1998 z28 window issue, HELP!!!!
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Teching In
Joined: Aug 2017
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From: orange park, Florida
1998 z28 window issue, HELP!!!! I got this car about four months ago, the previous owner went to college and left the car sitting in his dads back yard for about four years.... I've owned several f-body Camaros and T/As so I figured I could get it up and running again especially for the deal I got, cheap!!! Well the Windows have never worked at all since I've had it. I got the car running again, fixed brakes, tires, wiring harness re-wired cause rats chewed them up....ive recently stated messing with interior stuff and I turned my attention to the Windows..... Since they both don't work at all I assumed it was electrical ... I tracked it down to a clicking noise under the dash between the steering wheel and radio, THE (driver?) POWER WINDOW CONTROL MODULE. I got one from a junk yard it looked pretty good. No bad solder joints on the board ECT.. Well I replaced it and nothings changed it still clicks so now I'm going to look at the BCM....also when I press the passenger side(passenger door not driver) window button down it locks the door, and when I press passenger window up it unlocks the door?????? Wtf . Has anyone ever has this BS happen.... I will post more once I rip out the bcm and look at the intermittent radio/window solder joints. Thanks and really would appreciates any input.
Why start off spending money with out testing things at the switch first? Just take some time and jumper wires. Even though it's a bit odd to have both motors die at once in a daily car, it's probably a bit more common when they sit for 4 years. One stopped a month before or after it was parked and the other could have stopped 3.5 years later.
Thread Starter
Teching In
Joined: Aug 2017
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From: orange park, Florida
Why start off spending money with out testing things at the switch first? Just take some time and jumper wires. Even though it's a bit odd to have both motors die at once in a daily car, it's probably a bit more common when they sit for 4 years. One stopped a month before or after it was parked and the other could have stopped 3.5 years later.
Joined: Nov 2003
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From: Jacksonville, FL (originally from Toronto Canada)
The only involvement of the BCM in the windows circuit is to provide retained accessory power (RAP). If you are getting power to the windows switches and/or the express down module (as evidenced by the clicking noise) then the BCM is not the problem.
Similarly, the express down module is only involved in the driver's side window... if neither side window is working then the express down module wouldn't be a likely source of the problem.
Power comes into the switches on the brown wire on pin F of the driver's switch and pin A of the passenger's switch. Output for the driver's window is on the dark blue wire (up) or gray wire (down via the express down module). Output for the passenger's window from the passenger's switch is on the dark blue wire (up) or the brown wire on pin C (down). Output for the passenger's window on the driver's switch is on the light blue wire (up) or tan wire (down) which both go across the car to become input to the passenger's side switch.
Similarly, the express down module is only involved in the driver's side window... if neither side window is working then the express down module wouldn't be a likely source of the problem.
Power comes into the switches on the brown wire on pin F of the driver's switch and pin A of the passenger's switch. Output for the driver's window is on the dark blue wire (up) or gray wire (down via the express down module). Output for the passenger's window from the passenger's switch is on the dark blue wire (up) or the brown wire on pin C (down). Output for the passenger's window on the driver's switch is on the light blue wire (up) or tan wire (down) which both go across the car to become input to the passenger's side switch.
Staging Lane
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Not entirely sure but I believe it is possible to interchange the door lock connector with the power window connector, meaning one can connect the power window switch to the power lock harness and the lock switch to the power window harness.
On my car, if I unplug the power window switch on the passenger side, I lose all control of both windows from my driver side. Perhaps if the harnesses are reversed like I mentioned, your driver side window switch isn't doing anything and your passenger side window switch is tripping the door locks. Just something to check.
The door lock wire harness has thinner gauge and fewer wires than the power window wire harness. So this should be a quick check.
On my car, if I unplug the power window switch on the passenger side, I lose all control of both windows from my driver side. Perhaps if the harnesses are reversed like I mentioned, your driver side window switch isn't doing anything and your passenger side window switch is tripping the door locks. Just something to check.
The door lock wire harness has thinner gauge and fewer wires than the power window wire harness. So this should be a quick check.
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
Can't say that I've ever had a window motor fail from sitting, they typically need to be in use to wear out. I suppose corrosion from outdoor storage could be a cause in the right climate/situation but, based on what the OP has reported so far, I think a wiring/switch connection issue sounds far more likely in this case.
If the driver's side switch or wiring to it is broken, it can mean windows on both sides get no power, since pass. side draws power thru the drivers side switch (yes, a poor design, but can be easily fixed).
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Joined: Nov 2003
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From: Jacksonville, FL (originally from Toronto Canada)
Not true... the switches on both sides have independent power. There is a pass-through when operating the passenger side window from the driver side switch but the passenger side switch also has its own power.
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Verdad Gallardo Wrong. Pass. side ground goes through drivers side. I have the service manual schematics, and have also re-wired mine so pass. side has its own power and relays.
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 11,329
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From: Jacksonville, FL (originally from Toronto Canada)
Edit: To clarify, it doesn't matter which direction the current flows, the drivers side switch is carrying the full amount of amps when the pass. side window motor is running.
Last edited by patSS/00; Nov 19, 2017 at 11:12 PM.
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 11,329
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From: Jacksonville, FL (originally from Toronto Canada)
You're right... I was only looking at the power side of the circuit since the original comment was that no power would be available if the driver switch was disconnected and I had just posted the pin-out of the passenger side switch showing power on pin A. But current won't flow without a ground as well as power so unplugging the driver switch breaks the circuit by removing the ground side.
The opposite is not true (as posted above)... removing the passenger switch has no impact on the operation of the driver switch (other than preventing control of the passenger window of course). That may have been misstated - the poster may have meant to say the same as you, that unplugging the driver switch breaks the circuit.
The opposite is not true (as posted above)... removing the passenger switch has no impact on the operation of the driver switch (other than preventing control of the passenger window of course). That may have been misstated - the poster may have meant to say the same as you, that unplugging the driver switch breaks the circuit.
Staging Lane
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You're right... I was only looking at the power side of the circuit since the original comment was that no power would be available if the driver switch was disconnected and I had just posted the pin-out of the passenger side switch showing power on pin A. But current won't flow without a ground as well as power so unplugging the driver switch breaks the circuit by removing the ground side.
The opposite is not true (as posted above)... removing the passenger switch has no impact on the operation of the driver switch (other than preventing control of the passenger window of course). That may have been misstated - the poster may have meant to say the same as you, that unplugging the driver switch breaks the circuit.
The opposite is not true (as posted above)... removing the passenger switch has no impact on the operation of the driver switch (other than preventing control of the passenger window of course). That may have been misstated - the poster may have meant to say the same as you, that unplugging the driver switch breaks the circuit.
Hey man that clicking noise has nothing to do with anything. That thing will always click, you just don't usually notice it because the windows make more noise when you use them. I thought that about my driver's window bit it turned out to be the motor.
I also just had an issue where my windows and radio would cut out when I went to put the window down. That was the BCM. I took it out and saw that the soldering from factory was no good. I did a quick solder and my problem is solved. (Thanks to Ls1tech)
So if it's not the actual window motors, which are known to **** the bed, and it's not a switch, I could likely be the BCM. Especially if you are having window/radio issues.
I also just had an issue where my windows and radio would cut out when I went to put the window down. That was the BCM. I took it out and saw that the soldering from factory was no good. I did a quick solder and my problem is solved. (Thanks to Ls1tech)
So if it's not the actual window motors, which are known to **** the bed, and it's not a switch, I could likely be the BCM. Especially if you are having window/radio issues.
Thread Starter
Teching In
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From: orange park, Florida
Thanks blackbird, whitebird and everyone else who has posted helpful advice and knowledge. I took a break from trying to fix the Windows do to the winter and it's not been to hot in the car. I've been trying to save a few bux to buy my L86 engine and de-stroke with 4.8L crank. (340ci) *** beast *** when I finally get everything. But now since its getting hot again and I live in jax Florida. I really need to fix this. I'm sure with all this help I should be able to. Then price my interior together again piece by piece. . .. Did anyone live nearby that has dark f-body leather seats for sale? I'm tired of my cloth ones and kinda dingy..