeanors. Whatever happens, put this behind you and move on. This is nothing in the grand scheme of things. Good luck with school and your future!

xephona

iTrader: (4)

Yes to jury trial, I have already spoken to two attorneys about this, and the judges in this county are absolutely incompetent, there is something like a 67% turnover rate when people appeal the judges decision. Pretty much a kangaroo court county.

This is all the "evidence" they have, prosecution flat out told my attorney that all they had was circumstantial evidence and that she refused to drop the case, or even make a REASONABLE deal (their offer was 4 months in Huber, 200 hours community service, 18 months probation, $3000 fine + costs). The police have done ZERO investigation, mearly trusting the work of the insurance agency, and there are plenty of thefts in this town, no one locks their doors (except me), ... police mearly change the wording of the report to "joyriding" once the vehicle is found and the dumb high school kid who did it is arrested.

They had 3 suspects the day they found out, stupid detective flat out asked me "do you know these 3 people who were arrested last night? they all have prior auto theft records" and listed 3 names.... that doesn't seem illegal/immoral at all.

Emails mean nothing really, so I was selling it, so he said he couldnt afford it, doesn't mean HE didnt say no... then drive over the next night and snag it. In his emails he stated that he worked on T/As quite often. Lovely how they instantly jump to the conclusion that I did it though.

The key... well that boggles my mind, there was no DNA/fingerprints on it that link me to that thing at all, and an employee at GM couldnt POSSIBLY have made the key themselves to snag the car (I live 2 blocks away from the dealership and drive past every day). Yep.. I am the only one who could have duplicated a key with NO RESISTOR... grrr

The insurance adjustors testimony should theoretically have ZERO weight, it is a conflict of interest. They have a business that revolves around taking money and paying out to claims that they cannot refute. Not to mention that they did a poor job of investigating... such as waiting 2-3 days after I have the vehicle in my possession to examine it. Their investigation really was... "look at external damage - minor, look at internal damage with a fluid sample - metal shavings inside TRANSMISSION fluid... OH NO! MANUAL TRANSMISSION CAR WITH METAL SHAVINGS... ABUSSSEEEEE!!!, look at ignition system - huh.. it works... slight forced entry marks... meh, must have been operated with a key)

And I did not start this thread to see how someone would steal one, I know full well on how someone can and will. I mearly would like some sort of evidence that I can use on my behalf to counter their bogus crap. I seriously am interested in ONLY a quick video (hell, I will make it myself if someone wants to loan me use of their car for 5 minutes), or access to an offical GM repair manual that describes the VATS system to back up my logic.

Why do I need to ASK someone how to steal one of these cars? If I wanted to do it.. I would <DELETED>

It isn't that damn complicated to snag these cars, less than 5 minutes with ZERO noise (short of starting the car), I do NOT need instructions on how to do that, I mearly want some sort of proof that will hold up in court, without me having to borrow someone elses car and park it in the bloody courtroom. I really have no desire to steal anything, or continue researching methods that someone could have possibly done when mine was taken... I want this dumb court crap over... WITHOUT being charged with something I didn't do, and finish schooling.

ILLWS6

iTrader: (13)

If I were you I wouldn't bother with this video, they'll use it against you, and you better hope they don't somehow get ahold of that last paragraph you just wrote.
As far as the windows flexing i don't see how that matters. These doors have the same basic lock mechanism as they did in 1970 and can be slim jim'd in seconds.
Any half decent lawyer should get this case thrown out IMO.

xephona

iTrader: (4)

Indeed, but if they wish to have a GM tech as a witness who says the windows do NOT bend, then it is only fair that I use that against them to show how stupid they really are...

PhantomR/T

iTrader: (6)

show them that the windows bend. Problem solved. Good Luck!

xephona

iTrader: (4)

... and that would be why I request someone with access to a T-Topped F-body to make a quick video

71novaguy

iTrader: (2)

if I wasnt such a pansy, I'd go make the video, but I cant afford to replace the glass if I broke it. I wonder if you can prove to them that glass is a soquid (solid liquid) and that over time, glass tends to lose thickness at the top and gain it at the bottom.

On another note, have you tried finding a local junkyard with a t-top f-body? Maybe make the video there?