Older 350 Engine Swap
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Teching In
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Older 350 Engine Swap Please forgive my newbieness with LS1 technology but...
What would be involved in swapping a standard 350 under the hood of my 2000 SS? Could any of the parts transfer over? Is the basic iron 350 block/heads similar enough to the LS1? My dream would be to build up a 383 stroker and swap it in place of the current LS1 while retaining an LS1 appearance, or am I just dreaming?
I would like to go this route if possible because the LS1 mod parts are rediculously expensive. I can get the standard hi-po 350 parts at my local convenience store for pennies. Opinions?
Thanks
What would be involved in swapping a standard 350 under the hood of my 2000 SS? Could any of the parts transfer over? Is the basic iron 350 block/heads similar enough to the LS1? My dream would be to build up a 383 stroker and swap it in place of the current LS1 while retaining an LS1 appearance, or am I just dreaming?
I would like to go this route if possible because the LS1 mod parts are rediculously expensive. I can get the standard hi-po 350 parts at my local convenience store for pennies. Opinions?Thanks
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From: Marysville, OH
You own a 2000 SS and are worried about the cost of things? It seems like you should buy an older gen 3 or maybe even an Lt-1 gen 4 and go that route. Ridding yourself of an Ls1 power plant would not be an easy or smart thing to do IMO.
They are completely different motors. Nothing is interchangeable. The LS1 is a superior motor and will out perform a standard 350 even if you stroke it to a 383. Not to mention the iron motor is heavier, uses 2bolt mains vs 6 bolt mains. THe rod length is 5.7 vs 6.2 the heads don't flow as well and the exhaust ports are in seperated equally in the LS1 vs the 350 with the siamize ports. I could go on and on. I will tell you what. I have a kick as 406 sm that I would trade you straight across for a stock LS1. I want to convert my 72 SS to a LS1. motor mounts are different as well.
I hope this helps you understand that the LS1 is a better motor.
Later,
I hope this helps you understand that the LS1 is a better motor.
Later,
Dont do it.Leave your car alone.If you want to build up a old 350 by a 3rd gen trans am or z and gut the heck out of it and build a all out drag car.if you do heads ,cam ,headers ,gears and tunning you will have a 11 sec car with a full interior and stock suspension.So it will still be a great car to drive on the street.It would be a crime to pull the LS1 engine out to put a old school 350 in .Unless the engine went 9"s or better in another car leave it a lone.Use your tax return money and buy some bolt on's.With out getting in the engine-just all bolt on's my 02 WS6 has gone a 12.09 at 113 with a 1.68 60.ft and that was with a stock suspension and there are still a coulple of other things i could have done to go 11's with out getting into the engine.In the process of doing heads and cam as we speak.The car should go 11.2 or better.Your half way there just haveing a LS1 under the hood.The LS1 has been named one of the best engines EVER built.Why would you want to mess with that.Your probly not a hard core racer so your basic bolt on's should do you just fine.
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Dont waste your time. The swap would be very hard, not emissions friendly, less powerfull, and heaver. The LS1 has such great heads that you can get to 400 RWHP for around 1,000 dollars or less if you get used parts. A cam and some springs, headers and a lid. This can be done on a budget too, you just gotta find the deals. Hell with a lid and headers your cranking 350 RWHP already.
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Just to add to what the others said.... I had a 350 in my 1970 Corvette that spun a rod bearing. Now I'm putting an LS1 in there. I was looking at 450crank-hp 383s (AFR heads, big Comp Cam, and a good rotating assembly) and it was going to cost ~$5k just for the motor. I'm swaping in a 2000 LS1 and when it's all said and done I should be around the same cost including motor, T56, all clutch parts, fuel system, aluminum radiator, electric fans, computer and wiring. Plus I'll have fuel injection and an overdrive transmission that I didn't have with the old 350 and 4 speed. And the best part.... no carb to mess with!
Just my two cents.
Just my two cents.
You guys do realize bigger HP numbers have been made with regular ole SBC 350 blocks than LSx, right?
To the original poster. I wouldn't go that route unless you are making it a track only car. Getting your accessories, electrical, etc setup will be costly by itself.
To the original poster. I wouldn't go that route unless you are making it a track only car. Getting your accessories, electrical, etc setup will be costly by itself.
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From: "Tr"Asheville
4mulaJoe- Where as you may be right however those engines streetability and driveability are nothing compared to the LSx based engines. So far the highest dyno numbers I've seen on a stock cubed LS1 are 491rwhp which equates to roughly 578hp at the crank. Now get an older style 350 NOT bored and NOT stroked to make that kind of power with the gas mileage and driveability you have with the LS1 and you'll find it's almost impossible. No flames intended just my opinion.
-Sly
-Sly
Originally Posted by slyws6
4mulaJoe- Where as you may be right however those engines streetability and driveability are nothing compared to the LSx based engines. So far the highest dyno numbers I've seen on a stock cubed LS1 are 491rwhp which equates to roughly 578hp at the crank. Now get an older style 350 NOT bored and NOT stroked to make that kind of power with the gas mileage and driveability you have with the LS1 and you'll find it's almost impossible. No flames intended just my opinion.
-Sly
-Sly
I guess you can make the rules. You win
Nobody is talking about streetability here anyway. You are off topic. That's all in the fuel injection and computer anyway. Results speak for themselves is all I'm saying. I'm happy with my ls1 for now.
Originally Posted by slyws6
4mulaJoe- Where as you may be right however those engines streetability and driveability are nothing compared to the LSx based engines. So far the highest dyno numbers I've seen on a stock cubed LS1 are 491rwhp which equates to roughly 578hp at the crank. Now get an older style 350 NOT bored and NOT stroked to make that kind of power with the gas mileage and driveability you have with the LS1 and you'll find it's almost impossible. No flames intended just my opinion. -Sly
Originally Posted by 4mulaJoe
I guess you can make the rules. You win
Nobody is talking about streetability here anyway. You are off topic. That's all in the fuel injection and computer anyway. Results speak for themselves is all I'm saying. I'm happy with my ls1 for now.
Nobody is talking about streetability here anyway. You are off topic. That's all in the fuel injection and computer anyway. Results speak for themselves is all I'm saying. I'm happy with my ls1 for now.
I agree with your streetability statements, a 450rwhp H/C LS1 is pretty streetable these days, especially with good tuning. I wouldn't install a SBC in a "driver", that's too much "reverse engineering" for me. With the prices of LS1 heads coming down, 400+rwhp is available for ~$2000, much less than the cost of building a 450+hp SBC and the cost of installation/modification/misc junk.
At some point, however, the SBCs strengths overshadow the LS1s for a "high end motor", IMO.
Shawn
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in swapping a standard 350 under the hood of my 2000 SS
Originally Posted by 4mulaJoe
You are off topic.
Originally Posted by blk~2000~Z28
I think you are the one who is off topic. SlyWs6 was responding to his original question about a "standard 350" swap. There is no question as to why you would not do this. If the old style 350 was so good i.e. HP, driveability, weight, etc. then I am sure that everyone would be chomping at the bit to rid themselves of their awful LS1. However it is not and cannot be as good in every category as the LS1 b/c of technology. It can be better in some i.e. HP but it will not be there in the other categories IMO.
Ok if you say so. I just re-read the original post. You aren't making any sense. I really don't care though. You can get similar characteristics out of both motors whichever route you take if you know what you are doing.
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From: Marysville, OH
Originally Posted by 4mulaJoe
You can get similar characteristics out of both motors whichever route you take if you know what you are doing.
? You have 350's with knock sensors and OBD-II software to control everything? Remember he did ask about a STANDARD 350, and the last time I checked standard 350 engines had none of those things. So you think I am making no sense when you are the one claiming
You can get similar characteristics out of both motors
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Teching In
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Thanks guys! This has both been educational and entertaining
At risk of getting flammed myself, I must admit that this is my first chevy. I have always been a die-hard mustang guy. That is where my technical knowledge of engines is. I can tell you exact part numbers for getting a 306 (.030 - 302) to 400 HP at the crank but I couldn't tell you much about chevys. I am learning though.
About my first chevy: the reason for moving to chevy was #1 got tired of very bad quality of fords, #2 got tired of very bad quality of dodge (I have a cara-crap van), and #3 to make my chevy die-hard father a happy old man
I have been impressed so far with the quality of this car. The only funny business I have run into is a driver side window that sometimes won't go up or down for several minutes, and I think the hydrolic clutch is going wacko. On one 5800 RPM shift from second to third, the clutch stayed down on the floor. I couldn't shift into fourth. Pulled it into nuetral, pulled back on the clutch pedal with my foot and it returned to normal. Hasn't done it since... but weird. The last thing is something electrical. As I am driving with lights on, they sometimes flicker. Not for long, just like the power to them went away for a second. Strange.
Anyway, thanks for all the education about the LS1. I will move towards bolt-ons for the LS1 and leave the old 350 for my 240Z.
At risk of getting flammed myself, I must admit that this is my first chevy. I have always been a die-hard mustang guy. That is where my technical knowledge of engines is. I can tell you exact part numbers for getting a 306 (.030 - 302) to 400 HP at the crank but I couldn't tell you much about chevys. I am learning though.
About my first chevy: the reason for moving to chevy was #1 got tired of very bad quality of fords, #2 got tired of very bad quality of dodge (I have a cara-crap van), and #3 to make my chevy die-hard father a happy old man
I have been impressed so far with the quality of this car. The only funny business I have run into is a driver side window that sometimes won't go up or down for several minutes, and I think the hydrolic clutch is going wacko. On one 5800 RPM shift from second to third, the clutch stayed down on the floor. I couldn't shift into fourth. Pulled it into nuetral, pulled back on the clutch pedal with my foot and it returned to normal. Hasn't done it since... but weird. The last thing is something electrical. As I am driving with lights on, they sometimes flicker. Not for long, just like the power to them went away for a second. Strange.
Anyway, thanks for all the education about the LS1. I will move towards bolt-ons for the LS1 and leave the old 350 for my 240Z.
)