Any ideas? At a loss with my LS1
02-28-2014, 11:12 AM
#21
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Now im stuck again. Used the push rod tool and came up with 7.350 length push rods needed. I got them from Texas speed and installed.The oil pressure issue and smoke is now gone but the valves are rattleing louder than they were before. The tool i thought pretty much reassured us 7.350 would work but im now thinking its not the case. Any ideas? Heads are pretty much brand new completely gone through before install. Thanks in advance.
02-28-2014, 11:21 AM
#22
Is the 7.350 you came up with the actual measured length of the rod? If the actual push rod came up with 7.350 @ zero lash, then you need to add preload to it, for stock lifters around .080, that leaves you at 7.430, so 7.425 would be the closest size. If you did all that and came up with 7.350 AFTER adding preload, then disregard my post. 
02-28-2014, 11:45 AM
#23
.080 seems a tad much on the preload. Esp for ls7 lifters.
If you replaced the cam then you could have the cam timing off. You would be surprised how pushrod/lifter noise can sound nearly the same as valve hitting piston noise.
If you replaced the cam then you could have the cam timing off. You would be surprised how pushrod/lifter noise can sound nearly the same as valve hitting piston noise.
02-28-2014, 06:33 PM
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Is the 7.350 you came up with the actual measured length of the rod? If the actual push rod came up with 7.350 @ zero lash, then you need to add preload to it, for stock lifters around .080, that leaves you at 7.430, so 7.425 would be the closest size. If you did all that and came up with 7.350 AFTER adding preload, then disregard my post.
02-28-2014, 06:36 PM
#27
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Thats usually an issue if its installed with the engine in the car more than doing the install out of the car i would think?? I could be wrong about that idk. The install on the chain and gears was done on a engine stand. Would the tuner have been able to catch that by any chance ya think?
02-28-2014, 06:39 PM
#28
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Since the new install on the pushrods it has only been run about 5-10 minutes (idle only) now in different forums people have mentioned the fact that the ls7 lifters can take sometime to pump up or prime however you call it. Has anyone else heard that? Im thinkin maybe the lifters havent had time to pump up with oil yet.
02-28-2014, 07:12 PM
#29
I had one drop to 20 psi oil pressure just after cam swap and running it a bit. Spun two cam bearings . Had to pull it back out. This would relate to top end noise due to the top end not getting any oil. Drain oil and check it for metal shavings. Seems like the factory cam bearings are crap and some just don't make the cam swap.
02-28-2014, 07:26 PM
#30
You cannot really tell in the scans if the cam timing is on or off. It is still possible depending on the timing set you use. The stock one has a really large half moon to line it up with. It can be somewhat odd to line up exactly.
But there are quite a few people that read way too much on the internet and want to inspect to much to blame one thing or the other. The LS7 lifters *normally* like .060 preload, which is roughly 1 1/8 - 1 1/4 turns of the rocker bolt from 0 net movement. Nearly all aftermarket cams have a somewhat smaller base circle on the lobe. If they didnt, the lobes would be larger than the journals.
So that being said, honestly every camshaft should come with a pushrod length checker so you can make 100% sure you get the correct ones. You can get close with 7.400 as the stockers are in the 7.39x range and they are just a tad longer which may get you in the zone of .040-.090 roughly, but if you get on either end of that you can have an overly noisy valve train.
Cliff's notes: measure, measure, measure
But there are quite a few people that read way too much on the internet and want to inspect to much to blame one thing or the other. The LS7 lifters *normally* like .060 preload, which is roughly 1 1/8 - 1 1/4 turns of the rocker bolt from 0 net movement. Nearly all aftermarket cams have a somewhat smaller base circle on the lobe. If they didnt, the lobes would be larger than the journals.
So that being said, honestly every camshaft should come with a pushrod length checker so you can make 100% sure you get the correct ones. You can get close with 7.400 as the stockers are in the 7.39x range and they are just a tad longer which may get you in the zone of .040-.090 roughly, but if you get on either end of that you can have an overly noisy valve train.
Cliff's notes: measure, measure, measure
03-01-2014, 10:31 PM
#31
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I had one drop to 20 psi oil pressure just after cam swap and running it a bit. Spun two cam bearings . Had to pull it back out. This would relate to top end noise due to the top end not getting any oil. Drain oil and check it for metal shavings. Seems like the factory cam bearings are crap and some just don't make the cam swap.
03-01-2014, 10:40 PM
#32
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You cannot really tell in the scans if the cam timing is on or off. It is still possible depending on the timing set you use. The stock one has a really large half moon to line it up with. It can be somewhat odd to line up exactly. But there are quite a few people that read way too much on the internet and want to inspect to much to blame one thing or the other. The LS7 lifters *normally* like .060 preload, which is roughly 1 1/8 - 1 1/4 turns of the rocker bolt from 0 net movement. Nearly all aftermarket cams have a somewhat smaller base circle on the lobe. If they didnt, the lobes would be larger than the journals. So that being said, honestly every camshaft should come with a pushrod length checker so you can make 100% sure you get the correct ones. You can get close with 7.400 as the stockers are in the 7.39x range and they are just a tad longer which may get you in the zone of .040-.090 roughly, but if you get on either end of that you can have an overly noisy valve train. Cliff's notes: measure, measure, measure
No smoke this time. Oil pressure was great and then dropped to 25psi after about 45 mins of running. The gentleman i had finish up the build for me due to my work schedule did tell me he didnt ad preload to the pushrod measurement. He said he came up with 7.350" measurement with the tool. But added no preload but did have zero valve lash. So is it a possibility ill need longer pushrods? If i had 7.350 measured what length would i need with preload on top of that?
THANKS FOR ALL YOUR HELP GUYS.
03-02-2014, 03:39 PM
#34
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We used the 7.400 and we had determined the pushrods were too long so we thought. We were under the impression it was keeping the valves open and lifters down. The 7.4 had ware on the lifter side where it had rubbed the paint off. Would them being too long cause oil pressure loss and smoke?
03-02-2014, 04:59 PM
#35
If he measured 7.350 with zero preload then 7.400 would not "keep the valves open and hold the lifters down". The normal operating preload range of the stock or ls7 lifters is accepted at .040-.080. We normally aim for .060 which is an avg of 1 1/8 turns to 1 1/4 turns of the bolt after zero net lash/play.
03-02-2014, 08:20 PM
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If he measured 7.350 with zero preload then 7.400 would not "keep the valves open and hold the lifters down". The normal operating preload range of the stock or ls7 lifters is accepted at .040-.080. We normally aim for .060 which is an avg of 1 1/8 turns to 1 1/4 turns of the bolt after zero net lash/play.
03-10-2014, 02:32 PM
#39
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Alright. Got the 7.400 pushrods in and installed and the valvetrain noise has really decreased a lot. Seems to run better and is quieter. Everything was great and as i drove it it started happening again. I know the 7.400 pushrods were correct and there was no smoking at all.
As the car warmed up and got hot the oil pressure slowly dropped. Once at 20psi it begins to tick once the rpms are up in the 2300 range. I have to get my rpms up to there on a light throttle in order for it to move due to the stall. Once it reaches those RPM's on a hot engine and oil it starts to tick like a lifter tick. Shut the car off and let it cool for 10mins an start it again it is gone and will not come back till the temp increases.
Whenever engine is cold no noise at higher rpms and good oil pressure. Engine hot at higher rpms oil pressure is low and starts the tick. I bought a mechanical gauge and havent hooked it up yet. The factory gauge seems to be very accurate when cold....no jump in the needle, reads 60+ psi, smooth and as the engine gets warmer it starts to show something going on with the pressure.
Seems like a typical pickup tube o-ring issue and the oil pressure being so low is causing the lifter not to pump up and makes it sound and run like crap. Does that sound right to anyone else? The oil pump is the Melling 10296. Does anyone know what color o-ring i need to get to replace the one that's in there? Is this a pretty good oil pump?
As the car warmed up and got hot the oil pressure slowly dropped. Once at 20psi it begins to tick once the rpms are up in the 2300 range. I have to get my rpms up to there on a light throttle in order for it to move due to the stall. Once it reaches those RPM's on a hot engine and oil it starts to tick like a lifter tick. Shut the car off and let it cool for 10mins an start it again it is gone and will not come back till the temp increases.
Whenever engine is cold no noise at higher rpms and good oil pressure. Engine hot at higher rpms oil pressure is low and starts the tick. I bought a mechanical gauge and havent hooked it up yet. The factory gauge seems to be very accurate when cold....no jump in the needle, reads 60+ psi, smooth and as the engine gets warmer it starts to show something going on with the pressure.
Seems like a typical pickup tube o-ring issue and the oil pressure being so low is causing the lifter not to pump up and makes it sound and run like crap. Does that sound right to anyone else? The oil pump is the Melling 10296. Does anyone know what color o-ring i need to get to replace the one that's in there? Is this a pretty good oil pump?
03-11-2014, 03:16 PM
#40
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Ordered a new oring for the pump from ballistic speed should be here soon. Hopefully it will solve the problem. Also i used the rollmaster double and melling pump and had no issues with timing cover. Anyone else get that lucky?