CalSpeedPerformance

iTrader: (64)

Wrong, your basing your opinion off no real world experience/knowledge

Datzneat

iTrader: (4)

I went with the tsp 1 7/8s and never looked back. Read the link the tsp guy put up.

ChocoTaco369

And you can prove that statement with....? I'm gonna go with "you're wrong, your opinion is based off of no real world experience/knowledge."

Datzneat

iTrader: (4)

Enlighten us then Choco. With your real world experience/knowledge. Prove him wrong. If you can. I think some pretty convincing knowledge has already been posted up disproving your theory.

LS1_K1DD

iTrader: (3)

Go with Pacesetters and save a little cash for something else. Flow just fine and will provide a decent gain. Best for the money.

99 Blue Bird

iTrader: (3)

i have tsp 1 7/8 long tubes. they work great. just go for it dude. you said you wanted a agressive dd. and the 1 7/8 will leave you with more options in the long run.

ChocoTaco369

Like what? And don't show me a dyno that begins at 3500 rpms. Don't show me a dyno showing two totally different brands competing. Both are completely meaningless.

Header manufacturers design 1 3/4" headers for these cars for a reason. They run better on virtually every 346 motor out there. Unless you're running FI or big cubes, there is no point. You'll only be costing yourself low end power - power dynos don't show - in the vast majority of cases. Plenty of sponsors and pro's have come on here saying that you want 1 3/4" in virtually every 346 package with possibly exception to the most aggressive setups on the market. A cam only car doesn't fit into that category.

So please, show me the "evidence" you speak of. Make sure it's relevant. If it's not a dyno of 1 3/4" headers vs. 1 7/8" headers, fully tuned with the same AFR, same brand and same design on the same car on the same day, same dyno, same humidity and it shows the power and torque from 1500 rpms up, it's meaningless.

Forgive me for siding with header manufacturers on my decision. I should have listened to Datzneat and SoCalSpd when I bought my headers How I missed those two vast tomes of knowledge, I'll never know

I'm wrong. Buy 1 7/8 headers for your bolt-on cars. More guys on the road I can beat

LS1_K1DD

iTrader: (3)

^owned.

mchdg86

iTrader: (3)

If you are racing below 3500 RPMs then you are doing something very wrong. And who cares about power gains at 1500 RPMs? The car will still have plenty of power there to cruise and accelerate. And if he dosent have the umph at 1500 RPMs just downshift. Thats why transmissions have more than one gear.

ChocoTaco369

When I launch, I have to make it completely through first gear. I have a stock stall, so when my car shifts, it falls back into the 4,000 rpm range. My car is a street car. It spends 99% of its time underneath 2500 rpms.

I love these guys that come on here claiming that low end power doesn't matter on their bolt-on and cam-only cars. I rarely ever wind up past 3500 rpm's. I care about low end power more than top end power because that's where I spend all my time. On a NA 346, you're not going to pick up any peak horsepowepr on a 1 7/8" header. You're only going to lose low-end. Unless you plan on going FI or big cubes, I, along with many pro's and header manufacturers alike, will continue to run 1 3/4" headers.

My car traps plenty high enough to turn a mid to low 12. I'll stick with what I have. If you want to lose crucial torque and average horsepower, downgrade to the larger header. I have plenty of flow in my exhaust for my power level. Exhaust gas velocity is my #1 concern, and you get a lot more with a 1 3/4" header.

Sales4@Texas-Speed

iTrader: (4)

Have you done any dyno tests to back up that statement? Maybe on a stock car you wouldn't see pick up but on a highly modified 346 there is definately power to be picked up with an 1 7/8 header.

TheSilverOne

iTrader: (22)

stick to seafoam choco

Coreyc619

if your doi heads and a biggass ms4 go 1 7/8. ive got 1 7/8 on my stock 853 heads with a stock ls1 intake my car mph's at 108 thru an auto at 3700 lbs. i dont think im losin power lol. plus you have room to grow as others have stated. the guy at texas speed even has dyno numbers to form his opinion.. what more do you need?

bottom line is either way dont sweat it, you'll be fine.

chaco taco.. you're hillarious. when i was researching headers you were literally in EVERY header thread i searched and found. lol. not sayin your opinions are good or bad - not criticizing your view point i just find it funny. *not pickin on you at all, you believe in your small primaries, and "theory" is worth the discussion ; )

35th SS

iTrader: (2)

I run edelbrock stepped to 1 7/8 on the 35th.soon to ditch those mac mids on the blk one for some ARHs 1 7/8s.

Johnnystock

iTrader: (6)

thats a good idea too..its always about cash after all

About me, I'm thinking to swap the old 1 3/4 for the new tsp 1 7/8...but my old 1 3/4 do the the job well thoughl! I'll wait for bigger ci to invest on that, I guess.

Ice78Transam

iTrader: (1)

3/4. You wont look back.

Datzneat

iTrader: (4)

Let's see. If you had actually understood my post you would have posted up evidence. Since you have none you keep spouting your opinion which nobody cares about. There has already been evidence posted up in this thread which you just choose to ignore. So until you post up some real evidence your opinion is meaningless. As for your siding with header manufactures b.s., they make the 1 7/8 for a reason. For people that want more out of their car than to sit in traffic like you.

LS1_K1DD

iTrader: (3)

Are you running TSP's duals as well? I would like to hear a sound clip if you are

jmill96Z

iTrader: (3)

My car runs with 1 3/4 right now. They do just fine.

I would look at the 7/8's as an investment for future mods. I hate buying parts twice. If you're gonna go big later, start buying the right parts now.

ChocoTaco369

Funny, I don't see any evidence in this thread. All I see is a pissing match between a bunch of kids on an internet forum. There is ZERO evidence offered in this thread. I see is one sponsor saying stick with 1 3/4" headers and another sponsor that sells their own brand of headers that only come in 1 7/8" saying otherwise if you really want to call that "evidence." I'd call it marketing. Not knocking Texas Speed, their headers look very nice and I'd take them over several other mild steel headers, but their comparison was between Pacesetters, one of the oldest headers being sold today (and quite undersized at that) and the dyno showed nothing under 3,000 rpms. All it showed was that their headers made a couple horsepower more at peak power - and I guarantee my headers would make more peak power than Pacesetters, too. Lots of headers make slightly more power than Pacesetters, and it's the design that makes it possible, not the volume of the primaries. Besides, it isn't a valid comparison because it's a totally different design, it doesn't show anything under 3,000 rpms and I don't think a tune was performed for each header.

Again, zero evidence. I'll stick to the header size designed for a 346. There's a reason why headers for these cars were determined to be 1 3/4" by every header manufacturer out there, and the ones that make larger headers recommend them only for much more serious builds. The only people that are arguing against this seem to be:

1.) Those that have larger headers
2.) Those that only sell the larger headers
3.) Those that think bigger is always better and understand nothing when it comes to fluid mechanics

But what do I know. I'm just a guy on an internet forum.

Keep arguing about it. I really don't care. It's totally stupid to argue over something so pointless. Buy whatever you want. I tried to help. If you don't want my opinion, don't read it. Everyone listen to Datzneat, he knows it all. I say, the more people on the road I can beat the better