Do the QTP Headers REALLY make more HP
!LS1 11 Second Club
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 7,133
Likes: 2
From: Miami
Originally Posted by 68birdls1
Yea that flowmaster y is a real nice peice... I am still on the debate of wether or not to go with x over y. From your last post it sounds like this was your car, or you knew the car? What made whoever's car it is to change to a y instead of staying with the duals?
Went from X to Y for noise reasons (TD's are real fun at first, but shaking your house and your neighbor's house on startup in the morning with cam lope gets old- even after going to Magnaflow 4x9's), along with clearance reasons (not being able to clear speedbumps and curbcuts gets old).
I did use the dual cutout Y-pipe for continuing fun factor. Funny thing, with dual cutouts open, only a few hp were gained on the dyno.
I know exactly what you mean by the true duals, I had some on my last trans am, and with just headers and them it was insane. I made a huge mistake taking it on a road trip lol, lets just say that will never happen again.
But I have been looking real hard at the Qtp y pipe and it just seems like a lot for that piece you know. So what made you go with the mufflex? I just looked at it and it is priced at $289 which seems much better. How did that hook up to your Qtp's? Any problems?
But I have been looking real hard at the Qtp y pipe and it just seems like a lot for that piece you know. So what made you go with the mufflex? I just looked at it and it is priced at $289 which seems much better. How did that hook up to your Qtp's? Any problems?
Really?!? Lol, well I guess that makes it much simplier haha. Thanks alot for all the help bud. One last question... If you were to do it again, would you buy a premade y like you did or get the flowmaster y and have it built?
!LS1 11 Second Club
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 7,133
Likes: 2
From: Miami
Originally Posted by 68birdls1
Really?!? Lol, well I guess that makes it much simplier haha. Thanks alot for all the help bud. One last question... If you were to do it again, would you buy a premade y like you did or get the flowmaster y and have it built?
One could always do a custom y with the scavenger merge bought from Summit or Jegs.
I would do the mufflex again, installed on a lift by a shop with a welder to weld the Y-merge to the 4" to 3" cone reducer, as the band clamp provided for that connection doesn't work well. Trimming the I-pipe to subtract for the added length of the Y-merge and cone reducer was necessary.
Also, turbo style v clamps worked well at the header collectors on my setup- instead of using conventional 3" band clamps (the HVMC collectors are of a smaller diameter than the norm).
Last edited by SouthFL.02.SS; Jul 15, 2007 at 12:42 PM.
I have never seen the HVMC in person, and the pics that I have seen don't really help me much, but when you connect the y pipe to the header, how does that work? How big is the collector on the HVMC's? And I have been hearing alot of good things about the v-band clamos.
All i've seen is one reliable dyno example of one car using one set of headers and gaining X amount of power over what it previously had. If that's all i need to present to get $800 out of hundreds of members of the general public, then have I got a deal for you!
Sorry, for me it takes proof of REPEATABLE and RELIABLE gains over cheaper products. I still have not seen that here. Until I see several dyno examples of cars that went from a cheap set of headers to QTPs on the same tune without changing anything else and gained significant horsepower, i'm fine and happy with what i've got.
Sorry, for me it takes proof of REPEATABLE and RELIABLE gains over cheaper products. I still have not seen that here. Until I see several dyno examples of cars that went from a cheap set of headers to QTPs on the same tune without changing anything else and gained significant horsepower, i'm fine and happy with what i've got.
if it is the collector that makes all the difference, i think edelbrock has HVMCs on their headers, i think they are 1.875 stepped to 1.75. they are also inexpensive since they are coated.
LS1 Tech Stories
The Best V8 Stories One Small Block at Time
6 Common C5 Corvette Failures and What's Involved In Repairing Them
Pouria Savadkouei
Retro Modern Bandit Pontiac Trans AM Comes With Burt Reynolds' Autograph
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Greatest Cadillac V Series Performance Models Ever, Ranked
Pouria Savadkouei
Top 10 Most Powerful Chevy Trucks Ever Made!
Hennessey's New Supercharged Silverado ZR2 Has 700 HP
Verdad Gallardo
Coachbuilt N2A Anteros Is an LS2-Powered C6 Corvette In Italian Clothes
Verdad Gallardo
Awesome K5 Blazer Restomod Comes With C7 Corvette Power
Verdad Gallardo
10 Camaros You Should Never Buy
10 LS Engine Myths That Refuse to Die
Verdad Gallardo Coated is not the same as stainless. That is what everyone seems to be neglecting, stainless steel lasts, coatings do not. The collector is not the only thing that makes a difference, but it is the one of subject right now.
Tech Resident
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,117
Likes: 3
From: Philly
Originally Posted by SouthFL.02.SS
I bet his car would have performed about the same in the midrange. 
X benefits are up high.
Same car gained 2mph in the 1/4 with the X pipe over a conventional (SLP) Y-pipe when it was a cam-only setup.
X benefits are up high.
Same car gained 2mph in the 1/4 with the X pipe over a conventional (SLP) Y-pipe when it was a cam-only setup.
Originally Posted by 68birdls1
Coated is not the same as stainless. That is what everyone seems to be neglecting, stainless steel lasts, coatings do not. The collector is not the only thing that makes a difference, but it is the one of subject right now.
I am speaking however of cheaper priced 321 and 304 Stainless headers (like XS...etc). My assertion is that at almost double the price, top-dollar headers do not offer the kind of gains (10hp+) OVER the cheaper headers to justify their price.
Believe me, if I had $3000 to spare on exhaust, I would hand my car over to ARH and tell them I want the works. The best custom dual exhaust and headers on earth. I would be confident that I would be getting exactly that. However, in the real world, most people are quite limited in modification funds, so we expect that if we are paying twice as much for one brand over another, that brand better offer twice as good a product. I don't believe these brands do, in this case. One car seeing extraordinary gains is not proof of a better product.
Tech Resident
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,117
Likes: 3
From: Philly
Originally Posted by Blakbird24
I am speaking however of cheaper priced 321 and 304 Stainless headers (like XS...etc). My assertion is that at almost double the price, top-dollar headers do not offer the kind of gains (10hp+) OVER the cheaper headers to justify their price.
2.) with brands like QTP, ARH, kooks, hooker, edelbrock...you get customer service. XS is still an ebay company, so you get ebay service. when **** hits the fan with QTP, ARH, kooks, hooker, edelbrock, etc...i.e. you blow a hole in the primary or something...you know you're covered. plus, what happens a year from now? will the XS company still be around? QTP, ARH, kooks, hooker, and edelbrock will be. is an extra $250 worth guaranteed customer service and the assurance that the company will be there if you run into problems?
just remember: when you pay extra money for a product, sometimes, it's not just the product you are getting. XS has a great product for the money, but you're only getting a header for it. when you buy the more expensive ones, you're getting a header and a company. IMO, it's worth it.
Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369
1.) XS headers are temporarily priced at what they are. remember what i said earlier: the market is flooded. XS is coming into a market with A LOT of competition, and the competition is proven. if XS sells well, don't expect them to be priced like this long.
Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369
2.) with brands like QTP, ARH, kooks, hooker, edelbrock...you get customer service. XS is still an ebay company, so you get ebay service. when **** hits the fan with QTP, ARH, kooks, hooker, edelbrock, etc...i.e. you blow a hole in the primary or something...you know you're covered. plus, what happens a year from now? will the XS company still be around? QTP, ARH, kooks, hooker, and edelbrock will be. is an extra $250 worth guaranteed customer service and the assurance that the company will be there if you run into problems?
just remember: when you pay extra money for a product, sometimes, it's not just the product you are getting. XS has a great product for the money, but you're only getting a header for it. when you buy the more expensive ones, you're getting a header and a company. IMO, it's worth it.
just remember: when you pay extra money for a product, sometimes, it's not just the product you are getting. XS has a great product for the money, but you're only getting a header for it. when you buy the more expensive ones, you're getting a header and a company. IMO, it's worth it.
It's entirely subjective, but I come from the opposite school of thought that you do. You are willing to pay for security. I don't trust others to provide security. I provide my own. No one works on my car except me and guys that I have known and worked with for years. When I buy a product, I research it before I put out the money, to make sure that i'm going to get a good product right from the start. As long as it's well built from the start, I can take care of the rest. If it breaks because my 500hp car overstressed it, i'm not going crying to the company. It's not their fault, i'll fix it myself.
Now this is all a case of perspective. If you do not have the experience and abilities that I do, then customer service is much more important to you. However, I can say that the few times I have bought into highly reputable customer service, i have been largely dissapointed. So at this point, the promise of a company standing behind their product is worth $40 to me, not $400.
All that said, my point is very simple. At half the price, right now, of the high-dollar setups, the XS headers are the way to go...they are every bit as well built as QTP and Kooks pieces. They may or may not perform as well, but even if they don't, we'll be talking about maybe a 5hp deficiency AT MOST. That's not worth $400.
!LS1 11 Second Club
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 7,133
Likes: 2
From: Miami
Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369
X benefits up high when compared to an H-pipe. when you compare true duals to a y-pipe, as long as you have a merge (x-pipe, h-pipe, resonator box), you're going to gain in the midrange.
http://www.drgas.com/store/product.p...6&cat=0&page=1
Dr. Gas® 2-into-1 Y-Pipe Merge Collectors for Street and Racing Applications
Replacing a factory 2-into-1 joint with a Dr. Gas merge Y-pipe collector will produce gains from 2-7 h.p. Dr. Gas makes inexpensive, straight, curved 90 degree and special angle inlet angle Y-pipe merge pipes. Torque and horse-power improvements can approach the gains from an X-crossover in a single exhaust systems.
Replacing a factory 2-into-1 joint with a Dr. Gas merge Y-pipe collector will produce gains from 2-7 h.p. Dr. Gas makes inexpensive, straight, curved 90 degree and special angle inlet angle Y-pipe merge pipes. Torque and horse-power improvements can approach the gains from an X-crossover in a single exhaust systems.
I personally just got my QTP headers today. I also have a brand new set of XS headers i bought from a member here I paid 700 for the QTP and 300 for the XS's Just looking over the design of the 2 the QTP does look like a better header design more straight flowing primaries with less bends and turns then the XS.
As for quality i think it would only be known in a couple years when i have had both headers on different cars and they have gotten some "beating" on them. but initially the QTP are heavier and feel more heavy duty then the XS's however one thing i am concerned about is the flange welds. the XS are welded all th way around the primary where as the more expensive QTP have what looks like 4 tach welds on at the 12, 3. 6, 9 o'clock positions. for the money i was really hoping for a complete weld all the way around the primary and flange. but if they hold up over time i guess it's no big deal. Time will be the judge of that one
As for quality i think it would only be known in a couple years when i have had both headers on different cars and they have gotten some "beating" on them. but initially the QTP are heavier and feel more heavy duty then the XS's however one thing i am concerned about is the flange welds. the XS are welded all th way around the primary where as the more expensive QTP have what looks like 4 tach welds on at the 12, 3. 6, 9 o'clock positions. for the money i was really hoping for a complete weld all the way around the primary and flange. but if they hold up over time i guess it's no big deal. Time will be the judge of that one
TECH Regular
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 450
Likes: 0
From: Over Here and Over There
Originally Posted by Formula_Power
I personally just got my QTP headers today. I also have a brand new set of XS headers i bought from a member here I paid 700 for the QTP and 300 for the XS's Just looking over the design of the 2 the QTP does look like a better header design more straight flowing primaries with less bends and turns then the XS.
As for quality i think it would only be known in a couple years when i have had both headers on different cars and they have gotten some "beating" on them. but initially the QTP are heavier and feel more heavy duty then the XS's however one thing i am concerned about is the flange welds. the XS are welded all th way around the primary where as the more expensive QTP have what looks like 4 tach welds on at the 12, 3. 6, 9 o'clock positions. for the money i was really hoping for a complete weld all the way around the primary and flange. but if they hold up over time i guess it's no big deal. Time will be the judge of that one
As for quality i think it would only be known in a couple years when i have had both headers on different cars and they have gotten some "beating" on them. but initially the QTP are heavier and feel more heavy duty then the XS's however one thing i am concerned about is the flange welds. the XS are welded all th way around the primary where as the more expensive QTP have what looks like 4 tach welds on at the 12, 3. 6, 9 o'clock positions. for the money i was really hoping for a complete weld all the way around the primary and flange. but if they hold up over time i guess it's no big deal. Time will be the judge of that one
The outside are just tach welds, inside is where it counts.
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,132
Likes: 0
From: Grand Rapids, Michigan
Originally Posted by Formula_Power
I personally just got my QTP headers today. I also have a brand new set of XS headers i bought from a member here I paid 700 for the QTP and 300 for the XS's Just looking over the design of the 2 the QTP does look like a better header design more straight flowing primaries with less bends and turns then the XS.
As for quality i think it would only be known in a couple years when i have had both headers on different cars and they have gotten some "beating" on them. but initially the QTP are heavier and feel more heavy duty then the XS's however one thing i am concerned about is the flange welds. the XS are welded all th way around the primary where as the more expensive QTP have what looks like 4 tach welds on at the 12, 3. 6, 9 o'clock positions. for the money i was really hoping for a complete weld all the way around the primary and flange. but if they hold up over time i guess it's no big deal. Time will be the judge of that one
As for quality i think it would only be known in a couple years when i have had both headers on different cars and they have gotten some "beating" on them. but initially the QTP are heavier and feel more heavy duty then the XS's however one thing i am concerned about is the flange welds. the XS are welded all th way around the primary where as the more expensive QTP have what looks like 4 tach welds on at the 12, 3. 6, 9 o'clock positions. for the money i was really hoping for a complete weld all the way around the primary and flange. but if they hold up over time i guess it's no big deal. Time will be the judge of that one
Originally Posted by Hard Core Z28
Flip the header and look at the cyl head side of the flange. I bet you that the XS are not welded on the inside where is counts, and the you will see lips from the tubing.
The outside are just tach welds, inside is where it counts.
The outside are just tach welds, inside is where it counts.
IIRC, they are welded inside also.
Tech Resident
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,117
Likes: 3
From: Philly
Originally Posted by SouthFL.02.SS
Tech Resident
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,117
Likes: 3
From: Philly
Originally Posted by Blakbird24
This is the same as the "extended warranty" argument.
It's entirely subjective, but I come from the opposite school of thought that you do. You are willing to pay for security.
It's entirely subjective, but I come from the opposite school of thought that you do. You are willing to pay for security.
look at it this way: would you buy a GM car if you knew a year from now, GM would be bankrupt and you could no longer buy any GM parts? without a warranty, you can always buy the parts and fix them yourself. well, pretend that GM doesn't exist and can't even make parts. this means if it's broken, it's permanently broken.
these are stainless headers. i believe the warranties are lifetime? at least they should be. this is not an "extended warranty." i'm not paying any extra. the warranty comes with the product at no extra cost. i know if i blow a hole through the primary a year from now, QTP will be there and replace the product for me. i know QTP will be around. the XS guys may not be around next week for all we know. that means if you blow a hole in the primary, the headers are useless. mine will never be useless.
this is much more than an "extended warranty." this is customer service. this is whether or not this company will even exist a year or more down the road.
i've said it before and i'll say it again, the XS headers are a great product for the price, there is no arguing that. however, you also cannot argue that the QTP/Kooks/ARH headers are better, and you can't argue that you're getting a better company and a better warranty buying the higher dollar headers. the cost justification is there. the only question is, is the justification good enough for you?