wssix99

iTrader: (5)

Not as much air as it was designed for. It was designed for the radiator's air path, which is fed by a scoop and spoilers, which sends much more air to the area.


The proper cooler is much larger, longer and has many many times the surface area of the one you purchased. (For a passive cooler, surface area will be everything.)

A proper passive cooler will also need a proper stand-off to allow circulation behind the tubes and the fin design will be slightly different.

Just the surface area issue alone is going to cut your cooler down to 1/3 the potential of the cooler in the original post. All the other factors are going to add up to more drain on performance.

LS6427

iTrader: (2)

Best way to get ram air cooling onto an (aftermarket) power steering cooler. My cooler is always slightly warm to the touch, regardless of how hard I drive it.

This is the only place to get ram air flow directly into the cooler. Unless the cooler is literally hanging out there in the breeze, in an unsafe way.

Kind of hard to see, but the side of the cooler on the front of the car side....is hanging down slightly. So its pulled onto the frame tighter at the rear of the cooler. So that ram air blows over the entire surface of the cooler and then down and away......the entire surface area is blasted with ram air.

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wssix99

iTrader: (5)

This method happens at the expense of an aerodynamic component of the car and air flows through the cooler 90 degrees from the direction intended. As such, it also would not be able to cool as efficiently as designed by the manufacturer.


Isn't that the case for everything in Florida?

LS6427

iTrader: (2)

Wrong.

Read the 3rd paragraph of my post. The entire surface of the cooler gets ram air hitting it......

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LS6427

iTrader: (2)

No, most of the guys I know that mount their coolers OUT of any airstream directly hitting it have burning hot coolers that you cannot touch.....mine never gets hot, only warm and you can always touch it. Therefore, my cooler, being fed ram air any time the car is moving....cools the fluid much better than all other locations people try that is not in the direct airstream.....

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wssix99

iTrader: (5)

A little sliver of an angle effectively does noting compared to how that cooler was designed to operate, with airflow going perpendicular across the unit.

Ignoring the complex aerodynamic boundary effects you are introducing, you can use simple trigonometry to figure out how much surface area is being hidden from the air flow.

Please don't use a touch test to prove that it "works". We have hard data here that shows most cars don't benefit materially from a cooler, an article from professionals that shows actual temperature data from autocross applications, etc. - great tech discussion.

The "cooler cuddle test" doesn't cut it.

Ruffturbo911

Bottom line. If you race the car put it in a good location. On a street car one might be concerned with optimal air conditioner operation, and not block the condenser. Ultimately it’s up to the owner of the vehicle. A mediocre cooler is better than no cooler.

Ruffturbo911

Didn’t you put yours behind the air dam and cut a hole?

LS6427

iTrader: (2)

YES....with a hole for direct ram air. A lot of people put it on the frame behind the air dam....WITH NO HOLE for ram air and they get ZERO airflow through the cooler. Many friends of mine have done that because those long skinny coolers mount up there nicely....but they don't cool worth a ****.

There's are always burning hot....you will fry your skin if you touch it after a normal drive. Mine is always warm....you can touch it any time.....

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LS6427

iTrader: (2)

The only other place to mount a cooler so it gets ram air is up in front of the condenser....and almost everyone does that wrong also......if you put it up in front against it you create a hot spot the size of the cooler, right on the condenser. Absolutely decreasing the efficiency of the A/C system. It also travels through and heats the radiator in that large spot.

Thats why my tranny cooler was mounted like this (pics below). No way I wanted direct heat going into my condenser...such a sensitive piece of the A/C system. That way the hot air coming off the cooler is first mixed with ambient ram air before it hits the condenser and you will NOT create any large hot spot on the condenser.....

A power steering fluid cooler could also be mounted like this.....but I chose to tuck it up under the air dam. I may mount my one of my two tranny coolers, routed in series, on the other side of the air dam and cut a hole in it so it also gets ram air all the time. Then leave the second tranny cooler where you see it in the pictures......

It blows my mind that people are still putting coolers up against their condensers and/or radiators.....makes zero sense.

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Ruffturbo911

I mounted my PS cooler like you did not wanting to effect my AC. Didn’t cut the hole yet. Can’t post a pic on here for some reason. I’d like to put a square trans cooler under the coolant overflow tank after wrapping the bottom of the tank in DEI gold. Then I’d have incoming air through the hole in the TA bumper.

LS6427

iTrader: (2)

Those two holes in our TA bumpers may not flow air through it like the Z06 Vette holes in their bumpers were designed for. Its a specific design all the way through the hole from front to back that will actually allow ram air to blast through a hole in a bumper.......

Our TA lower bumper holes may very well be just for looks and really flow no real good ram air.

You would be better off mounting it on the other side of the air dam...behind it.....like I mounted mine......then cut a hole for it to get ram air. Also, cut a hole where you already mounted the other cooler.

BOTH will get ram air cooling while driving......and those holes will not affect the cooling at all to the condenser/radiator.

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wssix99

iTrader: (5)

For something like that in that type of location, I would think that you'd need a setup like a brake duct to concentrate and direct the airflow like you want it:

the450r

iTrader: (1)

I guess my question has the turn one pump solved anyone's problem? My cooler is mounted under the car. I kept it away from the condenser and Radiator. If I ever put a front spoiler on I will have access hole for the cooler.

I am looking for a larger cooler or an additional cooler not sure if I need to change pumps also.

Most of the derale power steering coolers have similar construction to the one I have.

The 04-06 gto pump and reservoir is very similar pump. I wonder if the remote reservoir and cap design is any better at managing pressure build up.

smitty2919

Aftermarket pumps reduce flow rate specifically at higher RPM. Stock pump will have a lot of bypass fluid which creates heat. De-flowed pump with stacked plate cooler using a Redline or equivalent fluid will solve it. Stock caps are vented setup and may hinder things if you seal the system with non vented cap.

If you boil or see fluid out of your cap simply daily driving on street tires then you have a bigger problem.

If you have space, look into Woodward PS tanks. It's designed to extract any air bubbles in the fluid. A pump will hate air bubbles...but you get a cool "roots blower" type sound

BALLSS

agreed...but if going to install one getting a "good" cooler placed in a area where it will get air flow or from a fan is better than just stuffing one in somewhere that does not see any direct air flow over it, ideally air plow direct into its face vs on one edge of it.

I have a B-body and don't Autox but do drive aggressively through local canyons. I have a T56 swap. One day after running through a canyon from the coast I saw PS fluid weeping from the cap area.

I plumed in my original external tranny cooler into the PS. It was 3/8" line just like my PS lines so was a pretty easy mod, just had to fab up some 3/8" hard line for it. Did a complete fluid flush and replaced both feed, high pressure and return lines. No problem puking PS fluid now. My cooler mounts in front of condenser behind grill stood off from the condenser.

Some good examples posted in this thread

pic of mine

_JB_

iTrader: (33)

Here's my quote from 2012...

...and I still report the frame installed cooler behind the airdam, no holes cut, has always been cool and it won't burn me if I touch it. My cooler has maybe an inch or so between the frame and cooler so it does get airflow. I can see cooler in the same area flush against the body not working very well since it couldn't breathe. I'm not sure what's wrong with your buddies setup, maybe their pump is dying/isn't moving as much fluid?

smitty2919

Any of you guys that are arguing over this, have any of you tested your coolers?

Have you put a temp probe in the fluid before and after cooler install driving the car in same ambient temps at same speeds on same stretch of road?

If not then how are you quantifying that it is even working properly? Just because your cooler is hot or cool does not mean anything. It's fluid temp that matters. A tube/fin cooler may not feel as hot as a stacked plate cooler simply due to the fact you touch the edges of the fins and less surface area to touch than a stacked plate setup. It's time spent in the cooler and surface area combined with heat transfer coefficients and air temp deltas that are doing the work. My qualification was racing the car I initially would get horrible PS pump whine and puking fluid out the cap. After the cooler the pump barely whined and fluid puke was GREATLY reduced.

The B&M mounted in front of the radiator works very well since it is designed to be mounted at an angle to the air path.

I would never put anything other than a B&M/Setrab/Deral stacked plate style. The one on my car is a 7500 Btu/hr rating as an example.

LS6427

iTrader: (2)

That inch you have in between the frame and cooler....makes ALL the difference. Space equals air flow through the syncs.

Everyone I know have the tight against the frame....zero airflow THROUGH the heat syncs.....just normal air turbulence is making contact with it....useless. They are HOT as hell.....

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LS6427

iTrader: (2)

Yup....laser temp tests....no probe actually touching fluid going into/out of the rack. That would require some serious alterations. NO need at all to do that.

Get the temp of the fluid in the reservoir before and after a long drive.....temp of the metal line going out of the pump, temp of the metal line going into the rack, temp of the metal port on the cooler where the fluid enters it....then a temp reading on the port exiting the cooler going back to the reservoir.

But when a dozen of my friends have the identical cooler mounted in the identical location as me.....and their coolers are always too hot to touch......and mine is warm to the touch. Thats some pretty good test results.

The good cooling though.....it comes from actually driving the car. With constant ram air hitting the cooler, it cools all of the fluid continually over and over again, it just keeps getting cooler and cooler as you drive.....to a point of course, which is almost ambient.......100*F day, running around for 30 minutes, the cooler is just warm to the touch........thats cool.

Without the hole cut in the air dam.....the cooler does the same job of cooling, pretty much, ALWAYS....whether sitting still in traffic or moving......it just doesn't cool ever. So things just stay hot, or keep getting hotter if you drive aggressively.

People can do what they want.....its very clear and simple which is best. But yes, anything will work. I just figure if I'm gonna have a cooler on their, its going to actually do something to help temps, not just be another part that hot fluid flows through.


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