SouthFL.02.SS

It was my car.
Went from X to Y for noise reasons (TD's are real fun at first, but shaking your house and your neighbor's house on startup in the morning with cam lope gets old- even after going to Magnaflow 4x9's), along with clearance reasons (not being able to clear speedbumps and curbcuts gets old).
I did use the dual cutout Y-pipe for continuing fun factor. Funny thing, with dual cutouts open, only a few hp were gained on the dyno.

68birdls1

iTrader: (46)

I know exactly what you mean by the true duals, I had some on my last trans am, and with just headers and them it was insane. I made a huge mistake taking it on a road trip lol, lets just say that will never happen again.
But I have been looking real hard at the Qtp y pipe and it just seems like a lot for that piece you know. So what made you go with the mufflex? I just looked at it and it is priced at $289 which seems much better. How did that hook up to your Qtp's? Any problems?

SouthFL.02.SS

Mufflex Y-pipe = QTP Y-pipe

68birdls1

iTrader: (46)

Really?!? Lol, well I guess that makes it much simplier haha. Thanks alot for all the help bud. One last question... If you were to do it again, would you buy a premade y like you did or get the flowmaster y and have it built?

SouthFL.02.SS

The mufflex/qtp y comes like a puzzle of parts. It is a bitch to install properly. Once in right, clearance is good.
One could always do a custom y with the scavenger merge bought from Summit or Jegs.
I would do the mufflex again, installed on a lift by a shop with a welder to weld the Y-merge to the 4" to 3" cone reducer, as the band clamp provided for that connection doesn't work well. Trimming the I-pipe to subtract for the added length of the Y-merge and cone reducer was necessary.

Also, turbo style v clamps worked well at the header collectors on my setup- instead of using conventional 3" band clamps (the HVMC collectors are of a smaller diameter than the norm).

68birdls1

iTrader: (46)

I have never seen the HVMC in person, and the pics that I have seen don't really help me much, but when you connect the y pipe to the header, how does that work? How big is the collector on the HVMC's? And I have been hearing alot of good things about the v-band clamos.

Blakbird24

iTrader: (24)

All i've seen is one reliable dyno example of one car using one set of headers and gaining X amount of power over what it previously had. If that's all i need to present to get $800 out of hundreds of members of the general public, then have I got a deal for you!

Sorry, for me it takes proof of REPEATABLE and RELIABLE gains over cheaper products. I still have not seen that here. Until I see several dyno examples of cars that went from a cheap set of headers to QTPs on the same tune without changing anything else and gained significant horsepower, i'm fine and happy with what i've got.

spy2520

iTrader: (3)

if it is the collector that makes all the difference, i think edelbrock has HVMCs on their headers, i think they are 1.875 stepped to 1.75. they are also inexpensive since they are coated.

68birdls1

iTrader: (46)

Coated is not the same as stainless. That is what everyone seems to be neglecting, stainless steel lasts, coatings do not. The collector is not the only thing that makes a difference, but it is the one of subject right now.

ChocoTaco369

X benefits up high when compared to an H-pipe. when you compare true duals to a y-pipe, as long as you have a merge (x-pipe, h-pipe, resonator box), you're going to gain in the midrange.

Blakbird24

iTrader: (24)

Yes I wanted to clarify too, if you are comparing coated pacesetters to QTPs, then there are obvious advantages that QTP (and Kooks, ARH...etc) have to justify their price.

I am speaking however of cheaper priced 321 and 304 Stainless headers (like XS...etc). My assertion is that at almost double the price, top-dollar headers do not offer the kind of gains (10hp+) OVER the cheaper headers to justify their price.

Believe me, if I had $3000 to spare on exhaust, I would hand my car over to ARH and tell them I want the works. The best custom dual exhaust and headers on earth. I would be confident that I would be getting exactly that. However, in the real world, most people are quite limited in modification funds, so we expect that if we are paying twice as much for one brand over another, that brand better offer twice as good a product. I don't believe these brands do, in this case. One car seeing extraordinary gains is not proof of a better product.

ChocoTaco369

1.) XS headers are temporarily priced at what they are. remember what i said earlier: the market is flooded. XS is coming into a market with A LOT of competition, and the competition is proven. if XS sells well, don't expect them to be priced like this long.

2.) with brands like QTP, ARH, kooks, hooker, edelbrock...you get customer service. XS is still an ebay company, so you get ebay service. when **** hits the fan with QTP, ARH, kooks, hooker, edelbrock, etc...i.e. you blow a hole in the primary or something...you know you're covered. plus, what happens a year from now? will the XS company still be around? QTP, ARH, kooks, hooker, and edelbrock will be. is an extra $250 worth guaranteed customer service and the assurance that the company will be there if you run into problems?

just remember: when you pay extra money for a product, sometimes, it's not just the product you are getting. XS has a great product for the money, but you're only getting a header for it. when you buy the more expensive ones, you're getting a header and a company. IMO, it's worth it.

Blakbird24

iTrader: (24)

Good point. I agree with you there.

This is the same as the "extended warranty" argument.

It's entirely subjective, but I come from the opposite school of thought that you do. You are willing to pay for security. I don't trust others to provide security. I provide my own. No one works on my car except me and guys that I have known and worked with for years. When I buy a product, I research it before I put out the money, to make sure that i'm going to get a good product right from the start. As long as it's well built from the start, I can take care of the rest. If it breaks because my 500hp car overstressed it, i'm not going crying to the company. It's not their fault, i'll fix it myself.

Now this is all a case of perspective. If you do not have the experience and abilities that I do, then customer service is much more important to you. However, I can say that the few times I have bought into highly reputable customer service, i have been largely dissapointed. So at this point, the promise of a company standing behind their product is worth $40 to me, not $400.

All that said, my point is very simple. At half the price, right now, of the high-dollar setups, the XS headers are the way to go...they are every bit as well built as QTP and Kooks pieces. They may or may not perform as well, but even if they don't, we'll be talking about maybe a 5hp deficiency AT MOST. That's not worth $400.

SouthFL.02.SS

http://www.drgas.com/store/product.p...6&cat=0&page=1

Formula_Power

iTrader: (18)

I personally just got my QTP headers today. I also have a brand new set of XS headers i bought from a member here I paid 700 for the QTP and 300 for the XS's Just looking over the design of the 2 the QTP does look like a better header design more straight flowing primaries with less bends and turns then the XS.

As for quality i think it would only be known in a couple years when i have had both headers on different cars and they have gotten some "beating" on them. but initially the QTP are heavier and feel more heavy duty then the XS's however one thing i am concerned about is the flange welds. the XS are welded all th way around the primary where as the more expensive QTP have what looks like 4 tach welds on at the 12, 3. 6, 9 o'clock positions. for the money i was really hoping for a complete weld all the way around the primary and flange. but if they hold up over time i guess it's no big deal. Time will be the judge of that one

Hard Core Z28

Flip the header and look at the cyl head side of the flange. I bet you that the XS are not welded on the inside where is counts, and the you will see lips from the tubing.

The outside are just tach welds, inside is where it counts.

AK's WS6

QTP's are tacked on the outside but they welded completely around from the inside out.

Country Boy

iTrader: (24)

IIRC, they are welded inside also.

ChocoTaco369

read what you wrote. yes, they "can approach the gain." they will never equal or surpass. they can only "approach." this means there will be a small horsepower loss, but still a horsepower loss. it's a percentage. on a 408, that "approaching gain" can be 20 horsepower or more at certain rpm's i'm willing to bet.

ChocoTaco369

that's where you're wrong. this is completely different from the "extended warranty" argument. this is the case of "will this company actually be around a year from now?"

look at it this way: would you buy a GM car if you knew a year from now, GM would be bankrupt and you could no longer buy any GM parts? without a warranty, you can always buy the parts and fix them yourself. well, pretend that GM doesn't exist and can't even make parts. this means if it's broken, it's permanently broken.

these are stainless headers. i believe the warranties are lifetime? at least they should be. this is not an "extended warranty." i'm not paying any extra. the warranty comes with the product at no extra cost. i know if i blow a hole through the primary a year from now, QTP will be there and replace the product for me. i know QTP will be around. the XS guys may not be around next week for all we know. that means if you blow a hole in the primary, the headers are useless. mine will never be useless.

this is much more than an "extended warranty." this is customer service. this is whether or not this company will even exist a year or more down the road.

i've said it before and i'll say it again, the XS headers are a great product for the price, there is no arguing that. however, you also cannot argue that the QTP/Kooks/ARH headers are better, and you can't argue that you're getting a better company and a better warranty buying the higher dollar headers. the cost justification is there. the only question is, is the justification good enough for you?