WS6 has no balls
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Teching In
Joined: Nov 2014
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From: BAY AREA, CA
WS6 has no ***** What's going on people.. Little background on this car.. A few years ago I bought a crashed 02 WS6 with a 4L60e off my friend and transplanted the drivetrain minus the rear end into a 01 V6 5 speed firebird with the performance package with the 3.42 gears.. Hated the auto so I ended up swapping in a t56 a month later. That car ran like a beast. Raced a new coyote at the time and it was neck n neck.
Anyways, time went on and I bought a Trans Am roller to swap everything back over including the rear end from the V6 body, as I was told the rear in the TA roller was no good. Ended up selling the car to my brother in the process so we ended up cam swapping it and doing LT's, full exhaust etc. Tune time comes along so I'm driving conservatively to the shop but I still get on it a little bit like anyone else would and I was like damn this thing does not move like it used to stock, but I wasnt really getting into to it so I brushed it off because it wasn't tuned yet.. Went to the tune shop and had fuel problems. Ended up driving home and the fuel pump died in front of my driveway after sitting in traffic for an hour, so I got lucky as hell on making it home lol.
Changed the fuel pump to a Racetronix 255lph and also the fuel filter, so all was good fuel pressure wise. My brother took it back for a retune and then there was a problem with the MAF so the tuner just tuned it SD. Ended up dynoing in at 409rwhp. Yesterday I asked my brother if I could drive it and holy ****.. I got on it in 2nd gear and I just turned to my brother confused as hell lol. The car literally does not pick up at all like it used to in stock form. No torque whatsoever. I feel like my 1998 Camry 4 cylinder would drag that thing lol.
Any ideas on WTF is wrong with this car? Car literally has the Mustang effect. Loud as hell but doesnt go anywhere. I'm stumped on this one.
Anyways, time went on and I bought a Trans Am roller to swap everything back over including the rear end from the V6 body, as I was told the rear in the TA roller was no good. Ended up selling the car to my brother in the process so we ended up cam swapping it and doing LT's, full exhaust etc. Tune time comes along so I'm driving conservatively to the shop but I still get on it a little bit like anyone else would and I was like damn this thing does not move like it used to stock, but I wasnt really getting into to it so I brushed it off because it wasn't tuned yet.. Went to the tune shop and had fuel problems. Ended up driving home and the fuel pump died in front of my driveway after sitting in traffic for an hour, so I got lucky as hell on making it home lol.
Changed the fuel pump to a Racetronix 255lph and also the fuel filter, so all was good fuel pressure wise. My brother took it back for a retune and then there was a problem with the MAF so the tuner just tuned it SD. Ended up dynoing in at 409rwhp. Yesterday I asked my brother if I could drive it and holy ****.. I got on it in 2nd gear and I just turned to my brother confused as hell lol. The car literally does not pick up at all like it used to in stock form. No torque whatsoever. I feel like my 1998 Camry 4 cylinder would drag that thing lol.
Any ideas on WTF is wrong with this car? Car literally has the Mustang effect. Loud as hell but doesnt go anywhere. I'm stumped on this one.
Last edited by INTIMIDATOR_LSX; Apr 6, 2018 at 08:08 PM.
Thread Starter
Teching In
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 22
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From: BAY AREA, CA
Yea I know what you mean. So far I’ve checked the spark plugs and they aren’t white or black, they look normal and there’s no black smoke or anything revving or under load. Also at idle there’s plenty of water dripping out of the exhaust. Car sounds healthy as hell it just doesn’t move. That’s why I’m having trouble pinpointing this problem.
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
I agree on checking fuel trims/AFR. If that's not possible at the moment due to lack of a scanner/gauge, then maybe you could at least check fuel pressure under load? Make sure the new pump isn't giving up during a loaded WOT situation.
Also, how is the clutch?
Also, how is the clutch?
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From: Wichita KS / Rancho San Diego
The above suggestions are good. Since you can't log yourself, take it back to your tuner and have him log afr and fuel pressure as the rpms climb.
What are the specs of your cam? At what rpm are you shifting at WOT ?
What are the specs of your cam? At what rpm are you shifting at WOT ?
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Teching In
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 22
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From: BAY AREA, CA
Thread Starter
Teching In
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
From: BAY AREA, CA
Thread Starter
Teching In
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
From: BAY AREA, CA
BTR Stage 3. I put the same cam in my car and it’s no comparison. I used the same tuner for my car..best in my area. Anyways, when I drove it the other day I didn’t even bother taking it to redline. My bro said he raced a V6 Challenger and he said he barely beat it. that’s why I jumped in the car to see what was going on..
Thread Starter
Teching In
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From: BAY AREA, CA
I’m really thinking it’s a problem with the rear end because I had a A4 Z28 a couple years ago too and it had the same type of acceleration because it had 2.73s. That car was slow as hell too
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
Is there any chance the clutch is failing/suspect? I know it made good dyno numbers, but perhaps it was on the border of being marginal?
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
Just an FYI, there isn't really much performance difference between the 2.73 and 3.23 rears in the 4L60E cars. I've owned two of each. The 2.73 cars actually aren't much slower, 1-2 tenths/1-2mph with the stock torque converter (less with a 3500+ stall). It wouldn't make the kind of difference you're talking about.
On the other hand, if you put a 2.73 rear with the T56, that might feel pretty sluggish, especially with a cam, in the lower rpms. But I don't think you said anything about changing the rear/gear during this process (or did I misunderstand?)
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From: Woodstock, GA
Thread Starter
Teching In
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 22
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From: BAY AREA, CA
You wouldn't necessarily see a code for this. I've encountered several members lately who've experienced some major power loss from low fuel pressure under load and they weren't seeing any lean codes (even with a stock tune).
Based on this:
...my impression was that it just felt bad under a WOT pull. But, it could still be fuel pressure related, perhaps the new pump was faulty or some other issue has developed with the stock bucket (assuming you just did a pump only swap).
Is there any chance the clutch is failing/suspect? I know it made good dyno numbers, but perhaps it was on the border of being marginal?
Based on this:
...my impression was that it just felt bad under a WOT pull. But, it could still be fuel pressure related, perhaps the new pump was faulty or some other issue has developed with the stock bucket (assuming you just did a pump only swap).
Is there any chance the clutch is failing/suspect? I know it made good dyno numbers, but perhaps it was on the border of being marginal?
Thread Starter
Teching In
Joined: Nov 2014
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From: BAY AREA, CA
Now I'm confused, I thought it received the 3.42 rear from the other setup?
Just an FYI, there isn't really much performance difference between the 2.73 and 3.23 rears in the 4L60E cars. I've owned two of each. The 2.73 cars actually aren't much slower, 1-2 tenths/1-2mph with the stock torque converter (less with a 3500+ stall). It wouldn't make the kind of difference you're talking about.
On the other hand, if you put a 2.73 rear with the T56, that might feel pretty sluggish, especially with a cam, in the lower rpms. But I don't think you said anything about changing the rear/gear during this process (or did I misunderstand?)
Just an FYI, there isn't really much performance difference between the 2.73 and 3.23 rears in the 4L60E cars. I've owned two of each. The 2.73 cars actually aren't much slower, 1-2 tenths/1-2mph with the stock torque converter (less with a 3500+ stall). It wouldn't make the kind of difference you're talking about.
On the other hand, if you put a 2.73 rear with the T56, that might feel pretty sluggish, especially with a cam, in the lower rpms. But I don't think you said anything about changing the rear/gear during this process (or did I misunderstand?)
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
4L60E has a more aggressive internal first gear ratio than a T56 (3.06 vs 2.66), so the auto cars don't need as much rear gear to get similar mechanical advantage throughout 1st gear as the M6 versions (plus torque multiplication of the converter at launch for an auto). That's why I mentioned that a T56 with a 2.73 and a cam that's shifted the powerband higher could in fact feel pretty sluggish at low rpms. But, that's obviously not the case here since you said it still has the 3.42s and the lack of torque seems to exist in any gear/rpm, WOT or not.
Check if each exhaust is getting hot as and easy spark check. One exhaust part not hot, check for spark there. Then check fuel pressure. Start with simple things you can do with cheap tools easily. Get more advanced after you go over the basics, fuel, air, spark, and compression.
Sometimes you can have a plug wire that is bad, but each tube still gets hot. Been there done that. My problem was an arcing wire due to it being melted on the bottom side close to the header. Wasn't visual without pulling the wires. Ive seen the same issue when the plug wires are not fully seated either on the plug or in the coil. Wires had less than 1000 miles. If you find one melted, wrapping it with silicone or electrical tape wont work.