87gtNOS

ok, here's a question....I can install dot to dot and be PERFECT as long as my 'custom' cam from PatG was ordered through him? I believe he gets the cam before I would and he VERIFIES it's accuracy?

I would assume if it was off 2 deg he would advise me to install it either +/- that amount? (then I would need to degree it??!!)

Thanks

alexus6798

iTrader: (24)

I'm wondering the same thing now as i ordered a custom grind and would really like what I paid for!!!!

Rikoshay

It's like getting a wheel alignment. If a tech is lazy he will make sure your caster/camber are within the "Green", which is usually +/- 5 degrees and say it's good to go, but your car still pulls to one side. Then you look at the print-out and it shows the right side is -5 and left is +5.

A cam can certainly be installed D2D, which is "close enough" in the +/- window, but if you want to get the maximum performance out of the grind and have it operate in the window that the manufacturer has specified then it needs to open/close at exactly the correct degree of crankshaft revolution. Only way to do that is with a degree wheel and rotating the crank clockwise.

alexus6798

iTrader: (24)

Do shops usually do this, or does it have to be specified and then you won't really know that it has been done if they say so?

Oldass

People also use it for ajustability. More of a racing application. Advancing or retarding a cam a few degrees can move the power range up and down. Checking one can be intimidating at first, but, as already stated, it's not too bad once you do it a few times.

WARP211

Can someone post u;p a Thread about degree a cam? I check Crane's website but I still don't get it.. can you degree it with the heads off? Or is it more accurate to degree with the heads on? Also if you have a andjustable timing chain the moves in incurements of 2 how do you degree it properley if you just need one degree?

Oldass

I don't know of any threads for it , but there are several hot rod type books that cover it. How to Build and Modify GM LS- Series engines is one of the ones I have. Amazon Books lists several.

3rdCoastPowerSports

iTrader: (5)

you really should stick the cam in straight up, then degree it... you need to find your intake ICL by using a degree wheel. once you verify your intake ICL then you can subtract it by your lobe separation and that would be your built in advance or lack there of built in advance depending on your results. then you can adjust your timing set to get the advance your looking for. For example if you have a intake center line (ICL) of 110 and the cam is on a 114 LSA then you would subtract 110 ICL from 114 LSA = 4* of ground in advance already built into this cam. most people like to run either 2* advance or 4* advance, depending on application. keep in mind that just because your cam card says the cam is this and this and your cam builder says the cam is this and this doesn't mean it is.

3rdCoastPowerSports

iTrader: (5)

by the way i agree with Oldass, alot of what is covered on here can be looked up in a book. the book Oldass recommended is a must have for LS guys,,,

3rdCoastPowerSports

iTrader: (5)

you can degree with heads on or heads off its your choice... you wont be able to take your PTV measurements with the heads off though.
one degree aint gonna make a whole lot of differance,,, is this a GT series car and motor that needs every last HP and weight savings or is it a street car that you want to be as fast as possible,,,, if its the later you aint gonna notice one degree and the dyno wont either (hense why the degree kit moves in 2*)

spiro27

this is a realy good post. which kit is best i think comp cams have one too. does anyone have a video of a ls1 engine having cam degreed.

nastychevelle

iTrader: (7)

Just because the lobes are accurate doesnt mean the cam will install right. the dowel could be off, the hole on your timing set could be off (stock GM ones are usually pretty good) the keyway could be off on the crank, same with the key-way on the lower timing gear. That's why its important to check and move if necessary.

j_tizzle_84

iTrader: (6)

here this may help shed some light for you

http://www.gmhightechperformance.com...m/viewall.html

mwoods35670

When u go dot to dot,that means if you are in time.but all performance cams are bought with an end result in mind.to achieve that result your cam needs to be set up with correct degree.118 120 116.what a degree wheel does is sets your true top dead center.which can be off by a few degrees easily on timing marks and timing key,casting marks.this is were you can mark your crank pulley and timing cover now.because most ls has none.then you use dial indicator to find centerline of lobe lift.that way you can accurately find came centerline.then using offset gear,adjust cam timing perfectly. Usually timing is 2-4 degrees of.and it will make a noticeable difference. Truly worth the effort.and when your done,your cam timing knowledge will benefit.

Mike TA

iTrader: (6)

Here is a link for how to degree a cam. It has illustrations. I am going a head cam set up right now. To be honest I was just going to go "dot to dot" After reading this thread and reviewing this link I think I will degree it instead. This kit is $115 which I would not consider to be too expensive to make sure it is done right but I will shop around to see if a cheaper one can be had. It doesnt look to difficult to do. I hope this helps.

http://www.lunatipower.com/Tech/Cams...egreeACam.aspx

Mike TA

iTrader: (6)

Here is a video from Comp Cams on how to do it with the heads on


Hopefully this helps as well.

rpturbo

iTrader: (47)

I am merely restating what has been said on here, so I do not know if it is true, but if anyone on here follows Denmah, you know he builds the sloppy cars. The last Fairmont 5 that he had all of the issues with, well, was down like 200hp, all in the end, ended up being a cam that was off by ~8*. Granted this is a boosted application, and it was a lot, but that is a prime example of WHY a cam should be degreed.

Matt (Denmah) has probably built more cars this year than most of us have in the past 5, and d2d normally works "good enough" but just reading the Farmont 5 build you can feel the aggravation and I couldn't imagine the amount of time he spent chasing the problem. Just my guess is that he will probably degree in the next "High power performer" he builds, or may go back and at least check it after if he can't find his power.