How do I tell if it is a rod knocking?
#1
How do I tell if it is a rod knocking?
Well I have noticed a ticking coming from my 01' LS-1 that at first a few days ago I was thinking that I must need new header gaskets.
However today it has started to get allot louder and is sounding more and more like a rod knock from a spun bearing.
Maybe I sprayed the car too much last summer? The motor and car only have 45K miles but I drive it hard everyday with the cam and all the other mods in my sig.
Is there any way to tell if it is a rod bearing? I assume a compression check wouldn't hurt, but it won't tell much. If it is a rod bearing is there a chance I can just change bearings and rods and not have to do anything to the crank and pistons etc... ?
Where should I go from here? I guess I could pull the lifters and make sure I didn't collapse a lifter?
it was low enough to turn the amber add oil light on the other day (it was only a qt. low though)
Anyway what would you do now if you were me
However today it has started to get allot louder and is sounding more and more like a rod knock from a spun bearing.
Maybe I sprayed the car too much last summer? The motor and car only have 45K miles but I drive it hard everyday with the cam and all the other mods in my sig.
Is there any way to tell if it is a rod bearing? I assume a compression check wouldn't hurt, but it won't tell much. If it is a rod bearing is there a chance I can just change bearings and rods and not have to do anything to the crank and pistons etc... ?
Where should I go from here? I guess I could pull the lifters and make sure I didn't collapse a lifter?
it was low enough to turn the amber add oil light on the other day (it was only a qt. low though)
Anyway what would you do now if you were me
#2
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Well I have noticed a ticking coming from my 01' LS-1 that at first a few days ago I was thinking that I must need new header gaskets.
However today it has started to get allot louder and is sounding more and more like a rod knock from a spun bearing.
Maybe I sprayed the car too much last summer? The motor and car only have 45K miles but I drive it hard everyday with the cam and all the other mods in my sig.
Is there any way to tell if it is a rod bearing? I assume a compression check wouldn't hurt, but it won't tell much. If it is a rod bearing is there a chance I can just change bearings and rods and not have to do anything to the crank and pistons etc... ?
Where should I go from here? I guess I could pull the lifters and make sure I didn't collapse a lifter?
it was low enough to turn the amber add oil light on the other day (it was only a qt. low though)
Anyway what would you do now if you were me
However today it has started to get allot louder and is sounding more and more like a rod knock from a spun bearing.
Maybe I sprayed the car too much last summer? The motor and car only have 45K miles but I drive it hard everyday with the cam and all the other mods in my sig.
Is there any way to tell if it is a rod bearing? I assume a compression check wouldn't hurt, but it won't tell much. If it is a rod bearing is there a chance I can just change bearings and rods and not have to do anything to the crank and pistons etc... ?
Where should I go from here? I guess I could pull the lifters and make sure I didn't collapse a lifter?
it was low enough to turn the amber add oil light on the other day (it was only a qt. low though)
Anyway what would you do now if you were me
Ok first off. Can you get us a video of the sound? If its a exhaust leak you can pin the spot to one spot, or at least I could on my truck. Personally I would drain the oil and check for metal shavings. Next would be to pull the pan if you can and look at the bearings. If you did spin a bearing I would recommend turning and polishing the crank. When you pass metal between the bearing and the journal you can score the crank that the new bearing wont like.
Good luck with it. IF you can get a video it would help.
#5
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Here is mine with a rod knock;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=haPyFvU0r7Y
and here was the damage to the crank;
If yours is a rod knock, you'll know it. Kinda hard to miss that distinct sound, haha!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=haPyFvU0r7Y
and here was the damage to the crank;
If yours is a rod knock, you'll know it. Kinda hard to miss that distinct sound, haha!
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Here is mine with a rod knock;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=haPyFvU0r7Y
and here was the damage to the crank;
If yours is a rod knock, you'll know it. Kinda hard to miss that distinct sound, haha!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=haPyFvU0r7Y
and here was the damage to the crank;
If yours is a rod knock, you'll know it. Kinda hard to miss that distinct sound, haha!
araber89 called it! .. Drain the pan!.. Look in the oil for metal shavings. .. If your having trouble identifying it, hold it up to sunlight if you have it in a pan. <-You'll see a "metallic rainbow" in the oil. ... You can also just run it through your fingers.
BTW, if it IS a spun bearing, now would be a great time to go with forged internals! Look at it from the most positive side possible before you start cursing your birth!
Last edited by WS6 Rampage; 01-10-2011 at 10:57 AM.
#7
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.....If it is a spun bearing, STOP cranking the motor 20 frig'n times over to get a "friends opinion"..... araber89 called it! .. Drain the pan!.. Look in the oil for metal shavings. .. If your having trouble identifying it, hold it up to sunlight if you have it in a pan. <-You'll see a "metallic rainbow" in the oil. ... You can also just run it through your fingers.....
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#8
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Don't run the engine anymore...pull the pan and check. Rod knock is very distintive...mine gave up the ghost a few years and before it did I lost oil pressure...here's my favorite pic.
#9
Wow you guys rock! I have been driving my truck and haven't checked this thread in a few days, but I have been missing the 400 RWHP ALLOT!
Here is a update, I drove it around the block and it ran great but had the knock or tick from idle to about 2800 then it seemed to stop. I didn't get on it though so 3000 grand easy was about all the tach saw.
I then put it up on the car lift and took off both the Ac belt and the main accessory belt and I didn't have any change in the knock when I ran it with no accessories. I then pulled one weather head at each coil pack as was suggested and couldn't find a smoking gun cylinder with that test either.
I raised the car up oin the car lift and listened with my stethoscope and it definitely sounds like it is coming from the engine. It seamed a little louder with the stethoscope on the heads than when it was on the oil pan, but it was allot quieter with the steth on the T-56 tranny.
Next I did a compression test on the motor when it was warm fro the first 6 cylinders then I had to go inside and take my turn watching the 1 year old boy and my little girl.
The next day I did a cold comp check on #6 and still got 185# however I only got about 175#'s in #8 All cylinders would hold at around 180 PSI or better for a few minutes.
I did find a small hole (maybe 3/16" dia)in one of the exaust welds were a speed bump hit it the other day. Should I weld that hole shut and put plugs back in it and put all the coil packs back on a fire it up again? Or should I just pull the motor?
I was going to go out and pull the cam and check the lifters since I heard the noise a llittle more on the top of the motor.
(I will go drain the oil in a clean plastic pan now and pull the pan (beauty of a car lift)
I did smack that speed bump hard enough to dent the 3" pipe and make that 3/16" hole in the weld joint. I can't believe that would cause a knock like this but maybe.
I will update this after I go drain the oil and pull the pan.
Thanks again for all the help and posting the vid. I will shoot a vid if I do put it all back together and try and run it, but at this point I think I should probably just pull and disassemble the motor.
Can I safely get the caps off the rods without any special tools or do I need a rod splitter?
Here is a update, I drove it around the block and it ran great but had the knock or tick from idle to about 2800 then it seemed to stop. I didn't get on it though so 3000 grand easy was about all the tach saw.
I then put it up on the car lift and took off both the Ac belt and the main accessory belt and I didn't have any change in the knock when I ran it with no accessories. I then pulled one weather head at each coil pack as was suggested and couldn't find a smoking gun cylinder with that test either.
I raised the car up oin the car lift and listened with my stethoscope and it definitely sounds like it is coming from the engine. It seamed a little louder with the stethoscope on the heads than when it was on the oil pan, but it was allot quieter with the steth on the T-56 tranny.
Next I did a compression test on the motor when it was warm fro the first 6 cylinders then I had to go inside and take my turn watching the 1 year old boy and my little girl.
The next day I did a cold comp check on #6 and still got 185# however I only got about 175#'s in #8 All cylinders would hold at around 180 PSI or better for a few minutes.
I did find a small hole (maybe 3/16" dia)in one of the exaust welds were a speed bump hit it the other day. Should I weld that hole shut and put plugs back in it and put all the coil packs back on a fire it up again? Or should I just pull the motor?
I was going to go out and pull the cam and check the lifters since I heard the noise a llittle more on the top of the motor.
(I will go drain the oil in a clean plastic pan now and pull the pan (beauty of a car lift)
I did smack that speed bump hard enough to dent the 3" pipe and make that 3/16" hole in the weld joint. I can't believe that would cause a knock like this but maybe.
I will update this after I go drain the oil and pull the pan.
Thanks again for all the help and posting the vid. I will shoot a vid if I do put it all back together and try and run it, but at this point I think I should probably just pull and disassemble the motor.
Can I safely get the caps off the rods without any special tools or do I need a rod splitter?
#11
I just drained the oil and it is damn black for only having around a 100 miles on it.
This car didn't have a air filter when I bought it last February, did I mention that?
The Haynes manual is talking about having to lift the motor 3" up and unbolting the steering linkage and all this other junk so I think I am just going to pull the motor tonight.
I looked at that exhaust pin hile and it is much smaller like 1/64th inch Dia. and you can see it is where I stopped and started beads so I drought that is the knock.
I did take all the bolts out of the pan and one of the rear bolts had some clutch plate dust and engine oil! I hope that new Monster stage 3 clutch is OK, I am going to pull the tranny after dinner and see if my Monster is OK. I will try to get the motor out tonight.
This car didn't have a air filter when I bought it last February, did I mention that?
The Haynes manual is talking about having to lift the motor 3" up and unbolting the steering linkage and all this other junk so I think I am just going to pull the motor tonight.
I looked at that exhaust pin hile and it is much smaller like 1/64th inch Dia. and you can see it is where I stopped and started beads so I drought that is the knock.
I did take all the bolts out of the pan and one of the rear bolts had some clutch plate dust and engine oil! I hope that new Monster stage 3 clutch is OK, I am going to pull the tranny after dinner and see if my Monster is OK. I will try to get the motor out tonight.
#12
Here is mine with a rod knock;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=haPyFvU0r7Y
and here was the damage to the crank;
If yours is a rod knock, you'll know it. Kinda hard to miss that distinct sound, haha!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=haPyFvU0r7Y
and here was the damage to the crank;
If yours is a rod knock, you'll know it. Kinda hard to miss that distinct sound, haha!
Yeah it isn't that loud yet but that is what it sounds like.
Time to put that engine stand and hoist to work, that I bought 5 years ago!
#14
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When you changed the oil did you save the filter? Cut it open (in half) and look in the pleats for bearing material. However if yours sounds like the motor in the video, I'd say yes your goose is cooked. Stop running the motor and pull it. Do a teardown and see what you are up against.
#15
UPDATE
I pulled the motor and pulled all the rod caps off and NOTHING !
I installed new Ketech bolts (katech said it was OK that I took both rod bolts off and separated the cap from the rod because they are cracked cap factory rods so they will allign easily)
I then found several lifters that seamed to have weak springs. I submersed them in oil and pump them with a push rod while they were under oil and they never got stiff like the other 14 lifter were.
The week lifters would pump up that is why the knocking sound would stop above about 2600 RPM. I f ing rod knock would not have gone away at increased RPMs !!! OH well hindsight is always 20/20
Lesson learned is, if you are running a big cam your stock lifters will wear out and start this knocking or clicking around 15,000 to 20,000 miles after the big cam install.
I pulled the motor and pulled all the rod caps off and NOTHING !
I installed new Ketech bolts (katech said it was OK that I took both rod bolts off and separated the cap from the rod because they are cracked cap factory rods so they will allign easily)
I then found several lifters that seamed to have weak springs. I submersed them in oil and pump them with a push rod while they were under oil and they never got stiff like the other 14 lifter were.
The week lifters would pump up that is why the knocking sound would stop above about 2600 RPM. I f ing rod knock would not have gone away at increased RPMs !!! OH well hindsight is always 20/20
Lesson learned is, if you are running a big cam your stock lifters will wear out and start this knocking or clicking around 15,000 to 20,000 miles after the big cam install.