Are the imports going to take over???
#121
Finite1, you're argueing on fallacy about now. And your making import guys look kind of ignorant.
Anyways, to the original topic.
I've got a well built 355 SCB in a 79 Z28. I haven't dynoed it and I haven't had it running at the same time a track has been open. However, from a roll and from a dig, I've smoked Evos and STIs something fierce. All before the nitrous.
The body work, from factory, I think is one of the prime reasons the import market has such a foot hold today. The car is in excellent condition, never been in even a fender bender, and the body panels have had quarter inch and larger gaps between them. And thats all since long before I put the street radials on.
Now I've got an 88 Supra turbo five speed(for sale, to boot). The body lines are excellent, the car looks great and well put togather. Theres a definate quality look on the outside. Inside is just the same, everything feels right there and comfortable. The chair sits up right and is very adjustable(my biggest beef with my Z28 is that it was designed for a 6'5" beastman with almost no adjustability to the seat).
Purely from a power standpoint, I suppose the car does well. Never been a Honda/Nissan/VW thats kept up. Though I imagine a stock SRT4 would walk it. Its a pretty heavy car. And at 200k miles with the only major repairs being a headgasket replacement, a timing chain, and a clutch slave cylinder, I'd say the car has with stood the test of time.
My two cars are a decade apart, but its obvious how the import market could have got started. I think if American quality and worksmanship could increase, and if American ingeniuty and engineering continue to step up domestic cars could start to rise in popularity again.
I've also got two 2.2litre turbo/nitrous cars on hand to reference boost vs displacement. Keeping in mind, of course, that 2.2 liters at 14.5 PSI(at my altitude) very roughly comes to 4.4. And 5.7 at the same boost is nuts almost to the point of being wrong.
Anyways, to the original topic.
I've got a well built 355 SCB in a 79 Z28. I haven't dynoed it and I haven't had it running at the same time a track has been open. However, from a roll and from a dig, I've smoked Evos and STIs something fierce. All before the nitrous.
The body work, from factory, I think is one of the prime reasons the import market has such a foot hold today. The car is in excellent condition, never been in even a fender bender, and the body panels have had quarter inch and larger gaps between them. And thats all since long before I put the street radials on.
Now I've got an 88 Supra turbo five speed(for sale, to boot). The body lines are excellent, the car looks great and well put togather. Theres a definate quality look on the outside. Inside is just the same, everything feels right there and comfortable. The chair sits up right and is very adjustable(my biggest beef with my Z28 is that it was designed for a 6'5" beastman with almost no adjustability to the seat).
Purely from a power standpoint, I suppose the car does well. Never been a Honda/Nissan/VW thats kept up. Though I imagine a stock SRT4 would walk it. Its a pretty heavy car. And at 200k miles with the only major repairs being a headgasket replacement, a timing chain, and a clutch slave cylinder, I'd say the car has with stood the test of time.
My two cars are a decade apart, but its obvious how the import market could have got started. I think if American quality and worksmanship could increase, and if American ingeniuty and engineering continue to step up domestic cars could start to rise in popularity again.
I've also got two 2.2litre turbo/nitrous cars on hand to reference boost vs displacement. Keeping in mind, of course, that 2.2 liters at 14.5 PSI(at my altitude) very roughly comes to 4.4. And 5.7 at the same boost is nuts almost to the point of being wrong.
#123
Originally Posted by WiseAssJester
Finite1, you're argueing on fallacy about now. And your making import guys look kind of ignorant.
I'm no expert.
get some real import guys in here who know there **** and they'll shut you down every time.
I'm flying solo right now
#125
Fallacy means you're argueing off of bad/false/no information.
Other guys have referenced fact and literature. You're just standing there telling everyone else they're wrong.
Its kind of retahded not to think that maybe, with that sort of attitude, people are going to resent you.
Other guys have referenced fact and literature. You're just standing there telling everyone else they're wrong.
Its kind of retahded not to think that maybe, with that sort of attitude, people are going to resent you.
#126
Originally Posted by Finite1
convince you?? I drive a trans am... roflmao.
#127
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 32,395
Likes: 1,816
From: Schiller Park, IL Member: #317
Originally Posted by Smearin
You guys going with gm and such... are doing a good job of pointing out everything using facts..
this other guy.. isnt fairing too well
Like I said.. Its a matter of opinion
I wont buy Japanese either..
this other guy.. isnt fairing too well
Like I said.. Its a matter of opinion
I wont buy Japanese either..
Clearly Finite1 is only interested in arguing based on opinion and not FACT. Arguing opinions is pointless, because there is no right or wrong answer, it's a personal choice.
#128
well because basically you are wrong.
point out something ANYTHING that I stated falsely or non-factual that wasn't corrected by me or somone else.. maybe my numbers weren't perfec.. I'm going off the top of my head.
so the japanese engines dont make more power per liter than an American?
hah.
point out something ANYTHING that I stated falsely or non-factual that wasn't corrected by me or somone else.. maybe my numbers weren't perfec.. I'm going off the top of my head.
so the japanese engines dont make more power per liter than an American?
hah.
#130
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 32,395
Likes: 1,816
From: Schiller Park, IL Member: #317
Originally Posted by Finite1
get some real import guys in here who know there **** and they'll shut you down every time.
If knowing their **** means that they actually have FACTS to discuss, then we'd all be on the same page.
FACT: For many years in past decades, asian cars were well ahead of their domestic counterparts in many catigories (never really power/torque though).
FACT: Toady, GM quality rankings are very near their asian rivals, even surpassing them in some catigories. It is true that some GM models still fall short of some asian competitors, but on average GM is right there with the asian companies. I have posted links to FACTS confirming this. If you choose to ignore the facts, that's YOUR problem.
So I really don't see how some import guy is gonna shut me down? My arguement is based in FACT.
#131
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 32,395
Likes: 1,816
From: Schiller Park, IL Member: #317
Originally Posted by Finite1
well because basically you are wrong.
Then, we'd have an actual debate. You are going off opinion, not fact. No one will ever win that debate.
#135
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 32,395
Likes: 1,816
From: Schiller Park, IL Member: #317
Originally Posted by Finite1
so the japanese engines dont make more power per liter than an American?
The 5.3L domestic V8 is 34% larger in displacement than the 3.5L V6 from Nissan or Toyota.
BUT
The Nissan only gets 10% better MPG, and Toyota only 20% better MPG even though they have a 34% smaller motor with two less cylinders.
So much for better Jap technology.
#137
GM's market share is below 20% and GM is slimming down, buying out workers, cutting costs.
this is happening right now people.. why is that?
why is Ford under 17%? why is Crysler under 13%
all American companies are collapsing and companies like Toyota and Nissan will pick up the pieces...
face it.
I'm done.
this is happening right now people.. why is that?
why is Ford under 17%? why is Crysler under 13%
all American companies are collapsing and companies like Toyota and Nissan will pick up the pieces...
face it.
I'm done.
#138
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 32,395
Likes: 1,816
From: Schiller Park, IL Member: #317
Originally Posted by Finite1
why is the camry the best selling sedan in the country?
coincedence?
coincedence?
Why are the best selling overall vehicles for 2006 in this country F-series pickups (#1) and Silverados (#2)?
The Camry is in 3rd place, only #1 in passenger cars sales.
#139
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 32,395
Likes: 1,816
From: Schiller Park, IL Member: #317
Originally Posted by Finite1
GM's market share is below 20% and GM is slimming down, buying out workers, cutting costs.
this is happening right now people.. why is that?
why is Ford under 17%? why is Crysler under 13%
all American companies are collapsing and companies like Toyota and Nissan will pick up the pieces...
face it.
I'm done.
this is happening right now people.. why is that?
why is Ford under 17%? why is Crysler under 13%
all American companies are collapsing and companies like Toyota and Nissan will pick up the pieces...
face it.
I'm done.
FACT: GM is still the #1 automaker in the world in terms of sales. So if you want go by that reasoning, then until Toyota surpasses them in sales, GM is still better.
#140
are you illiterate?? do you read? can you grasp the concept of reading market reports..
go to forbes or somthing and learn a thing or two.
you must be KIDDING yourself
most the japanese makers dont make heavy duty trucks... how can they win in a market they dont even produce for.
i ASSURE you, if they actually tried to produce in these markets, they'd beat the Americans....
they do it in every other category.
go to forbes or somthing and learn a thing or two.
you must be KIDDING yourself
most the japanese makers dont make heavy duty trucks... how can they win in a market they dont even produce for.
i ASSURE you, if they actually tried to produce in these markets, they'd beat the Americans....
they do it in every other category.